Total newbie question about amp and speakers.

[gareth886]

Hi all, I hope everyone has had a good new year and are starting to see the booking rolling back in after the January slump.

I have a few questions to run by this forum full of experts and hope someone can help me or give advice. I have recently been given some equipment by the family of local DJ who passed away and I suspect/know the equipment is quite old.

The speakers are 300W Carlsboro speakers powered by what seems like an old MXF 400 amp. The sound quality out of the speakers are very good though, with the exception of the lack of stereo sound. Obviously stereo sound is fairly vital in any decent setup so I was wondering would a new amp sort out the lack of stereo?

It may also be worth mentioning that the cables that plug into the speakers directly from the amp are the round XLR cables (I assume this isn't standard anymore). Can anyone offer any advice? What are my options? Should I just forget about the whole lot and just buy new speakers and amp?

Hope this makes sense, as mentioned in the thread title, I'm a newbie when it comes to the technical side of things.

[Danieleastwood.com]

Gareth, Hi and welcome.

Ideally, you should have posted this in the tech section of the site, but as you're new, I'm sure everyone will let you off this once. lol

To answer to your stereo question, We are going to need a little more info from you...
Can I ask if each speaker is being fed seperately? Ie, a cable from one output on the amp to one speaker and a cable from the other output on the amp to the other speaker?

Do you have two cables also running into the ampl from your mixer?

And finally.. Is there a mono button on the mixer that might be pressed in?

Hopefully, be able to set you on the right path once we know about those things.

Dan

[DeckstarDeluxe]

Do you have any pictures of the equipment in question?

I used some carlsboro speakers once and i felt that they lacked any punch.

[gareth886]

Hey guys. Thanks for the warm welcome.

Each speaker is being fed separately, with a separate cable from each output to each speaker. I have a stereo phono cable like the one in this picture (http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop_image/product/c75a462c0bff2c816e03f88458a5a5ea.jpg) running to the input of the amp, with the Left and Right jacks plugged into the mixer.

There isn't any mono option on the mixer, just a left and right channel dial that I can fade from left to right (only the left channel seems to function though because when I fade to the right the sound fades altogether.

@deckstardeluxe. I'll try and upload some images of the equipment for you.

Hope this helps.

Edit: Here's a picture of the back of the amp (http://img33.picoodle.com/img/img33/3/2/9/f_DSC00006m_e707b28.jpg)

And a picture of one of the speakers. (http://img02.picoodle.com/img/img02/3/2/9/f_DSC00009m_45dd3f4.jpg)

Apologies for the image quality, it was taken with my phone. I'll try and get better pictures if need be.

[DazzyD]

The stereo jack (I'm assuming it's a standard 6.3mm jack plug) should be feeding your amp with a stereo signal. However, I'm wondering if that's only a mono jack socket as your amp input (hard to tell with just the hole visible!). If that's the case, it'll be taking (if I remember right) the left channel only. As you have 2 RCA plugs feeding the stereo jack then you don't have a mono input but rather one channel of a stereo input. What you really need is your 2 RCA connectors to a mono jack.

As for the amp, without knowing the tech spec it is hard to tell what it is putting out. Although it's got two outputs, which would make you think it's stereo, it could well be putting a single mono signal out to two speakers. Like you say, it looks like a pretty old piece of kit so could well be a mono amp.

Don't worry about the XLR connections on the speakers. I have a pair of speakers that use this type of connection and I use with with speakon to jack cabling with a jack to XLR adaptor on the end with no problems at all.

[gareth886]

That seems to make sense. Thanks for the help so far.

I'll purchase a 2 RCA to Mono jack to see if that will help with the Left/Right channel thing in the short term although ultimately I think its time to invest in a new amp for some true stereo then and see how the speakers hold up.

Have you any suggestions/recommendations on an amp that will comfortably power 2 X 300W speakers?

[Tony Scott]

That seems to make sense. Thanks for the help so far.

I'll purchase a 2 RCA to Mono jack to see if that will help with the Left/Right channel thing in the short term although ultimately I think its time to invest in a new amp for some true stereo then and see how the speakers hold up.

Have you any suggestions/recommendations on an amp that will comfortably power 2 X 300W speakers?

Great amp for the money, rock solid: http://www.thomann.de/gb/tamp_ta1050ii_endstufe.htm

[gareth886]

Nice one, looks like a good price too. Powerful enough for 300W speakers? I assume it will provided me with Stereo too?

This forum is priceless. Thanks for all the sensible advice guys.

[Tony Scott]

Nice one, looks like a good price too. Powerful enough for 300W speakers? I assume it will provided me with Stereo too?

This forum is priceless. Thanks for all the sensible advice guys.

Yeah...stereo (2 channels at 350w per channel at 8ohm) perfect for those cabs you have there...3 yr warranty too!

[gareth886]

Cheers, I'm going to order that amp tomorrow then. Is that site the best site to use? Also, where would be the best place to get the right cabling to match this amp up with my cabs?

[gareth886]

Morning all.

I've just purchased the amp that was recommended by Tony Scott and have just been having a closer look at the output sockets on the amp which are speakon. My problem is that the sockets on the back of the speakers are XLR.

How is it going to be possible to connect the speakers to the amp?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Morning all.

I've just purchased the amp that was recommended by Tony Scott and have just been having a closer look at the output sockets on the amp which are speakon. My problem is that the sockets on the back of the speakers are XLR.

How is it going to be possible to connect the speakers to the amp?

Speakon to XLR leads are fairly commonplace.

Make sure you get the correct XLR though (male or female)http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/DJ-Speaker-Lead-(10M)_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQimsfpZTL090202114001r3424Q QimsxZ20090202QQitemZ190283835190QQsalenotsupporte d

[gareth886]

Great, thanks.

One more thing, the amp that I ordered has an "In A", "In B" and an "Out A" and "Out B". To power both the speakers, do I need to plug them into "Out A" and "Out B" and does that mean that the feed from my mixer will have to feed into both the "In A" and "In B" sockets?

I appreciate all the help on this so far because I am totally lost when it comes to the setup.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Great, thanks.

One more thing, the amp that I ordered has an "In A", "In B" and an "Out A" and "Out B". To power both the speakers, do I need to plug them into "Out A" and "Out B" and does that mean that the feed from my mixer will have to feed into both the "In A" and "In B" sockets?



Sounds correct to me.

[Tom]

Think it as A would be left channel and B would be the right channel.

Also, as you are using xlr connections to power your speakers, if you don't already, I would say make sure you have high power xlr connections and cable also.

I know Studiospares sell these leads ready made and the price is not to bad either.

[gareth886]

Excellent, I currently use a connection like this (http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/shop_image/product/c75a462c0bff2c816e03f88458a5a5ea.jpg) to connect the mixer to the amp. What sort of cable should I be looking for to connect the mixer to the new amp (http://img26.picoodle.com/img/img26/3/2/10/f_ampbackm_f31fe1d.jpg) in order to achieve stereo sound?

Tom: Is this (http://www.studiospares.com/Leads-Speaker/Speakon-XLRfe-10M/invt/580310) the sort of High power XLR connection you were talking about?

This all may seem so basic to a lot of you on here but I'm still working my way through a maze of confusion.

[Tom]

What mixer are you using???

As for the cable, that would be perfect for your needs. :)



Everyone has to start somewhere. :). Some of us know quite a lot about certain things (i know nothing at all (lol)), but I'm sure you will pick things up soon. Once you learn the basics then your off. :D

[gareth886]

I'm using a Gemini BPM-250 Stereo Preamp Mixer. I've found a guide for it here (http://www.geminidj.com/disc._prod_manuals/OUTBOARDS/BPM-250/BPM-250%20e.pdf). The inputs/outputs on the back are standard phono L and R inputs.

Hope this helps.

[TonyB]

I have a T-Amp 1050 - good amp. Done a side by side comparison with two other amps I have of about the same power and I liked the T-Amp most :)

You will need a stereo phono to 2 x 1/4" (or 6.3mm) jacks (also known as TR jacks) cable such as http://www.audiospares.com/product.php?productid=467&cat=3&page=10

[gareth886]

Perfect. Thanks for all the help. I think I now know what I need to buy to get everything up and running. I'll let you all know how it goes when everything arrives.

Thanks again.

[DazzyD]

Not quite sure what Tom means by high power cable but I would recommend the use of Oxygen-Free Copper (OFC) cabling. It's a lot more expensive (and delicate) than regular cabling but there's a lot less resistance as the signal passes through it making for better quality sound.

[Tom]

Dazzy D - what I mean is speaker cable instead of using a standard microphone lead. Should of said that instead really. Lol.

You can get high current xlr connections which are made for sending from an amp to speaker. I believe this was before speakon came out?


Also as for speaker cable, if its delicate then is it any good on the road?

If it was me I would go for branded cable. Not to sure what size to go for. Either 2.5mm or 4mm. I think 2.5mm core would be better suited to your needs I think.

[501damian501]

what sort of carlsbro speakers are them, what type of gigs do you plan to do, are these speakers good enough for what you intend to use them for, do they have 12 inch or 15inch drivers, what do you mean by 300 is it watts or rms ?

12inch speakers coupled with subs makes a decent sound system

but i prefer to go with 15inch speakers and couple them up with subs for the bigger type gigs.

these are all things to consider when using or buying speakers, cheers damian

p.s also theirs other threads on here plus a sticky on how to match your speakers to an ampilfier.

[gareth886]

I'm not sure what size the drivers are, what the easiest way of telling?

The speakers are 300W. The gigs are mostly reasonably small, around 100 people.

[Tom]

Get a tape measure and measure the driver from one side to the other in inches. :)

[gareth886]

They seem to be 12 inch then.

[gareth886]

bump.

I just received my new T-Amp TA1050 this morning and was eager to try it out with my speakers but had no joy.

I connected everything up for stereo setup and powered on the amp and increased the gain on both channels. I could see the green lights on the front panel flickering as if it was receiving an input but no sound at all was being produced from the speakers. I know it can't be the Speakon to XLR cables because I'd imagine that it would be unlikely that both the cables are faulty.

I have checked and double checked the connections from the amp to the mixer and can't see any problems. I've noticed when I switch the amp off the two red faulty lights glow. I assume this isn't normal when you power the amp off? The faulty lights disappear though when you power the amp back on.

Does anyone have any suggestions?

[501damian501]

What about the master volume on the mixer ?

What about the cross fader on the mixer ?

What channel is the cross fader asigned too ?

[gareth886]

Yep, checked all of the above but still nothing. To double check that it wasn't the speakers or the mixers I plugged in my old amp and got sound no problem.

I seems that the new amp isn't sending any power to the speakers. Normally when I turn on my old amp the speakers would give a quick pop/buzz letting my know that there was power going to them. This new amp doesn't do anything at all.

Seems like its faulty then? Does anyone else that has a T.amp know if its normal for the 2 red fault lights to remain lit when you switch the amp off?

[TonyB]

I have the same T-Amp and yes the red protection lights do come on for a short while when the amp is turned off.

Only thing I can think of is that the speaker cables are not wired up correctly. The speakons should be wired to pins 1 & 2. What the xlr cables should be wired to depends on what pins have been used by the speaker manufacturer. Can you open up the old and new XLR connectors to see which pins are connected?

[gareth886]

I've opened up both the old and new XLR connections. The old cable that I use with the old amp has the following:
Red cable soldered to Pin 3
Blue cable soldered to Pin 2
Bare (copper colloured wire) soldered to pin 1.

The new speakon to XLR cable has the following:
Black cable soldered to Pin 1
Red soldered to Pin 2
Nothing soldered to Pin 3

Any advice from here would be much appreciated.

[TonyB]

It looks as though the old cables are using pins 2 & 3 for the speaker connections so you need to change the new ones so that red goes to pin 3 and black goes to pin 2.

You should be able to test the theory if you can bridge pins 1 and 3 together with a screw driver or something but be very careful not to short out pins 1 and 2.

[gareth886]

Seems to make sense. Looks like I'll need to get hold of a soldering iron though. If I try to test the theory by bridging 1 and 3 together wouldn't that still be wrong as the red cable is currently attached to pin 2?

Thanks for the help.

[TonyB]

Depends! Pin 2 should be red as it is the "+" pin but it wasn't before. Thinking a bit more, probably best to leave Pin 2 as red as it would probably be wired wrong both ends. If you get the wires the wrong way round, it will just mean that the speaker will be out of phase. Will be fine on its own but if used with other speakers that are connected the right way around, there will be some cancellation. So as long as the two speakers are wired the same it shouldn't be a problem.

As they are oldish speakers the sockets could be wired up anyway. The only way to know for sure would be to open up the speaker and follow through the wiring from the speaker to the socket. If you can it may be worth having a look at how the XLR socket is wired up in the speaker in case any of the pins are already bridged as it could cause a short if you change the wiring on the plug.

[gareth886]

Ok, I just opened the speakers to check the connections on them. The red wire is attached to the + on the speakers and is then attached (bridged) to pins 2 and 3 on the XLR connector. The black wire from the speaker is then attached to pin 1 on the XLR connector.

Surely this means that the new cable wiring is correct (red attached to pin 2 and black to pin 1)? Which doesn't explain why the speakers aren't getting power from the amp.

[gareth886]

Ahh. This is driving me crazy. I have no idea why its not working.

[gareth886]

I've probably just made the stupidest of schoolboy errors. When checking the connections on the back of the amp I twisted the speakon cable and it clicked into place. Hey presto, I now have sound output. I had no idea that these cables twist clicked into place as I've never used these types of cables before. I'm such a noob.

Thanks for all your help guys. I'm now feeling slightly stupid and embarrassed.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I've probably just made the stupidest of schoolboy errors. When checking the connections on the back of the amp I twisted the speakon cable and it clicked into place. Hey presto, I now have sound output. I had no idea that these cables twist clicked into place as I've never used these types of cables before. I'm such a noob.

Thanks for all your help guys. I'm now feeling slightly stupid and embarrassed.

It happens to the best of us!

We all make mistakes - infact my 14 year old nephew did the very same thing 2 weeks ago. (which actually probably won't make you feel any better!)

Anyway, I'm sure we're all glad it's sorted. :beer1:

[Excalibur]

I've probably just made the stupidest of schoolboy errors. When checking the connections on the back of the amp I twisted the speakon cable and it clicked into place. Hey presto, I now have sound output. I had no idea that these cables twist clicked into place as I've never used these types of cables before. I'm such a noob.

Thanks for all your help guys. I'm now feeling slightly stupid and embarrassed.

Don't sweat it mate. The first time I used a Speakon system, I fitted the plugs no probs, but couldn't get the blighters out! :eek: :eek: Fortunately, a punter showed me how. :o :o :o :o :o :o :o

[Jiggles]

Don't sweat it mate. The first time I used a Speakon system, I fitted the plugs no probs, but couldn't get the blighters out! :eek: :eek: Fortunately, a punter showed me how. :o :o :o :o :o :o :o

Amature :D

[Excalibur]

Amature :D

Bog off . :p

[gareth886]

Thanks again for all your help. You are a great bunch of forumites. You'll probably see me floating around here quite often from now on. No doubt I'll probably be providing more questions than answers but I'll help out where I can.

[Excalibur]

Thanks again for all your help. You are a great bunch of forumites. You'll probably see me floating around here quite often from now on. No doubt I'll probably be providing more questions than answers but I'll help out where I can.

We know a song about that, don't we? :D
Ask away mate, you'll get the chance to give an informed answer to a question about something, guaranteed. :D

[TonyB]

Glad you got it sorted. Feel a bit guilty getting you to take the connectors and speakers to bits but at least it eliminated a possible problem.