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View Full Version : For sale items and ebay links



Spirits High
20-07-2009, 10:56 PM
Following on from the couple of threads about the "For Sale" section and linking to ebay We (admin /mods) have decided to let you decide :eek:

Please cast your vote in the poll

Options are:

No linking to ebay

Link to ebay only allowed after the post has been on for 7 days

Not bothered at all

andyw
21-07-2009, 04:47 AM
i put not bothered, i think out of curtessy people should give it a chance on here first, but i also believe they should pay a donation to the site for the privilage, but at the end of the day if i want the item i would buy it off them whether it is through here or ebay, and really it should be upto admin and mods to decide because they will have to police it and that will mean more work for them and more aggro for them in doing so.

Vectis
21-07-2009, 06:49 AM
I recognise eBay to be the predominant "elsewhere" but there are plenty of pedants on this forum :p

I think a 7 day rule is fair; obviously difficult to enforce as you can't expect the mods to look up every sale on every other potential sales route especially as user account names may well be different. So it's not so much a rule as a guideline or code of conduct.

Steve the DJ
21-07-2009, 07:28 AM
I think it is entirely up to the individual how they choose to sell a product and any restrictions on using eBay should I wish to do so will stop me from offering items for sale here.

This just seems to me like people think as a member of this forum I owe you in some way to offer you a better deal on anything I might want to sell. Well, newsflash for you, I don't.

I want to sell things for the best return and if I am restricted from doing so here then you won't get to see what I have to offer.

Shame really, I have a garage full of great stuff... :D

Vectis
21-07-2009, 07:38 AM
I think it is entirely up to the individual how they choose to sell a product

I agree with that totally.

But personally I disagree with using this forum's for sale section to simply post a link to an eBay auction - using it as a free classified ad if you like. I've no problem with someone putting up a listing, describing the product, suggesting a price and then adding "oh by the way, it's also on eBay and here's the link..."

rob1963
21-07-2009, 07:48 AM
Sorry, but I think the linking to ebay option when the ad has been listed for 7 days is complete toilet. How would it be enforced & how would it work in reality?

After the 7 days you'd either need to pm the link to a mod or admin who would then need to find your listing, check your listing had been active for 7 days & amend it to include the link, or you could post a second listing including the link - in which case all listings would appear twice, once with a link & once without one.

Isn't the 10 minute editing rule wonderful?

:shrug:

Steve the DJ
21-07-2009, 08:18 AM
But personally I disagree with using this forum's for sale section to simply post a link to an eBay auction - using it as a free classified ad if you like.

Isn't that a benefit of being a member?

There are already rules in place about how much input you must have before you can place an ad, why then put more obstacles in the way?

After all, whilst I am sure most of the members are honest folk, in reality what protection does anyone have when buying or selling via a forum like this? None.

So what is wrong with trying to add a degree of protection to your sale whilst offering it to the widest audience?



I've no problem with someone putting up a listing, describing the product, suggesting a price and then adding "oh by the way, it's also on eBay and here's the link..."

To be fair I think most people do post the majority of items as available directly firstly then put them on eBay after a little while if they don't sell.

I am starting to think this is a "problem" that exists only in a few peoples heads... :run:

Shaun
21-07-2009, 10:41 AM
After the 7 days you'd either need to pm the link to a mod or admin who would then need to find your listing, check your listing had been active for 7 days & amend it to include the link, or you could post a second listing including the link - in which case all listings would appear twice, once with a link & once without one.



:shrug:

Not so. All members would need to do is add an additional post (with the link) to their currently active 'For Sale' thread. There would be no need to contact a mod to edit and no need to make a duplicate topic.




------------------------------------------

For the record...

It's not been decided if this will be implemented, Daz and myself aren't to fussed either way. Several members have indicated recently and in the past that there should be some restrictions in posting ebay links. On this occasion we thought we'd let you all self regulate with regards to the outcome of this. If there is enough interest in the proposal then it's something we'll consider.

It's generating healthy debate for the moment and I can appreciate both sides of the argument. We'll just see how the discussion progresses.

Pe7e
21-07-2009, 10:50 AM
To be fair I think most people do post the majority of items as available directly firstly then put them on eBay after a little while if they don't sell.

I am starting to think this is a "problem" that exists only in a few peoples heads... :run:

I must say I totally agree with that, I can't see any benefit to the members of the forum that will be gained by placing any extra restrictions on listing items for sale, only extra work for the mods. If I was looking for a quick sale, and was forced to choose between eBay or the forum, eBay would win every time and forum members (who may well be looking for what I have on sale) would miss out on the opportunity of a sensibly priced item, where's the benefit in that? At the moment I would want to know if a member had a 'martin detonator' for sale, weather it's on eBay or not, is of no consequence, it's the price/condition that actually matter, not how I get to hear about it. Personally I don't think there is a problem, and introducing unnecessary restrictions will be an own goal.

Shaun
21-07-2009, 11:03 AM
To be fair I think most people do post the majority of items as available directly firstly then put them on eBay after a little while if they don't sell.



To be honest I haven't really paid that much attention, so what you're saying might be true.

Who knows, maybe now that this discussion has been raised by the members, future sellers might take peoples views into consideration with regards to adding ebay links in their initial 'for sale' posts. This discussion instead of new rules might be all that is needed?

Larry B Entertainment
21-07-2009, 11:20 AM
I went for "Not bothered"

TBO if I want to buy anything I go straight to ebay first. You get ebays Dispute centre aswell if anything goes wrong with the sale.

Dynamic Entertainment
21-07-2009, 11:29 AM
I think it is entirely up to the individual how they choose to sell a product and any restrictions on using eBay should I wish to do so will stop me from offering items for sale here.

This just seems to me like people think as a member of this forum I owe you in some way to offer you a better deal on anything I might want to sell. Well, newsflash for you, I don't.

I want to sell things for the best return and if I am restricted from doing so here then you won't get to see what I have to offer.

Shame really, I have a garage full of great stuff... :D

The original idea was put forward (by me) Steve because there has been alot of links to ebay for "Buy It Now" items. Do you not agree that if you can get a sale on here, without paying ebay a listing fee or commision for the same amount as the "Buy it now" its worth it.

Granted if you just want to place it in an auction and see what it goes for then all the best with it. But why miss up on the oppotunity to not pay ebay if you have a price in mind?

It wasnt a "problem" in my head, just a suggestion so that people can get the best possible price. If you sell something for 1000 on ebay, you dont get the whole grand. Sell it on here and its yours to keep. :)

Yes you have the dispute centre on ebay, but we have rules in place and ive never had a issue selling or buying on here before.

Steve the DJ
21-07-2009, 11:50 AM
Do you not agree that if you can get a sale on here, without paying ebay a listing fee or commision for the same amount as the "Buy it now" its worth it.

In theory yes, but most people with any sense go for a lightly higher "Buy It Now" figure to cover the eBay and PayPal costs.



Granted if you just want to place it in an auction and see what it goes for then all the best with it. But why miss up on the oppotunity to not pay ebay if you have a price in mind?

As I said from where I am sitting it appears to me that most people do offer it here first then resort to eBay if it doesn't sell.



Yes you have the dispute centre on ebay, but we have rules in place and ive never had a issue selling or buying on here before.

I have been conned before, albeit on another forum, it does happen and cost me over 100.

Dynamic Entertainment
21-07-2009, 12:06 PM
I have been conned before, albeit on another forum, it does happen and cost me over 100.

So you have good reason to be a bit apprehensive. Thats fair enough then. :)

Steve the DJ
21-07-2009, 12:31 PM
So you have good reason to be a bit apprehensive. Thats fair enough then. :)

I'm a bit more cautious now sure but I still usually offer things on the forums first before resorting to eBay, and naturally the extra costs will be reflected in my target price.

I just don't understand all the fuss about how people choose to offer items for sale. :shrug:

Surely it should be as simple as sellers offer items as they see fit and buyers can choose what they are or are not interested in for whatever reason suits them?

Seems to have worked OK for centuries to me... :approve:

rob1963
21-07-2009, 12:40 PM
Not so. All members would need to do is add an additional post (with the link) to their currently active 'For Sale' thread. There would be no need to contact a mod to edit and no need to make a duplicate topic.

In that case, if the "link allowed after 7 days" rule was brought in, the first post in the thread would just list the item foir sale & the asking price.

A week later, you're saying the OP could do another post in the same thread giving the ebay link.

Therefore, people would see all the details in the first post of the thread, but would then have to scroll down through a week's worth of replies to get to the new post containing the link.

Surely it would make more sense to have the link inserted into the first post after the 7 days had elapsed?


The original idea was put forward (by me) Steve because there has been alot of links to ebay for "Buy It Now" items. Do you not agree that if you can get a sale on here, without paying ebay a listing fee or commision for the same amount as the "Buy it now" its worth it.

I fully appreciate that.

Having read the thread, I now feel there should be one simple rule: either links are allowed at any time, or they are not.

The 7 day rule is complicated, and the situation of scrolling through the replies looking for the link is not ideal.

While we're on the subject, I also think adverts in the "for sale" section should only be available to supporters. After all, at the moment non-supporters can gain by selling their items completely free of charge. Why shouldn't they give a little something back to assist with the forum's running costs?

tc1ooo
21-07-2009, 03:19 PM
I must say I totally agree with that, I can't see any benefit to the members of the forum that will be gained by placing any extra restrictions on listing items for sale, only extra work for the mods. If I was looking for a quick sale, and was forced to choose between eBay or the forum, eBay would win every time and forum members (who may well be looking for what I have on sale) would miss out on the opportunity of a sensibly priced item, where's the benefit in that? At the moment I would want to know if a member had a 'martin detonator' for sale, weather it's on eBay or not, is of no consequence, it's the price/condition that actually matter, not how I get to hear about it. Personally I don't think there is a problem, and introducing unnecessary restrictions will be an own goal.

Agreed. I think buyers and sellers will lose out if ebay links are not allowed.

Shaun
21-07-2009, 03:34 PM
A week later, you're saying the OP could do another post in the same thread giving the ebay link.

Therefore, people would see all the details in the first post of the thread, but would then have to scroll down through a week's worth of replies to get to the new post containing the link.

Surely it would make more sense to have the link inserted into the first post after the 7 days had elapsed?


The 7 day rule is complicated, and the situation of scrolling through the replies looking for the link is not ideal.



LOL, oh dear! If people are interested in the item for sale, I wouldn't imagine it's too much trouble for them to read the whole thread to find the link (if applicable). If that's too much trouble for them then I fear online forums are not the best place for them to spend their time.





While we're on the subject, I also think adverts in the "for sale" section should only be available to supporters. After all, at the moment non-supporters can gain by selling their items completely free of charge. Why shouldn't they give a little something back to assist with the forum's running costs?

To be honest, I hate the idea of 'nickel & diming' our members for functions on the forum. As it stands, the supporters contributions are completely voluntary, and I'm not too keen on removing any of the main forum sections to non contributors.

andyw
21-07-2009, 04:20 PM
I fully appreciate that.

Having read the thread, I now feel there should be one simple rule: either links are allowed at any time, or they are not.

The 7 day rule is complicated, and the situation of scrolling through the replies looking for the link is not ideal.

While we're on the subject, I also think adverts in the "for sale" section should only be available to supporters. After all, at the moment non-supporters can gain by selling their items completely free of charge. Why shouldn't they give a little something back to assist with the forum's running costs?


can't see anything complicated in it rob ,as i said earlier i am not bothered, if i am interested in something i will look if not it is easy to click the mouse and move on, if your worried about finding the link and this this does get adopted then maybe when the link is put up the thread gets closed and the link will always be at the end of the thread. as i say it don't bother me buying directly off someone through here or through ebay because they pay for the fees not me, the only thing that annoys's me is when items get put up with no price or guide:)

rob1963
21-07-2009, 04:28 PM
LOL, oh dear! If people are interested in the item for sale, I wouldn't imagine it's too much trouble for them to read the whole thread to find the link (if applicable). If that's too much trouble for them then I fear online forums are not the best place for them to spend their time.


I didn't say it WAS too much trouble to scroll through the thread to find the link...merely that it would be BETTER if the link appeared in the first post of the thread.


To be honest, I hate the idea of 'nickel & diming' our members for functions on the forum. As it stands, the supporters contributions are completely voluntary, and I'm not too keen on removing any of the main forum sections to non contributors.

That's fair enough.

It's no skin of my nose, as I only pay 1 a month to the forum & many people pay nothing at all...but I know the forum owners have to pay a lot more than that to keep it going.

However, If they are happy to carry on funding the forum & don't mind people selling stuff without making any contribution, that's fine!

Solitaire Events Ltd
21-07-2009, 04:31 PM
Contribution doesn't always have to be in the form of cash Rob. ;)

rob1963
21-07-2009, 04:57 PM
Contribution doesn't always have to be in the form of cash Rob. ;)

Yes, but it was the financial side of things I was thinking about.

Come to think of it, on the non-financial side I probably contribute more than many!

:D :D :D

Shaun
21-07-2009, 07:36 PM
I probably contribute more than many!

:D :D :D

Quantity doesn't equal quality. So I'd have to disagree. ;)

rob1963
21-07-2009, 11:37 PM
Quantity doesn't equal quality. So I'd have to disagree. ;)

Not always.....but it CAN do, though! ;)

Jiggles
21-07-2009, 11:53 PM
18,000 post of pure crap. 66 posts of something a bit useful. 1 post helpful. :sj:

Shaun
21-07-2009, 11:54 PM
66 posts of something a bit useful. 1 post helpful. :sj:

That many? That's what I like about you Callum, you always see the good in people. :D

Jiggles
21-07-2009, 11:59 PM
I was trying to be nice(ish) :D I was going to say 100 but decided against it. :sj:

Vectis
22-07-2009, 07:06 AM
18,000 post of pure crap. 66 posts of something a bit useful. 1 post helpful. :sj:


I was trying to be nice(ish) :D I was going to say 100 but decided against it. :sj:

Oh - it was conjecture! That's a shame... I thought you had some magical algorithm for working out the percentage of useful posts as the numbers seemed surprisingly accurate ;)

Go on then, what's mine? :D

Excalibur
22-07-2009, 08:20 AM
Contribution doesn't always have to be in the form of cash Rob. ;)
Rob's hilarious humour, and witty banter often make this a delightful place to be. ;) ( Believe that, and you can knit fog, )

Come to think of it, on the non-financial side I probably contribute more than many!



18,000 post of pure crap. 66 posts of something a bit useful. 1 post helpful. :sj:

As many as that? :eek:

OK, serious hat on, I think it's impolite to simply post a link to an item already on Ebay just to get extra interest. Maybe that's just me. :confused:

I have had many happy dealings with forum members, and would always prefer to go that way first rather than ebay. If you're worried about not getting the price you seek, well post it on here at the figure you wish to receive. If you don't get it, then ebay it. Simple?

A certain member who shall remain nameless offered me first dibs on an item at a price I regarded as extortionate, and I told him so. :p Twerp had obviously done his homework, cos it sold for exactly that on ebay. :D One happy Yellowbelly, one embarrassed Yorkie.

As for paying to use the section, well I can see it might cause extra work, would one way be to introduce a Tier system of payments, one price for membership, another separate fixed monthly one for the sale section?

My two pennorth, now can we discuss the 10 minute rule? :sofa: :sofa:

Jiggles
22-07-2009, 11:19 AM
Oh - it was conjecture! That's a shame... I thought you had some magical algorithm for working out the percentage of useful posts as the numbers seemed surprisingly accurate ;)

Go on then, what's mine? :D

If I did I would be rich I think! :D

rob1963
22-07-2009, 12:09 PM
If you're worried about not getting the price you seek, well post it on here at the figure you wish to receive. If you don't get it, then ebay it. Simple?

Or do what I do, reduce the price here first, and ebay it if that doesn't work.


now can we discuss the 10 minute rule? :sofa: :sofa:

According to the powers that be, no!

:shrug:

Excalibur
22-07-2009, 05:42 PM
Or do what I do, reduce the price here first, and ebay it if that doesn't work.

Ah, but that flies in the face of getting the best possible price, a creed dear to the hearts of some on here. ;) As a financial person renowned for being loath with his wealth, I'd have expected you to want to get as big a return as possible. Sometimes Rob you surprise me! :eek:

( For those of you who haven't realised i'm taking the mickey as expected, I agree entirely with Rob )




According to the powers that be, no!

:shrug:

Rob, I'm as cheesed with it as you are, but I happily accept that our discomfort is far outweighed by the benefits to the forum and mods in general. I regard it as a necessary evil, since I don't have all the facts needed to make an objective decision. Greater good and all that. ;) Hey ho. :D

Shaun
22-07-2009, 06:27 PM
I'm going to have the final say on the 10 minute rule, and any future moans/discussions/rants about it will be deleted. We've already explained why it's necessary, but people keep feeling the need to bring it up, so I'll repeat myself yet again...

The rule was introduced after certain members "threw their toys out the pram" for whatever reasons they had. They backtracked through every one of their posts and used the edit button to delete the content from every one of their posts. As a result of that action, the topics didn't make sense and were impossible to follow. This resulted in a lot of threads having to be completely removed.

Having to remove the threads due to a couple of morons being selfish is disrespectful to the members that had taken the time to post within those topics, so as a precaution against this happening again (it's happened 3 times now I think) we took the decision to put a limit on the amount of time a member may edit their posts. When posting new post members have the ability to PREVIEW before posting. In addition they have 10 minutes to edit out any mistakes that they may have missed when previewing the post. I think this is more than fair consider the alternatives we've had to face in the past with morons deleting the content of all their posts. Should any member need a post editing after the 10 minutes have past then contact a moderator. We've already mentiond that we do not mind helping anyone out in this manner.

The 10 minute rule has been mentioned on a few occasions in members posts. May I remind you all that the rules are not up for discussion or debate. Now please let it drop.

Back on topic please. :)

Shaun
22-07-2009, 06:51 PM
May I remind you all that the rules are not up for discussion or debate.

....except of course the one that's up for discussion in this poll. :d

Excalibur
22-07-2009, 08:36 PM
The 10 minute rule has been mentioned on a few occasions in members posts. May I remind you all that the rules are not up for discussion or debate. Now please let it drop.

Back on topic please. :)

Rob and I , as the main offenders in this will I'm sure consider our knuckles severely rapped. :o :o :o :( :( :(

Message received and understood. ;) :D

JDB Entertainment
22-07-2009, 09:06 PM
I think if people are putting links to ebay listings that it shouldn't be just a link, but also contain a description of what it is and also a picture if possible.

To be honest I feel all for sale threads should contain a detailed description on the item, a price and also a picture.

It takes a matter of minutes to upload a picture to a free hosting site and would give potential buyers a chance to look at the item and if a picture is not possible maybe a link to one on a "dj shop" site.

James

DeckstarDeluxe
23-07-2009, 12:02 AM
Personally I think people should be allowed to wack stuff on ebay. I usually offer up things on here first myself because i rather the equipment go to someone who cares and does their job in a suitable manner rather than some sid

Shaun
23-07-2009, 01:06 PM
Rob and I , as the main offenders in this will I'm sure consider our knuckles severely rapped. :o :o :o :( :( :(

Message received and understood. ;) :D

Not a problem, Peter. It just gets a little bit irksome when we do things that is to benefit everyone, and people shoot it down in flames as it inconveniences them a little. It comes across as a little selfish (not directed at you BTW ;)).

I appreciate your post. Hopefully I didn't hurt your knuckles too much. :) :D

rob1963
23-07-2009, 11:54 PM
It looks like the ebay link after the post has been live for 7 days is the most popular suggestion, and presumably the one which will prevail.

Vectis
24-07-2009, 07:13 AM
It looks like the ebay link after the post has been live for 7 days is the most popular suggestion, and presumably the one which will prevail.

I'd suggest this was deemed Best Practice rather than a rule though? Otherwise that'd be a nightmare for the mods?

rob1963
24-07-2009, 07:23 AM
I'd suggest this was deemed Best Practice rather than a rule though? Otherwise that'd be a nightmare for the mods?

I guess we'll just have to wait from an announcement from the powers that be.

:shrug:

Shaun
24-07-2009, 12:50 PM
I'd suggest this was deemed Best Practice rather than a rule though? Otherwise that'd be a nightmare for the mods?

I've been thinking along the same lines. Not because of the extra workload, we've got more than enough moderators to cope. Mainly because this isn't an essential rule. I think a small list of 'best practice' guidelines may suffice for the time being, and we can review it at a later date if we feel something more concrete needs to be put in place?

I'm just thinking out loud for now. Keep the input coming folks and hopefully we can come to a an arrangement that everyone will be happy with. :beer1: