QSC K 10 Small Beautiful & Loud

[TONYTIGER]

Found myself in a stupid situation at the weekend as i was so busy hiring out gear that i had nothing left in the PA department to cover my own job (down to old age going senile ) so i had to raid the new stock only thing i had was a pair of QSC K 10 still in there boxes.
Now i had heard these at Plasa but only the K12 with matching Sub i was impressed with the tops subs were just ok so i was a bit nervous going off to cover a job with just a pair of 10" cabs but had no choice.
After arriving at venue quite large i decided to put them on a pair of Ultimate Gas lift stands to get them up high about 2.5m the K10 has a facility to angle the cabs so they tilt down 7.5 deg really clever you just twist the socket on the bottom of the cab by hand there is also a switch on the cab to boost the bass called deep.
Ready to switch on, wow im gobsmacked this is the best sounding plastic cab i have ever heard so smooth and the bass from a 10" is amazing and so loud so much from such a small box and only 14kgs other nice touches locking iec in also inputs for mic with a vocal lift swicc and a pair of phonos so you can plug in a mp3 player or such like.
Over the years i have owned plenty of powered cabs of this ilke RCF ,DB,JBLand this K series blows them all away needless to say they are now another addition to kit.

[Andy Goodtimes]

I have a pair and also the double 12 matching bins. TBH I prefer the RCF ART710s. I think the Ks are excellent but just not quite got the power and throw of the RCFs.

[WWDJ]

I have a pair and also the double 12 matching bins. TBH I prefer the RCF ART710s. I think the Ks are excellent but just not quite got the power and throw of the RCFs.

Interesting. I'm definitely going to get some 10s this year.

How usable are they on their own for gigs up to about 80 people? All sorts of music, but mainly chart, dance, commercial rnb and pop.

cheers

[Andy Goodtimes]

That's really up to you, there are folk that wouldn't use either of them on their own and those that would. I use the 710s with the little 902 bins but TBH the bins take less foot print than the stands do and they aren't that heavy either. If I got caught out I would use them on their own but not from choice...but like I say that's my personal take on things, I like to be able to feel the bass.

[TONYTIGER]

I have a pair and also the double 12 matching bins. TBH I prefer the RCF ART710s. I think the Ks are excellent but just not quite got the power and throw of the RCFs.

The RCF ART 710s are great little speakers but have a different dispersion pattern than the K10s hence your comments re throw.

Its quite interesting as up to this year the RCF was our best seller re 10" powered cabs,but i was up at Absolute Music talking to Andy there top sound guy who are RCF & QSC stockist and move a huge amount of gear,he was telling me the K series has outsold the RCF by 4 to 1 they have a dedicated sound room for the customer to try gear and it would seem the K10 is much sweeter and has a fuller sound than the RCF.
What sold the K10 for me was the range of options on the back panel and the tilt on the pole mount as i like to get them high and direct the sound on to the dance floor which cuts out all the reflective surfaces in boxy rooms.
As i said only used these on there own for that gig re transport issues but they did cope well.
Sound is very personal and as you know my preferred choice at the moment is the Nexo system hey but who knows in the future always searching for the holy grail.:)

[MikeW]

I am also looking at possibly buying new speakers next year and the QSC range looks very good. Most people seem to go for the K10. I would be looking to buy the speakers first and then in a few months going for a QSC bass bin.
I normally play to between 150 and 200 people in small to medium size rooms, and I was wondering if the K10s on their own would cope with this. Or should I go for the K12.
I will also want us them in larger venues, when required.

Anyone got any thoughts on this.

Thanks in advance.

Mike.

[WWDJ]

I'd be looking to stick them in situations where I would currently use a set of Mackie SRM450 V1s or Warrior PSR15a's. I am leaning towards RCF purely because I already have an ART705AS sub, but it is big and heavy so I would only want to use this for larger 100+ gigs.

For up to 100 people maybe I would be looking to use the 10s on their own. I do quite a lot of small parties and shorter teen parties where it is good if I can setup and carry the equipment in easily without my backbreaking PSR15A's (30kg each!)

Am I really asking too much and would I be selling the customer short ?

[Andy Goodtimes]

I have bought most of my sound equipment from Absolute and find them excellent and keen on price. I understand what you are saying Tony re the sound, I do tend to go for a bit more lively sound than most though...i.e I went from a PM90 mixer straight to a DJM3000 and actualy prefer the sound.

As for buying 10s and then adding a bin later...I personally would go for the 12s or save some more and get the 10s and the bin at the same time. My favourite 12s are the RCF ART322s, they have a 2inch horn but its not too harsh.

[TONYTIGER]

I am also looking at possibly buying new speakers next year and the QSC range looks very good. Most people seem to go for the K10. I would be looking to buy the speakers first and then in a few months going for a QSC bass bin.
I normally play to between 150 and 200 people in small to medium size rooms, and I was wondering if the K10s on their own would cope with this. Or should I go for the K12.
I will also want us them in larger venues, when required.

Anyone got any thoughts on this.

Thanks in advance.

Mike.
Hi Mike,hope you had a good Christmas as for the K series the 10 is the nicest sound if you can get them up nice and high they will cope quite easy with 200 people what you wont get is trouser flapping bass saying that they have a deep switch that adds extra bass but it is more of a clean hi fi sound.
great for weddings but no good for a Drum & Bass gig.

If your thinking of getting the QSC sub or a pair then the 10 is the best to go with it ,the QSC subs are ok but you can use any active sub with the K 10s and the RCF are better in my opinion.

As for the K12 not as sweet but more bottom end so cope better if not buying a sub.

[MikeW]

Hi Mike,hope you had a good Christmas as for the K series the 10 is the nicest sound if you can get them up nice and high they will cope quite easy with 200 people what you wont get is trouser flapping bass saying that they have a deep switch that adds extra bass but it is more of a clean hi fi sound.
great for weddings but no good for a Drum & Bass gig.

If your thinking of getting the QSC sub or a pair then the 10 is the best to go with it ,the QSC subs are ok but you can use any active sub with the K 10s and the RCF are better in my opinion.

As for the K12 not as sweet but more bottom end so cope better if not buying a sub.

Thanks for the info Tony. The problem I have is that I am not sure how soon I would be buying the subs after buying the tops, it could be possibly up to a year after that and I would would want to know that what I was buying could cope with all events. That is why I was thinking possibly the K12s??
Decisions Decisions, but it's all good fun :)

[Dynamic Entertainment]

I'd be looking to stick them in situations where I would currently use a set of Mackie SRM450 V1s or Warrior PSR15a's. I am leaning towards RCF purely because I already have an ART705AS sub, but it is big and heavy so I would only want to use this for larger 100+ gigs.

For up to 100 people maybe I would be looking to use the 10s on their own. I do quite a lot of small parties and shorter teen parties where it is good if I can setup and carry the equipment in easily without my backbreaking PSR15A's (30kg each!)

Am I really asking too much and would I be selling the customer short ?

Go for the RCF ART312A then. they are 12" and will cope easily with upto 100 people as long as you dont want thumping bass. The best thing about them, is that they are better suited when you do use the sub...

[WWDJ]

I've heard great things about the 312as..

However I think what I am looking for is the best balanced / bass respomnse sound I can get out of a set of 10s ideally or 12s

I use the sub now with my srm450s and I don't notice any problems with 'matching'. Most of the problems I get are with positioning with certainb parts of the room being boomy.

I'm happy to mix brands if I can lose the sub on the <100 people gigs

Gonn have to have a listen ...

[leelive]

I am also looking at possibly buying new speakers next year and the QSC range looks very good. Most people seem to go for the K10. I would be looking to buy the speakers first and then in a few months going for a QSC bass bin.
I normally play to between 150 and 200 people in small to medium size rooms, and I was wondering if the K10s on their own would cope with this. Or should I go for the K12.
I will also want us them in larger venues, when required.

Anyone got any thoughts on this.

Thanks in advance.

Mike.

I bought the K12s and Ksubs just 2 months ago. I previously had SRM450v2s now they are used as back-up.

If you are planning on using the subs all the time then go with the K10s as they can be used with longer poles. Quilter Sound Corp don't recommend using a longer pole with the K12s for safety reasons! I have had no choice. The factory issue pole has the sound hitting the middle of peoples chests. They seriously need to be head height or above.

pics have been posted recently on this forum.. . search for QSC. You'll see the height diff of the new poles in the later pics.

Lee

[sweetie]

I've heard great things about the 312as..

However I think what I am looking for is the best balanced / bass respomnse sound I can get out of a set of 10s ideally or 12s

I use the sub now with my srm450s and I don't notice any problems with 'matching'. Most of the problems I get are with positioning with certainb parts of the room being boomy.

I'm happy to mix brands if I can lose the sub on the <100 people gigs

Gonn have to have a listen ...

i regularly use the k12s on their own and once played to about 160 people without a sub, as there were some power issues, and they coped admirably

[Dynamic Entertainment]

I've heard great things about the 312as..

However I think what I am looking for is the best balanced / bass respomnse sound I can get out of a set of 10s ideally or 12s

I use the sub now with my srm450s and I don't notice any problems with 'matching'. Most of the problems I get are with positioning with certainb parts of the room being boomy.

I'm happy to mix brands if I can lose the sub on the <100 people gigs

Gonn have to have a listen ...

If your ever this far North West then your free to have a listen. You wont be dissapointed ;)

[NKR]

QSC amp on my system. Yep its good. If it has QSC on it it is going to sound the nuts.

[MikeW]

I bought the K12s and Ksubs just 2 months ago. I previously had SRM450v2s now they are used as back-up.

If you are planning on using the subs all the time then go with the K10s as they can be used with longer poles. Quilter Sound Corp don't recommend using a longer pole with the K12s for safety reasons! I have had no choice. The factory issue pole has the sound hitting the middle of peoples chests. They seriously need to be head height or above.

pics have been posted recently on this forum.. . search for QSC. You'll see the height diff of the new poles in the later pics.

Lee

Thanks for that Lee, I will do a search. It sounds (pun intended:))as though the K12s might be the better option for my situation.

Mike.

[TONYTIGER]

I bought the K12s and Ksubs just 2 months ago. I previously had SRM450v2s now they are used as back-up.

If you are planning on using the subs all the time then go with the K10s as they can be used with longer poles. Quilter Sound Corp don't recommend using a longer pole with the K12s for safety reasons! I have had no choice. The factory issue pole has the sound hitting the middle of peoples chests. They seriously need to be head height or above.

pics have been posted recently on this forum.. . search for QSC. You'll see the height diff of the new poles in the later pics.

Lee

Your dead right there Lee if you have the QSC subs then the right match is the K10s as the subs have such a small footprint they get very top heavy also the 10s suit the subs sound wise and thats always the combination we sell.
Just a idea you could contact Mike he buys some K10s and you do a swap could work out for booth of you.

[deltic]

when i bought the k'12's i was torn as the 10's have a wider dispertion and to me sounded tighter than the 12's,but i will say i am not dissapointed with the 12's at all.

a lot of the work the 12's do is weddings and corporate stuff averaging 150 people,and the 12's cope easily,quality not quantity.

[TONYTIGER]

when i bought the k'12's i was torn as the 10's have a wider dispertion and to me sounded tighter than the 12's,but i will say i am not dissapointed with the 12's at all.

a lot of the work the 12's do is weddings and corporate stuff averaging 150 people,and the 12's cope easily,quality not quantity.

Yes spot on thats why i went for the 10s just sound a bit nicer and as you said 90 deg pattern.

[deltic]

Yes spot on thats why i went for the 10s just sound a bit nicer and as you said 90 deg pattern.

was a tough decision,was very tempted to buy the 10's as well as the 12's,then fortunately reality kicked in.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I'm looking at both the K10 and K12 at the moment - anyone got any more opinions on either.

As previously mentioned, I am trying to downsize for smaller gigs.

[musicologydisco]

I'm a huge Fan of QSC. I use the 12" HPR122i which are now discontinued. Absolutely superb!

[funkymook]

I'm looking at both the K10 and K12 at the moment - anyone got any more opinions on either.

As previously mentioned, I am trying to downsize for smaller gigs.

I use a pair of RCF Art 310a's on their own for small gigs (kids parties, wine bars, 20-40 people, small jazzy easy listening type do's) - and they've always coped, obviously it's always going to be a compromise on bass, but they do sound good taking that into consideration.

I was thinking of getting the K10's a while ago as I thought they would be a major upgrade to my RCF's - but the PA Centre said, for the money involved against the difference I'd gain, I was better off keeping the 310's. (they lost a sale as I was ready to buy, but really appreciated their honest advice).

Your more than welcome to hear them if there's a venue nearby we can use.

Though I haven't heard them myself, I have heard people say good things about the DB Technology's Opera 410D's as well.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I use a pair of RCF Art 310a's on their own for small gigs (kids parties, wine bars, 20-40 people, small jazzy easy listening type do's) - and they've always coped, obviously it's always going to be a compromise on bass, but they do sound good taking that into consideration.

I was thinking of getting the K10's a while ago as I thought they would be a major upgrade to my RCF's - but the PA Centre said, for the money involved against the difference I'd gain, I was better off keeping the 310's. (they lost a sale as I was ready to buy, but really appreciated their honest advice).

Your more than welcome to hear them if there's a venue nearby we can use.

Though I haven't heard them myself, I have heard people say good things about the DB Technology's Opera 410D's as well.

See I've heard a completely different POV from someone else who said that the K10s coped with over 100 people without a problem and they are very bassy. :daft:

[sweetie]

Darren, I run the K12s (with the option of a hpr15i sub) and have oftenused the tops alone with crowds of 150 (in suitable sized room) without any issues. On one occasion in a bigger room the sub was tripping the power so I did without and they coped admirably. Both models have a 'deep' switch to give a bit more bass and the k12s are a nice carry at 18kg (I think.) The K10 doesn't go quite as loud but are viewed as a better sounding speaker generally. I think they are the best affordable active speaaker range that give value for money, quality sound, good size and spl.

[WWDJ]

Darren, I run the K12s (with the option of a hpr15i sub) and have oftenused the tops alone with crowds of 150 (in suitable sized room) without any issues. On one occasion in a bigger room the sub was tripping the power so I did without and they coped admirably. Both models have a 'deep' switch to give a bit more bass and the k12s are a nice carry at 18kg (I think.) The K10 doesn't go quite as loud but are viewed as a better sounding speaker generally. I think they are the best affordable active speaaker range that give value for money, quality sound, good size and spl.

I guess the ART710A would be the other contender. I am looking to downsize this year, but to be honest I value all round good non distorted sound over absolute volume.

.... after all, i've been asked to turn it down a whole lot more times than i've been asked to turn it up! (can't think I've ever been asked to turn it up!)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Darren, I run the K12s (with the option of a hpr15i sub) and have oftenused the tops alone with crowds of 150 (in suitable sized room) without any issues. On one occasion in a bigger room the sub was tripping the power so I did without and they coped admirably. Both models have a 'deep' switch to give a bit more bass and the k12s are a nice carry at 18kg (I think.) The K10 doesn't go quite as loud but are viewed as a better sounding speaker generally. I think they are the best affordable active speaaker range that give value for money, quality sound, good size and spl.

I like the idea of the K10 as it's the whole weight issue I am trying to address. Weight Vs sound and efficiency really.

I mainly use the RCF 325A and am fairly happy with the sound and they are incredibly loud, but they are a 15" cabinet and although not massively heavy (23Kg), I would still love to have something as loud and nice sounding, but less weight.

[funkymook]

See I've heard a completely different POV from someone else who said that the K10s coped with over 100 people without a problem and they are very bassy. :daft:

There's no getting away from hearing for yourself in a real situation is there!

I suppose the criteria I explained to him was quite specific in the type of event and number of people - so the extra ooomph from the K10's wouldn't be needed above what the 310's could handle (well not to the tune of £1300 anyway) - if I had asked about a different scenario he may well have thought they were worth it for me.

Damn - got me thinking about them again now though!

[sweetie]

I like the idea of the K10 as it's the whole weight issue I am trying to address. Weight Vs sound and efficiency really.

I mainly use the RCF 325A and am fairly happy with the sound and they are incredibly loud, but they are a 15" cabinet and although not massively heavy (23Kg), I would still love to have something as loud and nice sounding, but less weight.

I don't think you would be disappointed with the k10s f you buy them from where I think you might. I imagine the spec is similar (K10 is 131db) and obviously the sound is a personal thing but they (in my opinion) look nicer than the RCF cabs too. Have you got somewhere to take a listen?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I don't think you would be disappointed with the k10s f you buy them from where I think you might. I imagine the spec is similar (K10 is 131db) and obviously the sound is a personal thing but they (in my opinion) look nicer than the RCF cabs too. Have you got somewhere to take a listen?

I heard them both when Clive (CR Services) demo'd them at SEDA last year and I remember being very impressed with the sound and the weight, but I can't remember which was better - the 10s or the 12s!

[WWDJ]

I like the idea of the K10 as it's the whole weight issue I am trying to address. Weight Vs sound and efficiency really.

I mainly use the RCF 325A and am fairly happy with the sound and they are incredibly loud, but they are a 15" cabinet and although not massively heavy (23Kg), I would still love to have something as loud and nice sounding, but less weight.

You buy them Darren and tell me if you like them. I'm more than happy to go with a recommendation ;-)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

You buy them Darren and tell me if you like them. I'm more than happy to go with a recommendation ;-)

Yes.....I have noticed you say that a few times before. :lol:

[sweetie]

I went with the K12s as they seemed more suitable to use without a sub and most of my gigs here in Ireland tend to be after a band and space is at a premium for a sub at times. From what I have read and researched the k10 is the nicer sounding (and lighter) speaker.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I went with the K12s as they seemed more suitable to use without a sub and most of my gigs here in Ireland tend to be after a band and space is at a premium for a sub at times. From what I have read and researched the k10 is the nicer sounding (and lighter) speaker.

These are going to be used without a sub too -I am keeping the RCF for bigger gigs.

I did read that a review from someone who said that he tried both the 10 and the 12 and couldn't tell them apart as far as loudness goes, but the 10 sounded a little better.

The 8 and the 10 have wider dispersion too I understand.

[MikeW]

I have heard the K10s twice now, and both times, the guy in the shop was saying that the K10s were a better sound and also that he sold more 10s than 12s.

[TONYTIGER]

I have heard the K10s twice now, and both times, the guy in the shop was saying that the K10s were a better sound and also that he sold more 10s than 12s.

Spot on Mike the 10s are sweeter and better dispersion pattern ,i am using mine more and more lately and not bothering to take the Nexo rig unless its a large crown.

[WWDJ]

Spot on Mike the 10s are sweeter and better dispersion pattern ,i am using mine more and more lately and not bothering to take the Nexo rig unless its a large crown.

Do you use subs and if so, what size crowd would you consider not using subs?

[TONYTIGER]

Do you use subs and if so, what size crowd would you consider not using subs?

No subs with the K10s just get them high and use the tilt ,up to 150 quite easy.
Ideal for weddings and such like .

[MikeW]

No subs with the K10s just get them high and use the tilt ,up to 150 quite easy.
Ideal for weddings and such like .

I am still giving this a lot of thought at the moment, hopefully will change sound system in the next six months or so.

Do you think I would see a big difference between the K10s and my Mackies, or would I need to add a bin or two as well?

[TONYTIGER]

I am still giving this a lot of thought at the moment, hopefully will change sound system in the next six months or so.

Do you think I would see a big difference between the K10s and my Mackies, or would I need to add a bin or two as well?

All i can say is the K10s are very impressive and do have a lot of bass for there size and IMHO are the best small format powered cab out there its all down to the type of jobs you do but i find they are fine for everything other than dance events,do you need thumping base for weddings and general parties.
I used to run RCF 325A and the K10s are a much sweeter sound and are sort of a very defined hi fi sound which i think the public prefer + the tilt and bass boost are nice touches.Better than the Mackies yes.
If you are going to add subs im not to keen on the matching QSC subs as they struggle to keep up with the K10s and they dont go low enough in my opinion and if you use the K12s they are a bit top heavy for the matching subs and you have to use quite a short pole.
If you are trying to downsize and want a small active to cope with most jobs these would be my choice.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I used to run RCF 325A and the K10s are a much sweeter sound and are sort of a very defined hi fi sound which i think the public prefer + the tilt and bass boost are nice touches.Better than the Mackies yes.


So you'd say the K10s are a better cab than the 325A?

Are they as loud?

[MikeW]

All i can say is the K10s are very impressive and do have a lot of bass for there size and IMHO are the best small format powered cab out there its all down to the type of jobs you do but i find they are fine for everything other than dance events,do you need thumping base for weddings and general parties.
I used to run RCF 325A and the K10s are a much sweeter sound and are sort of a very defined hi fi sound which i think the public prefer + the tilt and bass boost are nice touches.Better than the Mackies yes.
If you are going to add subs im not to keen on the matching QSC subs as they struggle to keep up with the K10s and they dont go low enough in my opinion and if you use the K12s they are a bit top heavy for the matching subs and you have to use quite a short pole.
If you are trying to downsize and want a small active to cope with most jobs these would be my choice.

Thanks for that Tony. Actually, I am trying to upsize (if that is a word):)

My budget in approx six months will be round about £1200 to £1500, and for that I would like to hear a big difference in sound. I need a system that I can possibly add bins to if the venue required it ie Marquee weddings/larger function rooms. (I would use the Mackies as back up).

Thanks again

[TONYTIGER]

So you'd say the K10s are a better cab than the 325A?

Are they as loud?

Certainly as loud but a more refined sound than the RCF much more detail and akin to a hi fi sound as posted.
The 325A has a longer throw,but a bit harsh if you are up close due to the 2" exit driver great for band work which i except they were designed for.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Certainly as loud but a more refined sound than the RCF much more detail and akin to a hi fi sound as posted.
The 325A has a longer throw,but a bit harsh if you are up close due to the 2" exit driver great for band work which i except they were designed for.

I am keeping the 325As anyway, but to be honest, most of the venues I work in are under 150 people, so I really want something lighter.

How are the K10s for vocal/mic work?

[leelive]

I have had my K12s and KSubs for a few months now and I am very happy with them. I would say go for the K12s as the bass on them when used on their own is super. Far better than the SRM450s. You do have to get longer poles for them though (not recommended by manufacturer), but I have had no issues as have only lifted them 1foot.
Lee

[TONYTIGER]

I am keeping the 325As anyway, but to be honest, most of the venues I work in are under 150 people, so I really want something lighter.

How are the K10s for vocal/mic work?

They have a switch on the back to switch from line to mic for vocal so you can use them stand alone and put a mic straight in to the cab,and they are spot on going through the normal mixer set up.

In my opinion they will be perfect for what you are trying to achieve ,as thats why i bought a pair,for those type of jobs.

And of course you can get them at trade price from you know were.;)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

They have a switch on the back to switch from line to mic for vocal so you can use them stand alone and put a mic straight in to the cab,and they are spot on going through the normal mixer set up.

In my opinion they will be perfect for what you are trying to achieve ,as thats why i bought a pair,for those type of jobs.

And of course you can get them at trade price from you know were.;)

Thank you for you opinion and help Tony. :)

[Make A Note Disco]

Guys/Gals,

I can say the K10s are defintely sweeter than the 12s which is why we bought a pair as well as a K sub. However, we are now winding down and will be selling these as well as some other stuff so look out in the sale section in the next few weeks. We have the QSC speaker covers with them also.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Guys/Gals,

I can say the K10s are defintely sweeter than the 12s which is why we bought a pair as well as a K sub. However, we are now winding down and will be selling these as well as some other stuff so look out in the sale section in the next few weeks. We have the QSC speaker covers with them also.

What kind of condition are they in and do you have any pictures?

[Make A Note Disco]

What kind of condition are they in and do you have any pictures?

they are in good condition, we only have had them for a year. I will get pics up over the coming weeks so just keep a look out in the sale section

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

they are in good condition, we only have had them for a year. I will get pics up over the coming weeks so just keep a look out in the sale section

Have you any kind of time scale as I am looking to buy sooner than later.

[Make A Note Disco]

Have you any kind of time scale as I am looking to buy sooner than later.

let me see what i can do tomorrow - you seem genuine so am willing to make the effort. As far as cost goes I need to chat to my Business partner to agree on a selling price. Oh and we want to sell the lot together (ie with the sub also)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

let me see what i can do tomorrow - you seem genuine so am willing to make the effort. As far as cost goes I need to chat to my Business partner to agree on a selling price. Oh and we want to sell the lot together (ie with the sub also)

OK, I'll let you speak to your partner, but I don't require the sub though. Let's see what price you come up with and I could maybe sell the sub on.