sound produced in a tent...

[salford1986]

hello

Got my self a wedding tomorrow in a teapee tent :D went down yesturday to have a look at where il be situated.

I havent got a clue how the sound will be, is it like a normal function room where it will bounce off walls or is it going to be worse?

how am i best to set my speakers up, have them just past head height and pointing to the back of the teapee. the tent can have up to 200 quests

[TonyB]

Personally I find that it sounds just as loud in marquee/outside as it does inside. If your speakers output 100db inside then they will do the same outside.

First marquee gig I done I used a bands set up which was a pair of full range Carlsbro 15" (Gamma's I think) and it was fine. Since then I have done a lot of outside/marquee gigs and just use the same set up that I use indoors and its always been plenty loud enough.

If anything you have to be more considerate about volume levels as the sound is more likely to travel further and disturb nearby residents.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Personally I find that it sounds just as loud in marquee/outside as it does inside. If your speakers output 100db inside then they will do the same outside.



I totally disagree. The sound has nothing to bounce off and just disappears in my experience. Inside it has walls and ceilings to bounce off so surely it's going to be louder?

[funkymook]

It's amazing how far the sound will travel - at one outside party we had complaints from over 1/2 mile away, though it didn't sound very loud nearby.

I advise the local council's noise noise nuisance people if I'm in a marquee and give them the start and end times and my mobile number.

It works both ways - if they know the party is going to end at midnight they can advise any complainers that it's not something they need to act on as it's going to end at midnight (unless it's stupidly loud of course) - but if it's going on later and they get complaints they can give me a quick call and I can adjust the volume while they're in contact with the complainer. They're happy because it saves them a site visit and they much prefer to work with you than against you.

Saying I do this actually got me a booking once as the clients were worried about getting a 'noise license' until I explained there wasn't such a thing and what I usually do to minimise potential problems.

[TonyB]

The highs and mid range waves are going to drop off quite a bit by the time they reach any walls so there shouldn't be a great difference there.

Bass waves are the most likely to bounce off the walls but they can also also be absorbed by soft furnishings (carpets, curtains etc) and possibly get some cancellation if thy bounce about indoors.

Law of physics says you can't get something from nothing. If your speakers output 100db (hypothetical figure) they will do so where ever they are used. They won't be magically louder inside.

Before doing any marquee gigs I was worried that my set up wouldn't cope outside after reading posts saying that you need extra power/bass bins but personally have never fount it to be the case. In front of the speakers I find it just as loud outside as inside. It may sound quieter behind them because there is no wall behind you.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Well we'll agree to disagree then Tony. I have always found that a bigger system is needed outside as the sound doesn't bounce off anything.

Tell me this then, if you put a speaker inside a garage and put it on full gain, why does it sound louder than if you had it outside?

(Don't get too technical!!)

[CRAZY K]

hello

Got my self a wedding tomorrow in a teapee tent :D went down yesturday to have a look at where il be situated.

I havent got a clue how the sound will be, is it like a normal function room where it will bounce off walls or is it going to be worse?

how am i best to set my speakers up, have them just past head height and pointing to the back of the teapee. the tent can have up to 200 quests

Difficult one this--you dont say what speakers or power and if any subs.

I think subs would be needed for 200 in a Marquee.

I am doing one of these in the Summer(in a Tepee for 200)

My first one as well.;) yee-ha!

My set up might be Peavey UL15s on top powered by 500 watts a side rms powered mixer.

Bottom might be the Peavey Subs powered by a KAM KXR 600 ( previously owned by Martin at Vectis:D )

Enough bass but not too much to annoy the possible neighbours.

That should give sufficient power and tonal range to do the job irrespective of bounce and any other sound problems.

I think you have to point the speakers to the back of the Tepee as you suggest.

As Tony says neighbour complaints might be the biggest problem as sound carries so well at night:daft:

All I have to do is to work out how to link everything up on my set up :rolleyes:

---expect a phone call Yorkshire.;)

[JTRS]

I'm watching this thread with great interest, I've got a wedding in a marquee at the end of the month (first one in a marquee so I was wondering about how not having solid walls might affect the sound level)

JTRS

[Corabar Entertainment]

Found a couple of articles the other week, which I found a very easy read, and which might have some relevance here:-

Horizontal Loudspeaker Pattern in PA Systems (http://www.astralsound.com/horizontal_pattern.htm)

Vertical Loudspeaker Pattern in PA Systems (http://www.astralsound.com/vertical_pattern.htm)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Found a couple of articles the other week, which I found a very easy read, and which might have some relevance here:-

Horizontal Loudspeaker Pattern in PA Systems (http://www.astralsound.com/horizontal_pattern.htm)

Vertical Loudspeaker Pattern in PA Systems (http://www.astralsound.com/vertical_pattern.htm)

That's very interesting and does sort of tally up with what I was saying in that if there isn't a wall then sound won't cover as far. (I think) :D

[CRAZY K]

but if it's going on later and they get complaints they can give me a quick call and I can adjust the volume while they're in contact with the complainer.


Very proactive--good idea.

That could be an interesting call on the night--maybe text would be easier with the Disco thumping away--

Council Text --- please adjust your settings to-----bass down to 9 oclock--middle 11 oclock--treble 12 oclock;) main gain down 30 per cent.

Will reconfirm in 5 minutes.

Council text---complainer says --cant you put some :Censored: Abba on and get rid of all that RnB

Otherwise use an i pod and a pair of home hi fi speakers.

The mind boggles.

[Corabar Entertainment]

That's very interesting and does sort of tally up with what I was saying in that if there isn't a wall then sound won't cover as far. (I think) :D
Well, not so much 'as far' as getting double-bubble where it bounces back (ie, if nothing stops it, then it will keep travelling)

Glad you found it interesting. I actually enjoyed reading that myself, and I usually can't be bothered with all the techie stuff. I think it's well-written to make it accessible for us less-techie-minded plebs :D

[Corabar Entertainment]

It's amazing how far the sound will travel - at one outside party we had complaints from over 1/2 mile away, though it didn't sound very loud nearby.

I advise the local council's noise noise nuisance people if I'm in a marquee and give them the start and end times and my mobile number.

It works both ways - if they know the party is going to end at midnight they can advise any complainers that it's not something they need to act on as it's going to end at midnight (unless it's stupidly loud of course) - but if it's going on later and they get complaints they can give me a quick call and I can adjust the volume while they're in contact with the complainer. They're happy because it saves them a site visit and they much prefer to work with you than against you.

Saying I do this actually got me a booking once as the clients were worried about getting a 'noise license' until I explained there wasn't such a thing and what I usually do to minimise potential problems.That is a good idea, and not one I'd thought of at all.

:thumbsup:

[WWDJ]

This is interesting.

I have a marquee wedding next weekend, 150 guests and mostly dance music has been requested.

Looking at google earth, they are about a mile from the nearest house and there are trees surrounding the courtyard area where the disco is.

But ... i am going to take the precaution of dropping the sound levels down a bit after 11pm which is the cut-off for neighbour disturbances.

[Kernow]

There's some info here
http://www.forum.mobilediscodirectory.co.uk/showthread.php?t=32814&highlight=Wigwam
& http://www.forum.mobilediscodirectory.co.uk/showthread.php?t=34922&highlight=teepee :)

[CRAZY K]

This is interesting.

I have a marquee wedding next weekend, 150 guests and mostly dance music has been requested.

Looking at google earth, they are about a mile from the nearest house and there are trees surrounding the courtyard area where the disco is.

But ... i am going to take the precaution of dropping the sound levels down a bit after 11pm which is the cut-off for neighbour disturbances.

I think theres a very strong chance the local Neighbourhood complaints will be be headed your way well before 11oclock if your playing loud dance Music.

Thats my experience anyway --and thats just doing Barn Dancing---well maybe it was the Red Hot Chili Peppers session that annoyed them:daft:

As I said talk to the Venue--before they talk to you.

Being proactive is usually a good idea.

[salford1986]

I'm taking my mcgregor mytek 210's 600 watts per side i do find they have loads of base...loads lol I'm just gonna watch my base levels turn the right down at 11

[Corabar Steve]

Thats my experience anyway --and thats just doing Barn Dancing---well maybe it was the Red Hot Chili Peppers session that annoyed them
Why would anyone want to complain about one of the biggest bands on the planet? The amount of "records" they sell & the size venues that they play (Knebworth this July) there must be more folks that like them than don't.

[CRAZY K]

Why would anyone want to complain about one of the biggest bands on the planet? The amount of "records" they sell & the size venues that they play (Knebworth this July) there must be more folks that like them than don't.

Not big in Towcester apparently.

Never heard of em probably:daft:

[WWDJ]

I think theres a very strong chance the local Neighbourhood complaints will be be headed your way well before 11oclock if your playing loud dance Music.

Thats my experience anyway --and thats just doing Barn Dancing---well maybe it was the Red Hot Chili Peppers session that annoyed them:daft:

As I said talk to the Venue--before they talk to you.

Being proactive is usually a good idea.

I have contacted the client and mentioned that we don't want a visit from the local bobby. It seems they have had a 21st there a while back with no complaints. I just need to be sensible and aim music right onto the dancefloor so it is loud enough for people to dance.

[TonyB]

Well we'll agree to disagree then Tony. I have always found that a bigger system is needed outside as the sound doesn't bounce off anything.

Tell me this then, if you put a speaker inside a garage and put it on full gain, why does it sound louder than if you had it outside?

(Don't get too technical!!)

Its all in the mind! You've convinced yourself that it will be quieter outside so thats how you hear it LOL . Its more likely that inside is more insulated from ambient sounds so you just hear the output from the speakers. Outside their is more ambient sound although you don't really notice it but it comes from distant traffic, wind, birds tweeting, neighbours etc.

I find I play at exactly the same levels with the same equipment inside that I do outside. I have a limiter that is set to cut in at the max level I want to play at and the limiter lights just begin to flash at the max level so I know its the same.

The pages that Angela link to illustrates that the sound bouncing off the walls can reduce the level as you get further away from the speakers. Outside you don't have that problem.

If you look at the history of WEM website http://www.wemwatkins.co.uk/history.htm scroll down to after 1966 and the amplifier power used for an open air concert for 250,000 people was just 1500w. Even allowing for the efficiency of the speaker design, I would think that most PA systems used for disco's should be able to cope outside with audiences of the average function.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Its all in the mind!

I don't think so.

[JTRS]

The wedding in the marquee was last night, I took my usual speakers and set the volume as I would normally have it set in a function room of that size.

I'm no expert on sound, but what I can say is that it was certainly loud enough, even when I was standing at the back of the marquee.

I'm not disagreeing with those who have posted saying that sound bouncing off walls makes a difference, what I'm saying is that I didn't notice any difference.

Pre-event I was worried that I might need bigger speakers.

Post-event I'm not going to worry about doing a marquee in future

JTRS

[jc light and sound]

I totally disagree. The sound has nothing to bounce off and just disappears in my experience. Inside it has walls and ceilings to bounce off so surely it's going to be louder?

100 % Agree with Darren,i do loads of marquees and have always found this to be the case.

[supersound]

My speakers hang off the truss and point to the dancefloor so it is fairly localised.

[jc light and sound]

Its all in the mind! You've convinced yourself that it will be quieter outside so thats how you hear it LOL . Its more likely that inside is more insulated from ambient sounds so you just hear the output from the speakers. Outside their is more ambient sound although you don't really notice it but it comes from distant traffic, wind, birds tweeting, neighbours etc.

I find I play at exactly the same levels with the same equipment inside that I do outside. I have a limiter that is set to cut in at the max level I want to play at and the limiter lights just begin to flash at the max level so I know its the same.

The pages that Angela link to illustrates that the sound bouncing off the walls can reduce the level as you get further away from the speakers. Outside you don't have that problem.

If you look at the history of WEM website http://www.wemwatkins.co.uk/history.htm scroll down to after 1966 and the amplifier power used for an open air concert for 250,000 people was just 1500w. Even allowing for the efficiency of the speaker design, I would think that most PA systems used for disco's should be able to cope outside with audiences of the average function.

Your right it is all in the mind ,but its nothing to do with convincing yourself its a fact walls offer insulation tent marquees dont, so your 1500 watts inside will be louder than out because there is no insulation to keep it in and so bleeds out through the walls of the marquee.
For instance, i did a marquee for the whole of December last year and ended up supplying sound for nearly all of the bands tributes that turned up because there systems simply couldnt cope with a 500 capacity marquee,a couple tryed and it fell of the stage and that was as far as it travelled with loads of complaints from those in the middle and rear saying they couldnt hear it.
I think the mind bit is people convincing themselves that there small pa will be good to play anywhere sorry after over 20yrs in this game supplying pa systems for virtually any event inc outside sport stadium work for athletics events i can tell you it wont.
With ref to the concert you make in 1966 thats all they had, the tech side of things had not been developed like now,so they knew no different but they do now.:)