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Thread: Few DMX questions....

  1. #11
    Shaun's Avatar
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    Thanks Chris.

  2. #12
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    Ahh now I did a bit of studying I understand this much better

    So DMX programming is not actually programming at all - in the sense of programming when for example I create a website in PHP/MySQL/Javascript or a PC app in C++ ?

    It's more a matter of sending commands in sequence - no for/next loops, conditionals or logic of any sort, yes?

    I had a good look at some of the tutorials and to narrow things down for me, I can see now why using my Skytec DMX controller isn't gonna do the job

    Looking at one particular tutorial:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60p9...k&noredirect=1

    From 19mins 10secs in on the link until about 23 mins, this describes how to create for example a 'figure 8 type motion' on a scanner or moving head

    So what I would like know from users of other software - how do the other softwares (DMXControl, Maqic Q) handle programming of this sort of scene - is it done in pretty much the same (easy to do) sort of way? If not then I think I will go with the MyDMX software even though it is the most expensive option.


    Also something has really got my attention here now - what could be done then, if I were to create 'proper' programs in for example C++ on a PC (or even programming a microcontroller such as the Arduino with a DMX 'shield' which basically means 'a DMX interface' in Arduino talk) with logic/conditional loops/decision making - that could trigger entire sequences of DMX commands sent to the lighting rig based in real time values of incoming data, for example amplitudes of frequencies in either bass (thumps) or treble (hi-hats/cymbles)?

    This thought would suggest to me that entire rig wide (synchonised) sound to light (or sound to motion) type systems operating dozens of lighting effect to create a dynamic light show in unison together should be quite possible to implement. Now I doubt very much I am the first person to think of that, so anyone else on here into this sort of thing to bounce some ideas off?

    Know what? All of a sudden I've just started to get rather fascinated with the possibilities of DMX

    Rich
    Last edited by dicky; 12-03-2015 at 11:21 PM. Reason: extra info

  3. #13
    Shaun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dicky View Post

    From 19mins 10secs in on the link until about 23 mins, this describes how to create for example a 'figure 8 type motion' on a scanner or moving head


    Rich
    Just watched that....that is a pretty cool feature. Apart from having a play about with a PC based software controller that I bought (and subsequently sold) I've only used hardware controllers. To be able to do a circle sweep or figure 8 on any of the hardware controllers I have owned would mean creating a LOT of individual scenes (steps) to create something like that. So much so that the task of doing it would be so long and drawn out it wouldn't be time effective to even contemplate. To be able to do that on the fly as shown in the tutorial has opened my eyes to the flexibility I'm missing out on.

    I really REALLY need to move to a software based system!
    Last edited by Shaun; 12-03-2015 at 11:23 PM.

  4. #14
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    DMX "used" to be a dark art, now it's becoming much more easier to deal with. I can't see how you would ever use for/next looping, logic and so on when it comes to programming fixtures if i'm honest. IF LampState = OFF then SET LampState = ON maybe

    MyDMX 2.0 is a great product, very easy to use, and a great starting point. My own recommendation however is either Chamsys or Avolites Titan One. Avolites is easier on the eye I feel.

    Whilst MyDMX 2.0 is great it doesn't allow "layering" of commands. For example when you are putting your DMX values together they must take into account X/Y, Gobo, Colour and Lamp State. The next command the same and you set the fade time between them.

    With Avolites and Chamsys you can have a set of defined "movements" and then a set of defined "colours" and a set of defined "gobo's". You then just need to make 3 selections...a movement, a colour and a gobo. Don't like the gobo, just choose another and then maybe a different colour...

    All 3 MyDMX/Chamsys/Avolites do make it very easy to create movement patters such as circles, figures of 8 and spirals for example. All 3 also make it easy to introduce "phasing", i.e. having all the moving heads doing the same patterns but with slight time differences between them so you get like a cool wave effect.

    Hope this helps.
    just ian
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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianforest View Post

    With Avolites and Chamsys you can have a set of defined "movements" and then a set of defined "colours" and a set of defined "gobo's". You then just need to make 3 selections...a movement, a colour and a gobo. Don't like the gobo, just choose another and then maybe a different colour...



    Hope this helps.
    Thanks Ian. This sounds exactly the kind of control I'm looking for.

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by ianforest View Post
    All 3 MyDMX/Chamsys/Avolites do make it very easy to create movement patters such as circles, figures of 8 and spirals for example. All 3 also make it easy to introduce "phasing", i.e. having all the moving heads doing the same patterns but with slight time differences between them so you get like a cool wave effect.
    Just to throw another product into the mix (because it's free) Freestyler DMX has mature massively over the 3yrs I've been using it and also has all of the above features, plus the concept of submasters, Cues, overrides, transparent scenes, etc which all allow you to create scenes that control on feature in a fixture and then bring those scenes together to create the final effect.

    I would avoid trying to write your own software to do DMX control, it won't give you anywhere near the same flexibility and control that the "off the shelf" software will. Just imagine what you'd have to do with preprogrammed dedicated hardware if you turned up at a venue and suddenly needed a blue and yellow light show to fit in with the brides theme for the day - and this has happened to me

    Julian
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  7. #17
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    Arrghhh this gets even more complicated to choose

    OK for me I would be intrested to know:

    Without spending hours looking through tutorials of all these programs -

    How the do other softwares mentioned here handle creation of loops or patterns like that figure of 8 type thing - are they more difficult than the MyDMX tutorial I watched or basically similar?

    How easy are they to use so I can set scanners moving, then change gobos or colours on the fly while the movement is still in progress?

    @ianforest
    Regards the ideas I had about conditional DMX programming - I'm not sure I can think of a good example where that could be used but I am sure there must be some..... for example changing direction of scanners on bass beat and selecting random colour/gobo changes on hi beats. That would require some conditional programming I would have thought (not really learned enough yet to be sure)

    It also occurred to me I could display real time oscilloscope waveforms on my lasers? Or even 'draw' working VU meters on the wall? That I would thnk would take a mixture of DMX commands and conditionals plus a bit of extra electronics?


    Rich
    Last edited by dicky; 13-03-2015 at 10:14 AM. Reason: extra info

  8. #18
    Resident Antagonist Benny Smyth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dicky View Post
    How the do other softwares mentioned here handle creation of loops or patterns like that figure of 8 type thing - are they more difficult than the MyDMX tutorial I watched or basically similar?Rich
    Maybe this will help you a bit with MYDMX 2.0:



    Quote Originally Posted by dicky View Post
    How easy are they to use so I can set scanners moving, then change gobos or colours on the fly while the movement is still in progress?
    As far as I am aware, you can't do stuff like that on the fly on computer software. To be fair, you wouldn't want to. You'll build scenes beforehand and will use trigger keys to change the scenes.

    Quote Originally Posted by dicky View Post
    Regards the ideas I had about conditional DMX programming - I'm not sure I can think of a good example where that could be used but I am sure there must be some..... for example changing direction of scanners on bass beat and selecting random colour/gobo changes on hi beats. That would require some conditional programming I would have thought (not really learned enough yet to be sure)
    Best thing to do is put together a list of scenes you'd like. So, for example, I have scenes that I call 'Low', 'Medium' and 'High' to match the different sections of songs. I actually have two of each so if a song changes slightly, but still has a 'medium' feel, I just change it to the second medium. I also have scenes for searchlight, first dance, stutters, strobes, etc.



    That's some of the scenes I have. I'll upload a better idea later that I have when I programmed the full gantry.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by dicky View Post
    How the do other softwares mentioned here handle creation of loops or patterns like that figure of 8 type thing - are they more difficult than the MyDMX tutorial I watched or basically similar?

    How easy are they to use so I can set scanners moving, then change gobos or colours on the fly while the movement is still in progress?
    Rich
    Most software will have some sort of shape generator/fx pre built in so you can then just set you grouping, off sets, speed, size, phasing etc
    This can then be easily changed on the fly in the cue you have made.

    With changing parameters on the fly then yes you could for example have some cue that just change the colour or gobo, you could use palettes to change things on the fly in a busking situation.
    Best to programme movement on one cue and colour on another then you can easily change the the colour of the same thing to keep it fresh.

    Avo and chamsys are very good for this sort of thing, i lean more to chamsys as i use it more often as it works better for me.
    Chamsys do a miniwing for around £700 which has a dmx output and 10 faders and a couple of use full buttons like page, shift and BO.
    This would be ideal for a disco situation as can save you cues to different fader and have physically thing to touch, coupled with a touch screen you laughing. It all depends how keen and far you want to go.
    That said if your on your own the £10 test dongle which works for 5hrs would be even better as you can just use the faders on the screen.


    Quote Originally Posted by dicky View Post
    It also occurred to me I could display real time oscilloscope waveforms on my lasers? Or even 'draw' working VU meters on the wall? That I would thnk would take a mixture of DMX commands and conditionals plus a bit of extra electronics?
    Rich
    I wouldn't recommend doing this via dmx as dmx isn't a suitable control protocol for a laser.
    Dedicated laser control such as beyond, showtime or even the cheap end like quickshow will do this properly.
    Last edited by Chris1984; 13-03-2015 at 11:12 AM.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris1984 View Post
    I wouldn't recommend doing this via dmx as dmx isn't a suitable control protocol for a laser.
    Dedicated laser control such as beyond, showtime or even the cheap end like quickshow will do this properly.
    Thanks. How do these softwares connect and control the lasers if they don't use DMX? My two quad channel lasers (red-green-blue-yellow) only have DMX connectors on them. I use them master-slave normally.

    Rich

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