At what point would you get physical?

[Benny Smyth]

Last night, I had a bit of a situation. It was a great gig overall, but here's what happened:

About an hour into the night, some idiot jumped onto my sub to dance away. What I assume to be his missus was trying to get him down and my roadie rushed over to do the same. I was half way through a mix so I hadn't noticed immediately what was going on but when I did, I dumped the mix, took my headphones off, walked over and shoved him off. He went crashing to the floor and got covered in the contents of his own pint. His (I assume) missus had a look of shock on her face, but he was so drunk that he just didn't understand what happened. I then got on the mic, stopped the music and said straight to him "If you pull that again, I will stop the music completely, pack my stuff away and you can explain to the bride and groom why their wedding day has ended early!"

He was off with his tail between his legs and I never saw him anywhere near the booth again for the rest of the night. From that point, music continued as if nothing had happened.

Now, whether I was right or wrong to just shove the guy off is in the eye of the beholder. In my opinion, he had ample opportunity to get off before I came over (completely bypassing the fact that he shouldn't have gotten on it anyway). But it did make me wonder that even though we never want to be in a situation where we have to protect either ourselves or our kit, but at what point do you consider it reasonable to use proportionate force to do just that?

[Andy P]

You could be up on an assault charge over something that simple but don't let that put you off. Drunks have little respect due to their inhibitions being removed.

I would have helped him down personally and just told him alone in the first instance. But then I take many tablets each day to control my temper lol.

[DeckstarDeluxe]

Annoying as it is and trust me I have zero patience for people's stupidity I think pushing the guy off wasn't the way the go. For example what if he twisted/broke his ankle on impact? got a fair few friends in attendance to back him up.

That in the cold light of a Monday morning is what I'd do, what I would actually do would depend entirely on the night itself however I'd like to think I would just cut the music and tell him to get off the sub.

[DJIanScott]

I have sympathies for both arguments. Like Deckstar above says, there were lots of witnesses who could have testified against you (welcome to America...) in the event of an injury. However, with fair warning he should have gotten down, and doorstaff would use the physical methods once all other avenues had been exhausted, but maybe pushing was a bit extreme!
Personally, I kill the music totally in situations like this.....then and only then, would I resort to smashing their face in if they continued their quest to be Bell End Of The Year!

[Benny Smyth]

From a legal standpoint, I think I'll be fine. I used reasonable and proportionate force to protect my property and no more.

I used to be a Duty Manager in retail, and you get taught a lot about such things when tackling shoplifters and such.

[Andy P]

I spent 5 years front of house in a top Newcastle casino and getting physical with people is still a minefield even when trained and licensed. Its surprising how many celebrities you end up protecting as they mouth off to the public when hassled.

I would still go with hands as the last resort however as if it does escalate I would guess your gonna be outnumbered.

[mattydj50]

I have sympathies for both arguments. Like Deckstar above says, there were lots of witnesses who could have testified against you (welcome to America...) in the event of an injury. However, with fair warning he should have gotten down, and doorstaff would use the physical methods once all other avenues had been exhausted, but maybe pushing was a bit extreme!
Personally, I kill the music totally in situations like this.....then and only then, would I resort to smashing their face in if they continued their quest to be Bell End Of The Year!

Door staff? Quite often at weddings and private functions, especially if the bar is separate from the main function room, there won't be any venue staff in sight and it is highly unlikely to have any security staff.

My phone has speed dial to the Duty Manager's phone so if anything does kick off, I simply press "9" and ring the Duty Manager who, hopefully comes running.

[jonezyr1]

As well as being a DJ I am also licensed in the security industry and as far as the law is concerned ANY member of the public can use force in 3 circumstances. 1) to protect yourself 2) to protect others and finally the 3rd to protect PROPERTY, the force however does need to be proportionate and necessary. In your circumstances i can see your point of view, however, from what you have said The force may well have been proportionate but without asking him yourself to get down and going straight in with force may not have been necessary. Yes two other people had been asking him to get down but you hadn't. Don't get me wrong i don't blame you at all for what you did. What i would recommend to you and others in the same situation in the future is ALWAYS ask them to stop first, but in a firm way. When i was training for my license i was taught something that i will use every time (unless its an immediate threat to life) always ask them first to stop what they are doing, ie will you please get off my speaker. if they ignore or refuse then ask them "is there ANYTHING i can SAY to make you stop what you are doing". if they then ignore or refuse you can justify any force used in court as long as it's proportionate and necessary.

Basically don't just start pushing some one as it can be classed as an assault. Always exhaust your avenues before using force so you have a defence and you are then acting Legally.

[funkymook]

An overreaction I think - you weren’t being physically threatened so it wasn’t self defence.

Stopping the music, drawing attention to him and asking him to get down would’ve had the same result without any danger of retaliation from his mates (if they were so inclined) or him being injured or worse, lesser falls have resulted in fatalities, it doesn’t take much of a knock to the head.

[DazzyD]

To me, the first rule is self preservation. I've got a family to think about and they want to see me return home! When you pushed him, you could have started a large scale rumble with you right in the middle! Gear can be replaced. You can't. You could have also put your roadie in danger if his friends had joined in.

So, that's my point of view. I wouldn't get physical for the purposes of protecting gear. I can look after myself if needs be but I'd use other tactics for situations like this.