Cancellation terms.

[Spirits High]

I thought they might throw up a bit of discussion! I'll do my best to answer your questions.

Interesting - full fee payable from 3 months. Like it.

99% of my work is Weddings. Clients tend to book well in advance (upto 2 years before the wedding has been known). If for example I have a couple cancel a July date in April /May time the chances of rebooking it are slim as most couples looking for Event services will book atleast 3 months before so will not be looking to book at short notice. This what I find and the notice periods work for me.

Question would be - how likely are you to follow through if they would not make payment ? I have never really been in the predicament but always wary of chasing people, especially if it got to court, for fear of negative publicity. Yes, you are in the right, but you know how easily people can be influenced by sob stories on fb etc

I have recently had to use a debt recovery agent when a client cancelled their NYE Wedding (2015) and have gone to Court and got a CCJ against a client. That one ended with the client coming back to me nearly 3 years later and paying it off as they were unable to raise finance without the CCJ being satisfied. Of course you are always a bit wary but I never hide things from clients they have all the info they need when booking.

Just one more point, you can't claim for expenses not incurred either - e.g. fuel costs, equipment wear etc. These have to be deducted off any final fee demand.

I'll take that onboard

If I was a potential customer, I would never sign that. Totally unreasonable in my view.

See the reasoning I use above. I've never had a client say they won't sign due to the cancellation terms.

I tend to agree 3 months is a long time, that being said it depends on your method of advertising and quality of service.

I've got loads of gaps in November this year and I'm starting to think my new nicer website is putting off the last minute types as I'm getting more interest in November 2018 than 2016 at the moment!

As I've said, 3 months works for me and you'll probably find most Wedding venues etc work on a similar time scale

[Excalibur]

2. Any event obviously relying on TICKET SALES where the promoter is an individual and may be a person of straw ( ie cant pay your cancellation fee) upfront non refundable payment of about 60 per cent and if it goes ahead balance on night in cash. This saves a potential bad debt and a load of time wasting.

Also puts off people not confident of shifting tickets which have caused us a lot of problems over the years.

How apposite, Alan. Last night I had two such events cancelled, after being booked for absolutely ages. Slightly different circumstances as I work through a third party pn these, but we have a cancellation fee policy which is mutually acceptable.

The first one is on Saturday, so that's most probably a write off, but I had a request for the date of the second with another regular customer, so that's not too bad.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Interestingly, most of you should not be able to change what you are charging for cancellations.

Why?

Because you are not allowed to make a profit on a cancellation fee. You can cover your expenses, but not make a profit.

The reason I say this is because of a conversation with Trading Standards.

[Imagine]

Interestingly, most of you should not be able to change what you are charging for cancellations.

Why?

Because you are not allowed to make a profit on a cancellation fee. You can cover your expenses, but not make a profit.

The reason I say this is because of a conversation with Trading Standards.

Que?

So are you saying that for example, somebody cancels a £300 gig at the last minute but it's only cost say £25 in admin plus any other costs such as travelling to a client meeting...that's all we're allowed to charge and the actual party fee (i.e. what we would have made had the party gone ahead has to be waived as that's seen as profit?

[Nakatomi]

Que?

So are you saying that for example, somebody cancels a £300 gig at the last minute but it's only cost say £25 in admin plus any other costs such as travelling to a client meeting...that's all we're allowed to charge and the actual party fee (i.e. what we would have made had the party gone ahead has to be waived as that's seen as profit?

I think if it came to blows in court it would be down to what is deemed reasonable and fair. Lost business would be the biggest lump & as Chris has said it's reasonable to have to deduct general expenses not incurred (travel, wear & tear etc) because the booking didn't go ahead.

If this isn't actually the case, are contracts even worth the PDF they're embedded in? Or is it merely just a carrot used to persuade people to forget their own rights as consumers?

[DazzyD]

Interestingly, most of you should not be able to change what you are charging for cancellations.

Why?

Because you are not allowed to make a profit on a cancellation fee. You can cover your expenses, but not make a profit.

The reason I say this is because of a conversation with Trading Standards.

Hmm. I made this statement in the not too distant past and was ridiculed for it! My comments came after discussions on a mostly US-based page whereby it became apparent that charging full fees for cancellations was not acceptable in the US. I'd looked in to it here and, although I couldn't find any info relating directly to DJs, there have been instances of other vendors who have gone to court to enforce their payment in full policies and the cases have been thrown out. The main jist is that you can't charge for any work you haven't actually carried out. It's a strange one because it goes against everything we've been taught about contracts. But the consumer now has more rights - written in legislation - than ever. Which is how I don't understand the penalty charges for long term contracts for say mobile phones. If I cancel my contract a year early, why I am liable for the payments for the remainder of the contract term when, if someone enters in to a contract with me to provide my services, then pulls out prior to the event, they are not liable for those payments they'd originally agreed to? It's a very unusual situation indeed!

I think if it came to blows in court it would be down to what is deemed reasonable and fair. Lost business would be the biggest lump & as Chris has said it's reasonable to have to deduct general expenses not incurred (travel, wear & tear etc) because the booking didn't go ahead.

If this isn't actually the case, are contracts even worth the PDF they're embedded in? Or is it merely just a carrot used to persuade people to forget their own rights as consumers?

Most operators will hope their contract T&Cs are never challenged and the client just pays up!

[Nakatomi]

Here we go.. from our own uk.gov site... https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...426/oft311.pdf

Where cancellation is the fault of the
consumer, the business is entitled to hold back from any refund of
prepayments what is likely to be reasonably needed to cover his net costs
or the net loss of profit resulting directly from the default.18 There is no
entitlement to any sum that could reasonably be saved by, for example,
finding another customer.

[Benny Smyth]

Does anyone offer to refund the client (minus admin fees and such) were another gig to come in for that date?

It's something I do when a cancellation happens.

[ukpartydj]

Does anyone offer to refund the client (minus admin fees and such) were another gig to come in for that date?

It's something I do when a cancellation happens.

I remember reading some terms along those very lines when booking a wedding venue. The thought has never crossed my mind I'll be honest, I've only ever had the one person cancel and need to pay the full amount and they cancelled 2 days before. If it's just the deposit they've paid I wouldn't bother giving them anything back but I think I would give some back if I got another booking somehow.

I must say I find the whole fee minus travel expenses very confusing. I charge the same for a gig down the road as I do for one 50 miles away... Does that mean I cannot charge as much to the further away event because of travel costs? I'd have to pluck figures out of the air for admin and preparation to and it'd likely somehow end up being very near to the full figure anyway if I charged per hour of administration haha!