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Thread: Sub help please

  1. #1

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    Default Sub help please

    Hi folks, I am not the best at understanding watts, ohms, dB etc, so am looking for some advice on getting subs to match my tops. At the moment I have 2 x RCF 715A Mark 2's as my tops. Earlier in the year, I got just one RCF 705AS Mk2 sub and connect it to either side, tops. I am finding however that my sub is clipping and cutting out without my tops being all that loud. When I got the sub I was led to believe that it would be enough for the two tops but it appears not.

    So my question is, I want to go for 2 subs, so I can pole mount my tops on top of them but the RCF is rather pricey. I only went for it based on the reviews, the brand and the fact I would only need one. Can anyone advise as to another active sub of good quality that has plenty of oomph but is quite a bit less than the RCF in price, so I could afford 2. There seem to be a few good reviews on the Alto Truesonic TS215S which is quite a bit cheaper, but its not a make I am familiar with in regard to quality, sound, aftercare etc....

    Any suggestions on a decent pair of active sub to match up to my RCF 715's that will have more than enough power.

    Thanks folks

  2. #2

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    I've heard RCF subs up against cheaper alternatives, and was amazed at the difference.

    The cheaper alternative (I think they were Altos) lacked any real oomph.

    Trying to find 2 x subs for the price of 1 x additional RCF sub isn't going to work.

    As you're already half way there, I'd recommend a second RCF sub.

    The RCF715A is a very powerful speaker - so I can see that 1 x sub isn't going to be enough. You may have even needed the 905 (x 2) to really match the power of the 715.

    But that's out of budget, so another 705 sub is the best option.

  3. #3
    Shakermaker Promotions's Avatar
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    Totally agree.
    Shame your a day late as I have literally just sold my pair or immaculate 705's. Loved them but hardly used them.

  4. #4
    Dinosaur Excalibur's Avatar
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    Wash my mouth out with soap, but I too am going to recommend another RCF. Not my weapon of choice, but if you've got one, it's the obvious answer.
    We recently heard a new Db sub which did impress me, but can't see a pair of them being cheaper than another RCF.

    The 7 series are mighty beasts, but I'm surprised one sub can't hack it, unless you're playing some very bass heavy choons. Since you've got fifteen inch tops, try running them full range to help the sub out. They should cope with that easily.

    Fuller reply tomorrow
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  5. #5

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    It's definitely worth doing the math before buying 715's are rated at 700w per side (e.g. 1,400w total), the 705 sub is rated at 800w RMS total so one 705 sub is never going to keep up with two 715 tops. General rule of thumb is that if you take the heavy lifting of the bass off the top cabs, they'll be able to put out a LOT volume, so subs should be rated at 1.5 to 2x the output of the tops. I've got RCF 422's as tops (450w each) and 705's as subs (800w each) and when I run both subs, they will still clip before I hit the limit on the tops. If you want to be able to run the tops full pelt (and I'd suggest that you'd really need to be doing shows to 500 people in big venues - like, festivals in marquees or barns before you'd want to do that!!) then you'd need to be looking at a pair of 905 AS II subs (1200w RMS) or possibly even 4 of them!

    So... really it comes back to the question of what you're trying to achieve by putting subs under your tops. If you're looking for a more rounded sound at reasonable levels for up to 150 people, then one sub is probably OK (with the crossover set at the lowest point of 80hz so it just rounds out the bottom end). If you're looking at more volume, then you need to be thinking about a second 705 or a pair of 905's. If these are out of your budget, then I've heard good things about the Alto Black range of subs and EV also offer good bang for buck - just bear in mind whatever you buy will need to be pushing out at least 130db to keep up with your 715 tops properly. Yamaha subs are also very good for punch and volume, but from memory I think they're in the same ballpark as the RCF kit price wise.

    Julian
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  6. #6
    Dinosaur Excalibur's Avatar
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    Julian has done the maths, and I'm not going to challenge a word of it. So much of course does depend on what you're trying to do with them, and the gigs you're doing. 715s on their own should pack a hefty wallop, and if you just want a bit of reinforcement, one 705 sub will help.

    As Julian said, set the cut off point to the lowest setting, so the sub isn't doing it's maximum work. Feed the tops from the through output on the sub, not the filtered one, so they're working full range. You'll get most bass this way. See if that helps at all.

    As Julian says, normally the subs would be more powerful than the tops, and be used to take the strain off them , but seemingly you're in the opposite position, so you're trying to go the opposite way. Like I said, try setting them up as I suggested, and see if that helps at all. Failing that, you're going to be spending money.

    Db, HK and RCF don't vary wildly in price or specs for comparable models, buying two Db 615s would be a grand from Thomann, and one 705 ( if it's the same model you have ) is around £700, so not wildly different. Forget Altos, they just won't hack it, even if you get the Blacks.
    Excalibur. Older than the average DJ.

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  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Excalibur View Post
    Since you've got fifteen inch tops, try running them full range to help the sub out. They should cope with that easily.
    Yes I would agree this would be the next step before spending any money.

  8. #8
    ukpartydj's Avatar
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    I've got that setup (mk1). I've had no issues, sounds lovely! But as already been mentioned try playing with thru and crossover.

    I normally have the tops volume set around half and the sub on 0db and they tend to work together equally.

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  9. #9
    Sapphire Disco's Avatar
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    These look good for the price and not too heavy

    https://www.thomann.de/gb/turbosound_iq_15b.htm

  10. #10

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    Thanks folks

    I must be doing something wrong.

    I ended up with 2 x Sub 705 AS ii and also 2 x RCF 715 A Mkii and I am using an Allen and Heath Zed 12 Fx mixer. I assumed this would give me more than enough grunt for anything I do.
    Have been doing a couple of gigs recently in really small venue's (I dont do very many gigs but like good sound when I do), I am talking the lounge of a small pub which is around the size of a large living room.

    All my speakers are turned up to 12 o clock on the dial. When playing music or playing karaoke with singers, even in this small space, its not all that loud but the LED's on the mixes are hitting into the red. I just dont get it. I thought this set up would have plenty of grunt and be nowhere near the red whilst giving more than enough volume for a small venue. Is it the compatibility of the mixer, should I be going past 12 o clock on the speakers or am I just going deaf.

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