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Thread: The first step on the road to knowledge is realising how little you know.

  1. #21
    Dinosaur Excalibur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nakatomi View Post
    they all can take their toll on a DJ's disarming smile...
    Nah mate, it's more firmly fixed than a limpet on a rock with a tube of superglue, crampons, and a Hilti gun.
    Excalibur. Older than the average DJ.

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  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by ppentertainments View Post
    Totally agree, however I think DJs are too fixated on price and worse still on how much they can get for a gig. When was the last time you attended a seminar with a basis in earning (say) £60k a year ? Most of them just go on about how much you can get for a gig. Now, a lot of people get sucked into this figure/gig but this is totally irrelevant if you can't get that amount on a regular basis.

    I have had a few bookings amounting to over £2k a booking yet would be suicidal to concentrate on those bookings. One of my competitors is very well known and commands in excess of £1k a booking - however the amount of bookings would not be enough for me.
    One of the reasons many of us are 'fixated' on price is that so many discos are quite simply going out for way less than they are worth.

    I would never support a 'minimum fee' structure. But I do believe education plays an important part in education DJs as to why they are worth more than what they are charging. Most DJs are going out for less than the amount paid for the drinks for the toasts!

    As for £2k a gig - 35 events a year gives you £70k - providing £10k of 'costs' to give you the £60k earnings.

    It's absolutely possible, but I don't see many DJs at all do what is required to appeal to the £2k+ paying clients.

    Speak to high end wedding planners. Some are working on £100-£150k weddings. They simply turn away work where the total wedding budget is less than £30k. A 'luxury' wedding is really anything from £40k. I'm sure a £40k+ wedding can afford a £2k wedding dj (5% of the total budget) for their entertainment, especially when you offer an all day service.

    The trick is understanding how to appeal to these clients. And there's education for that too

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    The trick is understanding how to appeal to these clients. And there's education for that too
    And THAT is exactly the education I'm looking for

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    One of the reasons many of us are 'fixated' on price is that so many discos are quite simply going out for way less than they are worth.

    I would never support a 'minimum fee' structure. But I do believe education plays an important part in education DJs as to why they are worth more than what they are charging. Most DJs are going out for less than the amount paid for the drinks for the toasts!

    As for £2k a gig - 35 events a year gives you £70k - providing £10k of 'costs' to give you the £60k earnings.

    It's absolutely possible, but I don't see many DJs at all do what is required to appeal to the £2k+ paying clients.

    Speak to high end wedding planners. Some are working on £100-£150k weddings. They simply turn away work where the total wedding budget is less than £30k. A 'luxury' wedding is really anything from £40k. I'm sure a £40k+ wedding can afford a £2k wedding dj (5% of the total budget) for their entertainment, especially when you offer an all day service.

    The trick is understanding how to appeal to these clients. And there's education for that too
    Totally agree with you, and I do think some out there should be commanding £2k and more. Myself, I am honest and I am not good enough nor have the drive for it as I am content with what I do - the earnings are more of a slog, but I make ends meet

    As far as education goes, I am not sure if the LACK of education is what hinders a lot of people, more the reluctance to ACCEPT the content on what they are being educated. As soon as someone mentions they do high end gigs, they are generally ostracised and made a mockery of. My theory is if you are earning enough and people do try to mock what you do, you are doing fine
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post

    The trick is understanding how to appeal to these clients. And there's education for that too
    I find that often the higher paying clients are the ones that don't have that much money and just understand the value of the service. my clients for example are usually middle class people with very normal jobs and houses.

    One guy near me works on that 30 events per year and consistency charges £2,000, looking at his clients, they are often a lot more working class than the clients I attract and book him in 3 star venues etc. Most of you will have heard of this guy or know him and he does a very good job. There are lot of £2k DJ's that very often dip on the pricing for many events so hats of too him. A top end wedding means top end prep and delivery, no room for any error of any form and it needs to be WOW that guy is good (TV presenter/actor standard)! I am 4 years in on the MC thing, definitely not there yet! Yes it could be more fast tracked, but having two babies I don't have the time to invest in acting classes, toastmasters & such like. So just because you do 30 weddings vs 100 it actually means there is most probably more work involved and a lot more risk! I think that a lot of price clones think they can just double their prices and carry in with the same service!

    I dont tend to see the top end weddings at all (or get enquiries for them), but I know they go on all around the New Forest and they usually book good bands. I do a lot of exclusives at 2 venues and I know the venue hire is £15 on its own, but they are never super all in!! I did one this year mind you that had all the bells and whistles. e.g. helicopter and horse and carriage etc. and that was most certainly not a rich client, an Essex wedding out to impress! I prefer the more laid back client that focus on the important things (e.g. two people in love getting married with their friends and family without all the bling and distractions).
    Last edited by yourdj; 01-11-2017 at 02:27 PM.
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  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by yourdj View Post
    I dont tend to see the top end weddings at all (or get enquiries for them), but I know they go on all around the New Forest and they usually book good bands.
    And this is the industry challenge.

    We have to make a 'mobile disco' trendy again. Even the name 'mobile disco' still sends shudders through my spine.

    No wonder the very discerning clients go and book a band - after all, when was the last time a band played Agadoo or the Birdie Song...!

    I think we're certainly on the right track - the new 'specialist wedding dj' is quite a new thing, and people are now becoming aware that this service exists and that it doesn't come as an 80s Peter Kay throwback!

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    No wonder the very discerning clients go and book a band - after all, when was the last time a band played Agadoo or the Birdie Song...!
    Waits for a certain folically challenged moustachioed Yorkshireman to say something along the lines of "Whoa there Musky....."

    Actually - I have, and recently (and worse....it was at a wedding in April which was far from being a cheap one too!)

    Some of the higher-end ones I've done have wanted nothing but cheese (although I must confess, nothing quite as bad as Agadoo).

    The price doesn't determine the music, but it DOES give them the ability to dictate the music choices and have a say in the evening's entertainment. A bargain basement DJ isn't necessarily going to go and purchase tracks they may not have just to satisfy a client....especially on the night (I will if I have suitable 3/4G access as do most of us).

    At best, they're going to try to stream from Youtube at low quality if they can get a connection, and yes I've had brides and grooms tell me in the past that they've been to weddings where the first dance was streamed....and buffered part way through. BOTH of those couples realised what was happening and so went for a more reliable option for their own weddings (yours truly) rather than cutting corners. I'm sure it probably happens an awful lot.

    It doesn't just have to be weddings that are prepared to pay a decent fee either it should be mentioned. If you've got something unique (such as the Retro lighting I've got), then that in itself along with reputation can generate a decent fee for the evening.

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Imagine View Post
    Actually - I have, and recently (and worse....it was at a wedding in April which was far from being a cheap one too!)

    Some of the higher-end ones I've done have wanted nothing but cheese (although I must confess, nothing quite as bad as Agadoo).
    Ah, this isn't 'higher end' I'm referring to - I'm talking about 'very high end' - the sorts of gigs that the mobile disco industry just isn't getting a look in at the moment.

    50k+ weddings - of where there are a good number taking place!

    The 'specialist wedding dj' seems to be making good inroads in to the £15k-£30k weddings at the moment and getting good fees.

    It's the very high end that seems a bit elusive at the moment.


    Quote Originally Posted by Imagine View Post
    The price doesn't determine the music, but it DOES give them the ability to dictate the music choices and have a say in the evening's entertainment.
    Of course. Bespoke/personalised/customised are all words that a higher end client wants to see you provide.

    Perversely, in the 'very high end' weddings, it goes completely the opposite way - you will barely hear anything from the bride and groom, and any discussion about the day itself will be conducted through the wedding planner.

    *Usual caveat that this is 'typical' and of course never applies to every event, there will of course, always be many varied and interesting exceptions!

  9. #29
    Dinosaur Excalibur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post

    As for £2k a gig - 35 events a year gives you £70k - providing £10k of 'costs' to give you the £60k earnings.
    Whoa there, Musky! £10k? Blimey, I hit that just in diesel alone!!

    ( Figure inflated by a few thousand for comic effect).

    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    The trick is understanding how to appeal to these clients. And there's education for that too
    I somehow thought there might be.

    ( And for anyone not fully cogniscent of my predilection for humour and whimsy, the above replies were in jest. The following are deadly serious. )

    Quote Originally Posted by ppentertainments View Post

    As far as education goes, I am not sure if the LACK of education is what hinders a lot of people, more the reluctance to ACCEPT the content on what they are being educated. As soon as someone mentions they do high end gigs, they are generally ostracised and made a mockery of. My theory is if you are earning enough and people do try to mock what you do, you are doing fine
    I think that's absolutely true. Also bear in mind that people who mock things are often afraid of them. Raising your prices by a significant amount can require a very big leap of faith.

    Quote Originally Posted by yourdj View Post
    So just because you do 30 weddings vs 100 it actually means there is most probably more work involved and a lot more risk! I think that a lot of price clones think they can just double their prices and carry in with the same service!
    Well at the same time that's absolutely true, and total cobblers!! From many of the things I've seen, I know I'm seriously undervaluing myself, and am worth a lot more on some gigs.

    On the flip side, Toby is spot on, just because you're charging top end prices like everybody else, doesn't mean you're providing a top end service.

    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    And this is the industry challenge.

    We have to make a 'mobile disco' trendy again. Even the name 'mobile disco' still sends shudders through my spine.

    No wonder the very discerning clients go and book a band - after all, when was the last time a band played Agadoo or the Birdie Song...!

    I think we're certainly on the right track - the new 'specialist wedding dj' is quite a new thing, and people are now becoming aware that this service exists and that it doesn't come as an 80s Peter Kay throwback!
    Don't think you'll ever make " Mobile Disco " trendy again. That ship has sailed. I'd disagree about " Specialist Wedding DJ". I think that's not only old hat, but also can be seen by some as someone inflating his/her prices simply because the market will bear it.

    Flippant answer: Agadoo? Well that would be the last time Black Lace did a gig, I suspect. Sorry, naughty Peter, be serious.

    Quote Originally Posted by Imagine View Post
    Waits for a certain folically challenged moustachioed Yorkshireman to say something along the lines of "Whoa there Musky....."
    Ner ner, got it in early.

    Quote Originally Posted by Imagine View Post
    Actually - I have, and recently (and worse....it was at a wedding in April which was far from being a cheap one too!)

    Some of the higher-end ones I've done have wanted nothing but cheese (although I must confess, nothing quite as bad as Agadoo).
    I've said it till I'm blue in the face, playing cheese is no indicator of the cost of the function, or the capabilities of the DJ. Some want it, some don't. It's not for us to foist it upon them, but if they want it, they get it. Simples.

    Quote Originally Posted by Imagine View Post
    The price doesn't determine the music, but it DOES give them the ability to dictate the music choices and have a say in the evening's entertainment. A bargain basement DJ isn't necessarily going to go and purchase tracks they may not have just to satisfy a client....especially on the night (I will if I have suitable 3/4G access as do most of us).
    To a certain extent: Cobblers again. That may all hinge on your definition of " Bargain Basement ".
    Excalibur. Older than the average DJ.

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  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Excalibur View Post
    On the flip side, Toby is spot on, just because you're charging top end prices like everybody else, doesn't mean you're providing a top end service.
    Offer a service that they are prepared to pay for, and deliver what you promised. That's all that's required.

    In many cases, people are prepared to pay much more just for the security that the DJ will actually turn up, and that they can actually contact the DJ in advance of the event.

    Price and value are fascinating things, and different clients approach them in different ways.

    Focus on your value, and you can easily justify putting your price up.

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