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Thread: I don't know what I do...

  1. #1

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    Default I don't know what I do...

    Something I've wanted to write about for a while: and will be interested to see the responses.

    I'm very happy and pleased with my performances in terms of being able to fill a dancefloor (naturally, I get the odd dud), but by and large, the fact so many venues comment on 'how full I'd kept the dancefloor', suggests I'm 'above average' in terms of being able to fill a dancefloor.

    But here's the bit I struggle with: I couldn't teach someone to do what I do. If someone asked me to explain why I picked certain songs or why I played them in a certain order, I couldn't. I just 'know' what songs to play.

    Often, much of my playlist I determine ahead of the evening, and just tweak/amend on the night, but I leave home knowing my plan for how the flow of the evening is going to go, and at what times I want to build the dancefloor etc.

    Could you teach someone what you do? Could you explain the reasons for why you play songs in the order you play them?

  2. #2
    Imagine's Avatar
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    Definitely not....because I too have no idea how I do what I do.

    Other than a couple of duds this year (and the last one was due to the bride and groom nipping off to hospital early doors), I'm normally fairly good at filling dance floors.

    Other than basic beat-matching, I don't do any "proper" mixing (there's been a debate about that particular one on one of the FB pages today), with most of the choons I throw down playing for pretty much the full length and being segued into the next (I've found that's what my clients prefer....I'm not a club jock).

    Unlike you though, I rarely go along with a pre-determined playlist. I never have, unless it's been dictated by the bride and groom or party host. I have a rough idea of how I'd like things to work and often have the first half a dozen in my head....after that though I wing it on the night preferring to choose tracks to suit the mood of the party and respond to requests.

    Could I teach somebody how to do it? I don't think so.

    I personally think most of the success of this job is built up over hundreds of parties and just having the knowledge of what will work, when and how, and occasionally having the guts to throw in the left-fielder that they've forgotten about just to see if it works.

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Imagine View Post
    Unlike you though, I rarely go along with a pre-determined playlist. I never have, unless it's been dictated by the bride and groom or party host. I have a rough idea of how I'd like things to work and often have the first half a dozen in my head....after that though I wing it on the night preferring to choose tracks to suit the mood of the party and respond to requests.
    It's not something I used to do - it was only about a year ago I started working this way, and have stuck with it (it came about when I had some lengthy advance song requests and wanted to plan them in advance rather than trying to work them out on the night).

    I welcome song suggestions from the couples I work with - on the basis that they aren't 'playlists', but 'guidance' of songs they like and they know their friends like and that they trust me to have the final judgement on what's played.

    Once I've got this, I can pretty much suss out how the evening needs to go - so I tend to add in all the requested songs, along with other songs I know that will work with them. I tend to break down the night in to hours and drop the songs in at the time I know will work.

    It means I rarely finish a gig thinking "ah, I wish I'd played that and played that"... instead it means I can pre-prepare the last hour, so I can build up to the ending, and work the rest of the songs in too.

    There's been a rare occasion when I've needed to veer away from it (I'm not a slave to it, but I find it useful to have a pre-made framework to work with).

    The downside is that there's less to do during the evening, but means I'm spending time working with the audience rather than head buried in laptop looking for the right next few songs.

    But overall, it's really added to my evenings and I find makes a stronger mix of music across the night.

    There's the odd gig where I get no guidance up front, and it is nice now and again turning up and working out what I'm playing 'on the hoof', but even then I find I'm always working up to 10 songs ahead anyway!

  4. #4

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    If I've learned anything in the last four years, never mind the other 25 it's that we can't possibly say with enough confidence we'd bet our house on that any given tune will have the desired result. Or can we?

    I've seen plenty of the "I always follow X with Y & it NEVER FAILS" type posts from DJs but I know it's not necessarily true because I've personally seen it fail. Music programming is definitely an art not a science. If there was a way to predict with even 80% certainty of a track working we'd all be out of jobs replaced by 'smart playlist' algorithms (those of us who primarily play music anyway). It's long been predicted but there are still no signs of it happening for real.

    Regarding thinking ahead - I usually have a stack of around 5-10 tracks sitting in my VDJ sidelist which are where I'm planning to go. This gets shuffled & bumped around like no tomorrow as requests come in & is a throwback to my club days when I was taught to always try to think at least 3 tracks ahead. Using newer tech allows much further forward thinking.

    Deciding how to program my music is a multi faceted process. On one hand there are requests, both from before the event & during it, then there's the current mood of the room from observing the crowd, what's coming next in terms of the night itself... absolutely loads of variables. I've seen lots of play histories posted where the DJ claims the dancefloor was absolutely rammed all night long & I'm scratching my head thinking "what? They played Red Light Spells Danger, followed by The Number of The Beast - and didn't lose ANYBODY?" (kinda thing).

    So could I teach somebody to choose the music to play the way I do? Hmmm I can give hints maybe, but I'm not sure even I know exactly how I do it.
    Last edited by Nakatomi; 04-06-2018 at 12:05 AM.

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    Going against the grain I think you can teach somebody why I choose songs, I'm quite analytical and feel it's something you can teach to a certain degree. I think you need passion and style to be able to do a good job though.

    I half prepare songs, If I get a request list I load it all up and sort out which genres etc but I don't have a framework and regularly mix things up to keep interest from guests.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ukpartydj View Post
    Going against the grain I think you can teach somebody why I choose songs, I'm quite analytical and feel it's something you can teach to a certain degree. I think you need passion and style to be able to do a good job though.

    I half prepare songs, If I get a request list I load it all up and sort out which genres etc but I don't have a framework and regularly mix things up to keep interest from guests.
    You can't necessarily spot every reason a track worked at the time it did though, and that's (hopefully) why we'll never be replaced with machines.

    I know of one disco operator who had a reputation for changing genre & energy every other song but his reviews were all 5* & there were hundreds of them. How did that ever work? My only theory, having never witnessed him (and never can now) was that his presentation style was what glued it all together.

    I'm very good at what I do but I'd really like to understand more & do things better. Are there any workshops for music programming? I've certainly never heard of any.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nakatomi View Post
    I'm very good at what I do but I'd really like to understand more & do things better. Are there any workshops for music programming? I've certainly never heard of any.
    I previously programmed music for commercial radio stations for a number of years. That was a really useful insight, as there's structure and process to how music is programmed.

    One of the most interesting aspects was getting access to in-depth music research, where music had been tested with different age groups to see how well they respond to certain songs. I've certainly made use of that whilst DJ'ing.

    One thing research proves time and time again is people like the same few 'well known' songs. We may think they are bored of them, but that's not the case.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nakatomi View Post
    If I've learned anything in the last four years, never mind the other 25 it's that we can't possibly say with enough confidence we'd bet our house on that any given tune will have the desired result. Or can we?
    The more time passes, the less certainty we have that tracks will pack floors.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nakatomi View Post
    Regarding thinking ahead - I usually have a stack of around 5-10 tracks sitting in my VDJ sidelist which are where I'm planning to go. This gets shuffled & bumped around like no tomorrow as requests come in & is a throwback to my club days when I was taught to always try to think at least 3 tracks ahead. Using newer tech allows much further forward thinking.
    And requests thrown on next, when you realise that a guest has come up with the perfect song to fit in with where you're going.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nakatomi View Post
    So could I teach somebody to choose the music to play the way I do? Hmmm I can give hints maybe, but I'm not sure even I know exactly how I do it.
    I can't even teach myself. I'd dearly love to structure a night, and know exactly the type of track I'm likely to play next at all times, but so often it's almost impossible. Saturday's wedding was influenced by the groom, and before it started, I knew where I would be going. Come the night, the bride was a Duracell bunny on the dancefloor, and it was a whole different ball game.

    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    One thing research proves time and time again is people like the same few 'well known' songs. We may think they are bored of them, but that's not the case.
    No , Sherlock? That's why they're called The Usual Suspects, mayhap?

    And that's the two edged sword we deal with. We'd love a reputation as being cutting edge DJs, with total musical integrity, playing only the most critically acclaimed music, but when Come on Eileen and Hey Baby ram the dance floor each week, it's tempting to put them into the playlist at the opportune moments. It was ever thus.
    Excalibur. Older than the average DJ.

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  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    I previously programmed music for commercial radio stations for a number of years. That was a really useful insight, as there's structure and process to how music is programmed.

    One of the most interesting aspects was getting access to in-depth music research, where music had been tested with different age groups to see how well they respond to certain songs. I've certainly made use of that whilst DJ'ing.

    One thing research proves time and time again is people like the same few 'well known' songs. We may think they are bored of them, but that's not the case.
    That's interesting but I find commercial radio programming predictable & arcane. Certainly since uk radio station ownership slipped to the point where only a handful of companies own the commercial radio landscape.

    Being predictable is something I try really hard to avoid (for my own sanity as much as anything else) while still trying to make music work for a crowd. Sometimes it's what is needed & other times it can fall flat. The lowest common denominator is as Peter said a double edged sword.

    There's more to a track succeeding than what immediately preceded it though. It's a much bigger picture than that.

  10. #10

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    I have always believed that this is a job you can't really teach people - either they know music or they don't.

    It must be one of the easiest jobs in the world - setting up a disco and playing music is hardly rocket science - but without trying to sound like a "I do it for the love of music" person, you do need to have a keen interest in music and a vast knowledge.

    My son has been helping me with the technical side of things for years, can setup a disco quicker than me and knows the technology side far more than me. BUT I would never let him do a disco (apart from a couple of freebies he does) because his music knowledge is on par with most 18 year olds (yes, that bad).
    Semi-Retired Multi Award Winning DJ

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