Yet another ( Yawn ) vaguely price related thread. Sorry.

[rth_discos]

The really annoying (and I mean it totally winds me up) thing about the PMC is all the negativity among djs I spoke to. "well that was an hour I'll never get back" etc then seeing the same people in the queue signing up for next year. Why all the forked tongue behaviour? I'd have enjoyed the conference more if there hadn't been so many DJs

It is interesting seeing many DJs who'll pay for lots of education (you can do too much - it leads to overwhelm), yet won't spend a penny on outsourcing anything.

If you're undertaking education, you've got to go with a mind to implement what they're saying - and an open mind to change the way you do things. I guess they're still chasing the unicorn of the silver bullet.

Many would be far better outsourcing some of the areas they struggle with if they don't want to do the hard work of implementing it themselves.

Back to the note of pricing - I'm struggling to see how a DJ could viable bring in more than £25k profit per year, without diversifying in to essentially a multi-op with dancefloors etc. Lots of people talk about impressive revenue figures, but few seem to be achieving the dizzy heights in profit.

[DJColsie]

It appears that the " bread and butter " work is mainly being filled by Sid. There's one locally on Facebook who isn't charging what I'd call a sensible price. Ironically, it's seemingly easier to get relatively well paid work, but there's not an abundance of that.

What there is an abundance of is sub £120 gigs, and that's not viable.

I had a day job work colleague ask me if I knew a DJ starting out who would do a 70th birthday party 6.30 to 10.30 for pennies to get the experience. Think he wanted me to do it , thankfully I was already booked. Politely replied that all my friends and piers were experienced quality DJs and I didn't know any new starters.

[Imagine]

I had a day job work colleague ask me if I knew a DJ starting out who would do a 70th birthday party 6.30 to 10.30 for pennies to get the experience. Think he wanted me to do it , thankfully I was already booked. Politely replied that all my friends and piers were experienced quality DJs and I didn't know any new starters.

Strangely enough, this is a trend I'm noticing with brides of all people at the moment with possibly the biggest risk ever.....the photographer/videographer.

There seems to be a real surge of posts on the FB wedding groups at the moment with brides who are looking for students/new businesses looking to build their portfolio in exchange for cheap wedding photos.

Of ALL of the things I'd never take a risk on.....that'd have to be the top of my pile.

[Nakatomi]

Funny but my private customers (who are now thankfully increasing in numbers) have all related to me tales of how they or someone they know got burned by booking someone cheap in the past. I've heard some right old horror stories but it seems for me at least customers are wising up. I just need more.

[Jim - Scotland's Party DJ]

Back to the note of pricing - I'm struggling to see how a DJ could viable bring in more than £25k profit per year, without diversifying in to essentially a multi-op with dancefloors etc. Lots of people talk about impressive revenue figures, but few seem to be achieving the dizzy heights in profit.

This is all anecdotal but I grossed about £25k last year and that was whilst working 40+ hours a week as a teacher and having to black out something like 2 months throughout the year for holidays my missus likes booking. It wouldn't be easy and I'd never dream of trying it but I think there's scope for a very small number of guys to net £25k if they were able to do it full time and invest all their energy towards it. With that being said - knowing how much effort that ^ took, I'd never want to exponentiate that up for the sake of only earning £25 grand at the end of it all.

[Imagine]

This is all anecdotal but I grossed about £25k last year and that was whilst working 40+ hours a week as a teacher and having to black out something like 2 months throughout the year for holidays my missus likes booking. It wouldn't be easy and I'd never dream of trying it but I think there's scope for a very small number of guys to net £25k if they were able to do it full time and invest all their energy towards it. With that being said - knowing how much effort that ^ took, I'd never want to exponentiate that up for the sake of only earning £25 grand at the end of it all.

It IS possible, and I know of people that turnover double that.

One all day wedding a week for 48 weeks of the year? OK, I know that's difficult to acheive and in reality, these guys do 2-3 all-dayers a week from May to September. But at a grand a pop....I'll let you do the sums.

[ppentertainments]

It IS possible, and I know of people that turnover double that.

One all day wedding a week for 48 weeks of the year? OK, I know that's difficult to acheive and in reality, these guys do 2-3 all-dayers a week from May to September. But at a grand a pop....I'll let you do the sums.

I agree it is possible BUT is £25k net really a decent profit for a self employed business ?
I am also VERY sceptical about the grand a pop. More and more DJs I talk to who charge high fees are struggling - really struggling as in single figure booking this year for some.

When I operated me and just me I could get this £25k figure, but went multi op as, for me, I wanted more reward for the efforts of running a business.

[Benny Smyth]

For me to achieve £25k profit, I need to do 62 events a year (assuming every event is up to 5 hours in my immediate catchment area with lighting and sound provision).

Not really that far fetched.

[rth_discos]

Now I'm not saying it's not possible, but the number of DJs who can achieve it will be limited.

Once the figures are written down, you can see the caveat.

We already know that the 'all day DJ' is a 'sell' on its own - it's not the typical purchase.

In addition, £1k is not what the typical couple have in their budget for the DJ.

So the DJ is selling a service they hadn't originally considered or budgeted for.

Whilst we know people value the service when they understand it, and are prepared to pay for it, it is a limiting factor.

People who get married in Jan/Feb/Mar/Oct/Nov typically do so because you can get a great rate with the venue. So they are more price sensitive.

People who get married on a day other than a Sat also typically do so because you can get a great rate with the venue. So they too are more price sensitive.

I can easily see how how it's possible to work every Sat between May and Sept. 22 Saturdays this year. Plus a few extra in the months either side. Let's say a further 10.

Using the £1k figure, that's £32k. Before any costs have been accounted for. So there's the £25k after costs. Definitely possible - and still room for some extra evening only events in the off peak months. Plus Christmas.

Unless you're getting the bulk of this work through venue recommendations, you're going to need a reasonable marketing budget to generate the level of enquiries needed to fill those dates.

I can see how £50k revenue is possible. Not sure about working 3 all day weddings back to back though. 2 back to back is a challenge (and does that really provide the level of service someone expects when paying £1k?).

Like I say, not saying it's not possible, but it's a far from typical result. It can be done, but needs to be worked on hard with marketing and networking at every possible opportunity. The 'typical' DJ is not going to get those results. A few can achieve it through hard work.

Start adding on extras though like danceflooors and photo booths, and if you can push the average order value up, then the revenue (and profit) can start to look quite nice.

[Imagine]

No, £25k for a business owner is not a decent profit.

The problem we have at the moment is too many have-a-go-Harry's who go out for next to nothing with a ripped music collection and devalue what the rest of us do ('cos being a DJ's easy....innit?). They're not running proper businesses and therefore profit isn't their biggest concern. And it's not just us as DJs who are being affected.

I'm seeing Facebook posts looking for newly qualified photographers looking to build their portfolios for next to no money and some food, stationers who are being driven into the ground and even dress boutiques suffering because brides are willing to take a punt on a frock from China </end rant>

Yes, I know of many who have only just done there first gig of 2019 (I've only done 5 to date....I'm down on numbers on previous years). I'm ashamed to admit that I've got absolutely NOTHING booked for August! I know why (look a couple of paragraphs down), but the enquiries for that particular month have also been down through the floor.

£1k a pop for all day (i.e. from ceremony to carriages) - no problem. That's what I charge and although I'm down on them this year, I have several for next year already. It's a long hard day as those of us who do all day properly will appreciate, but it's worth it (and Sidney doesn't tend to take these on as there's so much work and pressure involved). Three a week isn't back to back by the way Gavin - the guys I'm talking about do this all week and tend to do one every other day. Still tough going...but do-able if this is your only job and not a side hustle.

Those gigs are also becoming harder to sell (trust me...I'm a DJ)

I think there are a lot of factors at work this year, and 2019 is going to be rough for a lot of us (unless we're going out at rock bottom prices). I'm personally down this year (not good when going full time), due to not being able to even consider bookings when my wife had a seizure back in February. We seriously didn't know at the time whether or not I could continue with the business and it so nearly got closed down. I'm sure it'll come back (enquiries are starting to come back in again)....but it's going to take work.

What I've noticed so far from my own experience and speaking to my local venue owners (this is directly related to weddings by the way):

* The "B" word. People are concerned about their jobs and aren't spending (I for one become redundant from my full time job tomorrow as a direct and provable result). Rule 20 prohibits any further discussion on that topic....so I shall leave that one there before being slapped by Steve or Peter
* There's a "9" in the year. It's a silly one I know, but a lot of B&G's are holding off until next year (I never understood that one). I'm getting a LOT of enquiries for 2020 already. Enquiries for the rest of 2019 are very thin on the ground.
* Weddings are changing...and fast! Although there are as many people tieing the knot as ever before, the way they're doing it is changing. As an example, I got married 20 years ago this year, and in those days it was the church or registry office followed by the village hall. Hotel "packages" were just starting to come in and there was a thing for spending more and being better than your mates weddings. It then obviously moved onto barns, bespoke wedding venues etc. What I'm seeing a LOT of at the moment is DIY and a move back to the way things were done 20 years ago.
* The current generation are used to doing things their way. I have a 20 year old son....he'd rather hire big speakers and play a Spotify playlist than hire a DJ.

My predictions

* Specialist wedding DJs will shortly become a thing of the past. There....I've said it! I'll burn in hell now
I've been burned by advertising myself as "wedding only" as advised by several of the "gurus" out there. Brides are still associating "wedding" with expensive....and it's becoming more and more apparent of late. I charge the same for an evening reception as a birthday party by the way.
* Photographers will struggle as more and more couples rely on their guests taking natural shots with their iPhones (I'm actually witnessing this now!)
* Chocolate fountains will die (I can't actually remember the last time I saw one of those)
* Photo booths will disappear in favour of things like the "Selfie booth" which I'm seriously looking into

How am I combatting these trends?

* I've changed my online presence back to being an "all rounder". I happily boast that I'll consider any party...and it's working
* I've re-started doing kids parties. By Gawd they're hard work, and they're far from being my favourite, but parents will pay for quality and a stress-free party. I can do a couple of these at two hours a pop and earn the same as a Saturday evening....and still be back in bed on the same day as I got of it! The kids are a lot less demanding with "my song next"/"I'm going home soon"/"I'm the bride's best friend"
* Retro parties. These are a particular favourite of mine having an 80s lightshow in my lockup. The budgets tend to be a bit bigger because they don't have the rest of the day to fork out for, the kids tend to be grown up and the mortgage is in sight of being paid off. I'm working on ways of going VERY big on this side of the business because they're a lot of fun and VERY profitable (even though they involve a complete cardio workout getting the light screens in and out of the venues).

Just my couple of pennies (and every little helps). We need to keep evolving to keep on top