Terms & Conditions - Artiste to pay...?

[pagan_flame]

14th Feb 2009 --- I have held this booking as a verbal agreement for most of the year, as they are my regular NYE booking. I phoned my contact last week to check everything was OK for NYE and to point out that I hadn't had a contract for NYE 2009 or for the booking for 14th Feb.

The contract arrived for 14th Feb today, with these T & C:

1. The Artiste will not be released from booking except in case of illness (to be certified by medical practitioner).

2. In the event of cancellation of the contract by the Artiste the Management will require a cancellation fee as follows within 31 days of date - @ 25%

3. Whilst you are requested to sign and return the contract which is written confirmation of a verbal agreement already made failure to sign and return it is not sufficient to cancel the agreement unless a written objection is received by the Artiste / Management within 14 days of the date of contract issue it is therefore assumed the booking is confirmed

(Read #3 again and you'll get it - possibly...)

So - if I cancel for any reason - at any time between now and then - and unless I can produce a doctor's certificate, I have to pay THEM 25% of gig fee ... and if I don't sign and return the contract within 14 days the booking is confirmed and I have to pay up unless I tell them in writing within 14 days of contract issue.

What to do? Acquiesce, negotiate or reject...? Never seen T & C like this before, even agencies' ones aren't as harsh as this. Can they hold me to a booking because I HAVEN'T signed their contract? :confused:

[Corabar Steve]

In the words of Edwyn Collins, Rip it up & start again. It's unreasonable, pure & simple & there you have your objection.

I would rip the thing in 2 & send it back to them with a covering note that your objection is that their terms are unreasonable & therefore as per their terms you are not accepting the booking.

Also although a verbal agreement can be seen as binding they'd have a devil of a time proving that you'd agreed in the first place.

Even if they can prove that you agreed to appear / perform, they did not inform you at the time of these terms (therefore these conditions did not form part of the original verbal contract) & as such they cannot arbitrarily impose them you in retrospect.

Angela suggests that, if you are not prepared to accept their terms, you write back enclosing a copy of the written T&Cs saying that whilst you agree that you have a verbal contract to appear on, at , etc, the attached T&Cs never formed part of that verbal contract and were never agreed to by you. Send it by Recorded Delivery. There isn't a court anywhere that would uphold those terms on that basis in Angela's opinion.

[CRAZY K]

14th Feb 2009 --- I have held this booking as a verbal agreement for most of the year, as they are my regular NYE booking. I phoned my contact last week to check everything was OK for NYE and to point out that I hadn't had a contract for NYE 2009 or for the booking for 14th Feb.

The contract arrived for 14th Feb today, with these T & C:

1. The Artiste will not be released from booking except in case of illness (to be certified by medical practitioner).

2. In the event of cancellation of the contract by the Artiste the Management will require a cancellation fee as follows within 31 days of date - @ 25%

3. Whilst you are requested to sign and return the contract which is written confirmation of a verbal agreement already made failure to sign and return it is not sufficient to cancel the agreement unless a written objection is received by the Artiste / Management within 14 days of the date of contract issue it is therefore assumed the booking is confirmed

(Read #3 again and you'll get it - possibly...)

So - if I cancel for any reason - at any time between now and then - and unless I can produce a doctor's certificate, I have to pay THEM 25% of gig fee ... and if I don't sign and return the contract within 14 days the booking is confirmed and I have to pay up unless I tell them in writing within 14 days of contract issue.

What to do? Acquiesce, negotiate or reject...? Never seen T & C like this before, even agencies' ones aren't as harsh as this. Can they hold me to a booking because I HAVEN'T signed their contract? :confused:

Yes I think they can if you had already received a confirmation of terms --which you havent of course---but in these circumstances you never agreed to these totally unacceptable terms VERBALLY so stuff them.

I agree with Steve, just tell them you havent agreed anything except a provisional booking which had no terms or conditions applying.

I certainly wouldnt deal with people on those terms--just tell em to delete clauses 1, 2 and 3 that should do it:D :D :D

CRAZY K

[pagan_flame]

Sound advice! I will send them a letter to the effect that I can only do it if they delete the T & C, and am cancelling the booking if they cannot.

Thanks, I'll keep y'all posted!

[Wayno]

Cor thats very harsh, especially as you already have a working history with them!

I normally pass gigs on but have been looking at setting up an agency as my websites do vey well for me (I have read all the relevant docs and legislation) and the artiste contract that I have drawn up is fair to both parties as the law dictates - I would not consider the above contract fair to both parties, then again I'm not a judge either!

At the end of the day you have had this thrown at you after a verbal agreement has been made so just show them the door and move on (perhaps after the NYE gig - don't want them to get funny!)

Think this smacks of the venues desperation to get cash from wherever possible with the onset of bad times.

[rob1963]

just tell them you havent agreed anything except a provisional booking which had no terms or conditions applying.

Agreed.

[pagan_flame]

Upon receipt of registered letter, the client phoned me back yesterday with 50% apology and 50% excuses... but basically is re-sending the contract minus the offending T & C!

*Result* thanks, people! :beer1: :D

[theoloyla]

The only unreasonable term is clause 3. SEDA contract says that if either party cancels then a payment equal to the advance payment must be made; so you return their deposit or they forfeit it. If the cancellation is less tha 31 days then the full fee becomes payable and that means you would pay them the full fee if you cancelled.

[DazzyD]

I feel that clause 1 is unreasonable also. There are other reasons that you could cancel a gig other than illness. What if you house catches fire an hour before you are due to leave for the gig? Or if a close family member takes ill? Would this be covered in clause 1 or would it just be an illness of the performer?

A verbal agreement forms a contract only when all parties involved agree to the terms of the agreement. Only then can it be deemed as "legally binding". It seems to me that you haven't reached an agreement otherwise the written contract wouldn't have even been drafted.

Besides, isn't a contract meant to be a 2-way agreement? You seem to be grossly under-represented in their proposed "agreement"!

Anyway, well done in getting it resolved :)

[theoloyla]

I feel that clause 1 is unreasonable also. There are other reasons that you could cancel a gig other than illness. What if you house catches fire an hour before you are due to leave for the gig? Or if a close family member takes ill? Would this be covered in clause 1 or would it just be an illness of the performer?

A verbal agreement forms a contract only when all parties involved agree to the terms of the agreement. Only then can it be deemed as "legally binding". It seems to me that you haven't reached an agreement otherwise the written contract wouldn't have even been drafted.

Besides, isn't a contract meant to be a 2-way agreement? You seem to be grossly under-represented in their proposed "agreement"!

:)

A contract must indeed be fair otherwise it can be thrown out of court. SEDA contract is proven to be fair.