Have others received notice letters from PRS

[DK Karaoke]

Hi All,

Just though I would post this as I and most of my DJ's have been getting calls and letters from PRS. Asking if they have a music licence.

Anyway to cut a long story short, it seems they are writing to everyone basically to frighten them into getting a music licence, and I suspect quite a few will get one even though they dont need one.

Another interesting thing is that when I spoke with them, I pointed out to them that I had ProDub, which is all I might need for doing what I do. I also asked them if they were linked to ProDub.

They answered that they had nothing to do with ProDub in any way shape or form, and that they were the only organisation who legally managed the required music licence.

Yet if you go to the ProDub site, its under PRS:confused: :confused:

I think this is intimidation at the highest level, not to mention the insult after paying out a lot of money (in my opinion) for a ProDub licence.

Have any of you had a similar situation lately??

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I think this is intimidation at the highest level

You are joking? A letter asking if you have the appropriate licence is intimidation? Please.....They are just doing their job.

I got one this morning and found it far from intimidating. Why would I? I don't require anything from them, so the letter is now in the recycling.

[Symbiosis01]

Yep, I sure did

Hence my post on here earlier:

http://www.mobilediscodirectory.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=21226

Seems it's got nothing to do with me either

[theoloyla]

Well said Darren

[Dynamic Entertainment]

Darren. I understand that they are doing ther job BUT if they were doing their job properly then they would know about who they were writing out to and the fact that they have the licence they require.

As for the statement saying PRS has nothing to do with Produb, it seems like a case of too many moneys on the phone and not enough organ grinders :)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Darren. I understand that they are doing ther job BUT if they were doing their job properly then they would know about who they were writing out to and the fact that they have the licence they require.


With all due respect, rubbish!

How would they know whether someone has a shop or garage and how would they know whether a company needed a mobile DJ licence if they were selling tickets for a function?

[Excalibur]

Been trying to find the right analogy.

It's like asking if you have a licence for a 38tonne Articulated Lorry, when you're using a Reliant Robin.

[DK Karaoke]

You are joking? A letter asking if you have the appropriate licence is intimidation? Please.....They are just doing their job.

Yes I do find it intimidating, especially if you already have the licence you need.

Intimidation means = Threats, Pressure, Bullying, Fear, Coercion, to name but a few. All of the above apply and imply the same by PRS sending out such letters.

What I would like to know is why did they not check their records to try and determine, if the people they were sending their letters to actually required the licence, or perhaps reminding the intended recipients about the obligations for such a licence.

Also, if the people they have employed to answer the phone were actually aware of who or what they represent, then they would not give incorrect information, like They have nothing to do with ProDub

What about those people who will just buy one when they dont need it, after all, the letter is intimidating, with the meanings stated above.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Intimidation means = Threats, Pressure, Bullying, Fear, Coercion, to name but a few. All of the above apply and imply the same by PRS sending out such letters.



So where on the letter is there threats, bullying or pressure etc? They mearly trying to ascertain if you need a licence.

I have scanned the letter in to see what others think. I really can't see any threats on there....

[Excalibur]

Way I read it, they have absolutely no idea what you do, or how you operate. Looks like a kite flying exercise to me. ;)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Way I read it, they have absolutely no idea what you do, or how you operate. Looks like a kite flying exercise to me. ;)

Agreed. (I think :confused: :D )

[Excalibur]

Agreed. (I think :confused: :D )

Kite flying exercise:- One undertaken more in hope than expectation. They've got a list of businesses, no idea what these businesses do, and they're going to spend a few happy hours ringing them to see if they need a licence. If they sell a couple, then whoopee.

[DK Karaoke]

So where on the letter is there threats, bullying or pressure etc? They mearly trying to ascertain if you need a licence.

I have scanned the letter in to see what others think. I really can't see any threats on there....

The fact that you received this letter from PRS, and in particular its wording is intimidating.

In the opening paragraph, its says "if you play music in your business or community, you may need a music licence"

In the second paragraph it says "a music licence from PRS for music gives you the legal right to play any song you want"

We play music/songs in our business, however, we already have a ProDub licence (I do that is), but then PRS say they have nothing to do with ProDub!!!!

Its seems to me that I am in the job creation business, which is good for the economy and all, but I would like to think that the high fees paid for ProDub, is being used to compensate the creators of the music and not just in the creation of jobs, for people who appear to be under trained, or not trained, whose sole function it would seem is to try and obtain more money from people who have already paid through the nose for the appropriate licence.

In effect we are paying money to PRS/ProDub, so they can hire people to hassle us into paying more money.

As I said before what about those who will actually buy a music licence that dont need it. Where is this money going - to create more jobs for PRS.

[Disco Leisure UK]

Its more of a circular or a quick reminder, its no way intimidating or any pressure to get a licence and its not mainly aimed at DJs, My full time work place receives these forms although they do hold a licence because they play music inside the work area and the reception area (playing to the pubilc), they also have TV in the canteen playing MTV, VH1 etc. I suspect nearly every business could receive one in the future, supermarkets, shopping centres etc or maybe im wrong?

[Excalibur]

Its more of a circular or a quick reminder, its no way intimidating or any pressure to get a licence and its not mainly aimed at DJs, My full time work place receives these forms although they do hold a licence because they play music inside the work area and the reception area (playing to the pubilc), they also have TV in the canteen playing MTV, VH1 etc. I suspect nearly every business could receive one in the future, supermarkets, shopping centres etc or maybe im wrong?

You're absolutely right.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

The fact that you received this letter from PRS, and in particular its wording is intimidating.

In the opening paragraph, its says "if you play music in your business or community, you may need a music licence"

In the second paragraph it says "a music licence from PRS for music gives you the legal right to play any song you want"


Yeah, woah, really intimidating. You may need a licence. :lol:

I can't believe this thread.

[Excalibur]

Yeah, woah, really intimidating. You may need a licence. :lol:

I can't believe this thread.

What do you know? Haven't you heard of suspension of disbelief?
Ed Wood

( That's a quote, not a pseudonym. ;) )
I'm sure there's one better than that in Peter Pan, but not found it yet.

[DK Karaoke]

Yeah, woah, really intimidating. You may need a licence. :lol:

I can't believe this thread.

I wonder how many others feel uneasy after receiving this letter, but are afraid to say so for whatever reason.

The main point is the letter does not state that if you are listening to music in your own home, you do not need a licence. A deliberate omission.

The other point is DJ's who have ProDub, and need this licence, have already paid for the privilege to copy this music, so as to play it via computer, to an audience in a public environment. Again something that is not differentiated in the letter. My points noted in earlier posts, under the 1st and 2nd paragraph of the PRS letter.

Lets get something clear.

This is all about collecting royalties for artists.

They already receive royalties through to name at least the following:
a. when you buy a cd
b. When you download legally
c. from radio stations
d. pub and other music venue licenses
e. Produb license

So they (Artists ?)(PRS ?) are getting royalties several times over already, without PRS trying to get more from those who have already paid - probably several times.

Also how do PRS know who is listening to what and from what source, so how can they fairly distribute the royalties, without knowing what is being played.

[Dynamic Entertainment]

With all due respect, rubbish!

How would they know whether someone has a shop or garage and how would they know whether a company needed a mobile DJ licence if they were selling tickets for a function?


Way I read it, they have absolutely no idea what you do, or how you operate. Looks like a kite flying exercise to me. ;)


Agreed. (I think :confused: :D )

Kite flying is basically what ive said.....so how is it rubbish Darren?

Would you send a generic letter to all your customers asking if they have paid ther deposits? and if you did, how do you think that you would look in their eyes?......Possibly that you couldnt find your posteriour with both hamds and a mirror? :)

[Excalibur]

Martyn, I think you're missing several points, mainly that they've no idea who or what you are. They're aiming I think at the people who never thought they needed a licence. I was interested to see that omn one of my increasingly less frequent visits to the hairdressers, she had her PRS licence stuck prominently on the wall. I know she needs it, she knows she needs it, but I bet plenty of Hairdressers and similar don't. If a Burger van has a radio on, then he needs it I believe.

[DK Karaoke]

Martyn, I think you're missing several points, mainly that they've no idea who or what you are. They're aiming I think at the people who never thought they needed a licence.

I'm not missing the point, as you say they've no idea who or what you are, and yes they probably are trying to inform those who do not have one to get one basically. But, why not word the letter differently to achieve this, instead of the blanket letter they sent out.

Its like Dynamic said below:


Kite flying is basically what ive said.....so how is it rubbish Darren?

Would you send a generic letter to all your customers asking if they have paid ther deposits? and if you did, how do you think that you would look in their eyes?......Possibly that you couldnt find your posteriour with both hamds and a mirror? :)

Well said I think

Its not the point that they are kite flying, but more to the point, as an organisation, they dont seem to know what they are doing and to whom they are addressing.

My point is that it costs money to hire all those people to ring people up, send out letters and follow each one up. Not to mention of course the cost of the paper, postage, telephone etc.

Is this how our ProDub fees are being used?

[rob1963]

Way I read it, they have absolutely no idea what you do, or how you operate. Looks like a kite flying exercise to me. ;)

:agree:

[Shakermaker Promotions]

I had a call yesterday and then got a letter this morning.
The call was funny... "Hello, Can I speak to Mr Shaker Market Productions" (Yes, Market!)...
I explained to them that every venue I play in has it's own PRS and even though it's 100% true, they still took my word for it and didn't ask any further questions. The lady then said "You will receive a letter in the post shortly, please ignore it, thankyou for your time"...

That was it. I said to my wife that they are simply going through the Yellow Pages/Thompson etc etc and trying to earn a few extra quid, hoping to catch people out. I didn't find the letter or the call intimidating at all.

[Dynamic Entertainment]

I had a call yesterday and then got a letter this morning.
The call was funny... "Hello, Can I speak to Mr Shaker Market Productions" (Yes, Market!)...
I explained to them that every venue I play in has it's own PRS and even though it's 100% true, they still took my word for it and didn't ask any further questions. The lady then said "You will receive a letter in the post shortly, please ignore it, thankyou for your time"...

That was it. I said to my wife that they are simply going through the Yellow Pages/Thompson etc etc and trying to earn a few extra quid, hoping to catch people out. I didn't find the letter or the call intimidating at all.

From what Darren posted it wasnt intimidating. Just blooming laughable that they have the man hours/money/resources to go stabbing in the dark.

If any of us ran a business like that (and indeed like many government bodies, just to get a dig at the feckless departments we fund) we would be soon out of business.

[Tony Scott]

RECYCLE IT!, move on....job done! :)

[Jiggles]

RECYCLE IT!, move on....job done! :)

Naaa give it to the hamster! :D

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Kite flying is basically what ive said.....so how is it rubbish Darren?



It is rubbish because it is neither threatening or intimidating and I wish you would read the thread before taking my post out of context.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Is this how our ProDub fees are being used?

The Produb is a separate licence. Why would you keep mentioning that for? This letter is talking about a completely separate set of licences.

[Dynamic Entertainment]

It is rubbish because it is neither threatening or intimidating and I wish you would read the thread before taking my post out of context.

Darren. I think we have our wires crossed.

I thought that your "rubbish" statement was refering to the fact that i said maybe they should do their homework before posting out. I had not even mentioned the level of intimidation (or lack of) in the content of their letter. :)


The Produb is a separate licence. Why would you keep mentioning that for? This letter is talking about a completely separate set of licences.

Same group of people though Darren, and you cannot honestly believe that the money doesnt go in a central pot.

Different licences....same bank account :)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Same group of people though Darren, and you cannot honestly believe that the money doesnt go in a central pot.

Different licences....same bank account :)

Incorrect. The Produb is a joint licence from the MCPS and PPL.

[Dynamic Entertainment]

Incorrect. The Produb is a joint licence from the MCPS and PPL.

You know what i mean:o I should have been more specific and put Proportion fo fee....same bank account!

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

You know what i mean:o I should have been more specific and put Proportion fo fee....same bank account!

No, I didn't know what you meant because this is a first time joint venture between 2 separate entities and you said the money ends up in the same bank account which is clearly doesn't.

[Dynamic Entertainment]

But youve heard me refer to the PPL being a joint venture with MCPS before whilst discussing it on other threads....

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

But youve heard me refer to the PPL being a joint venture with MCPS before whilst discussing it on other threads....

Look, this is getting stupid. I am only replying to what you commented on and you said all the money goes into the same account, which it clearly does not.

Let's move on, shall we?

[Dynamic Entertainment]

Ok :) - It was a genuine error (typing without thinking about what i know) and ill hold my hands up to it :)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Ok :) - It was a genuine error (typing without thinking about what i know) and ill hold my hands up to it :)

Fair enough. :)

[Corabar Steve]

I have scanned the letter in to see what others think.

I see they've seen your collection....




With access to over 10 million songs

:sj:

[Excalibur]

I see they've seen your collection....
:sj:


Quote:
With access to over 10 million songs


__________________
Pah! Didn't we have somebody on here offering 15 million the other day? :confused:

[DeckstarDeluxe]

Ive not received a letter or phone call. Wonder why?

As for the letter that Darren posted up you surely can not find that aggressive? If your house is in order there is nothing to worry about?

[DazzyD]

I've never had this letter but the guy I sub from occasionally got one last year. It seemed to think that he operated a venue rather than a mobile disco (which was a bit odd seeing that he has "mobile disco and karaoke" as part of his business name!). He just ignored it because it didn't apply to him. No harm done.


Incorrect. The Produb is a joint licence from the MCPS and PPL.

I was thinking this. I can't remember seeing PRS (Performing Rights Society) on anything to do with ProDub. PRS and PPL are very similar in that they issues licenses for the playing of copyright-protected recordings in public places. MCPS is more concerned with the actually physical copying of mechanically procuded recordings (eg CDS). At least this is the conclusion I have come to from visiting the respective websites. But PRS is not ProDub.


Naaa give it to the hamster! :D

Wouldn't that amount to recycling anyway, Callum?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Well I had the letter first and then the phone call yesterday. I asked her very politely why she was ringing me, whether she was a sub contractor, whether she understood the nature of the licences and which one did she think I should have.

I then told her I worked from home to which she apologised and the conversation was over.

[Daryll]

Same here.
I received the letter , and promptly rang them up , explained that I worked from home , and that was that.

Simples

Daryll

[Excalibur]

Well I had the letter first and then the phone call yesterday. I asked her very politely why she was ringing me, whether she was a sub contractor, whether she understood the nature of the licences and which one did she think I should have.

I then told her I worked from home to which she apologised and the conversation was over.


Same here.
I received the letter , and promptly rang them up , explained that I worked from home , and that was that.

Simples

Daryll
The question springs to mind, if you were seeking somebody to plan, organise, host and generally mastermind an unexpurgated event involving excessive intake of alcohol to the point of inebriation, in a place designed solely for the purpose of fermenting grain products, would the first team you thought of be Produb? I think not. :D :D :D

[welby]

Well, it looks like they are doing more circulars - Just informed them that I work from home and part of terms and conditions was the venue required a PRS Licence.

They updated their records and apologised for bothering me.

Very polite.

[DJWilson]

I got a call two days ago from them, I told them work from home. Then the lady just said she'll update the records.