Exciting & Adventurous..Great Day + New Website that needs reviewing.

[Charlie Brown]

I’m finding this very hard to explain and type up – you’ll have to bear with me.
Today at 12.10pm I merely skipped out of school knowing I was legally allowed to miss cricket for once – something that doesn’t happen very often. ;)

Grabbed a coke and the daily mail from the train station in the hope they would entertain me as I embark on a journey to East Hecklington to meet Julian from UK Brides.

I managed to get off at the right stop to discover I didn’t have any signal to call one of Julian’s team to come and pick me up....dam! I wondered around this lovely village for 20 minutes until I reluctantly asked a nice lady (who worked at the local Nail Parlour) if I could use her phone – sorted!
Anna picked me up in a flash and I was at the hub of UK Bride in minutes. It’s a beautiful converted large barn with several floors. Two receptionists, Accounts team, Design team, IT department etc...Very impressive. I waited in the reception area and after having a brief chat with the polite receptionist Julian invited me up to his office. This was at 2.05pm.

He is a fascinating man with loads to tell. His stories of how he became so successful were interesting. I take my hat off to him and he’s certainly an inspiration. Oddly he reminded me of Darren. :approve:

He then moved onto my business plan......I didn’t have one until 6 hours ago. We discussed what profit I’d like to make in the next year and my outgoings, tax etc. He kindly produced me an excel sheet with my basic outgoings and income...something which any business needs to do!

Julian has devised a plan to turn my “mini business” into a “brand” name that will be recognised all over the East Midlands. His team have kindly designed me a logo and broacher which look outstanding. He gave me a good lesson on marketing which I’ll treasure for life.

The best advice was as follows:
“Provide a high quality service - 100 times better than your competitors and a lot CHEEPER” – The usual defence mechanism regarding DJ’s and prices kicked in. I explained it’s hard to make a living and the perception of DJ’s is being lowered by the minute. PLI, PAT, Music, Fuel are big expenditures BUT...
His idea is to create a brand that will be well known and associated with all parties. We’re talking 10/15 years time...I can dabble in Marquees, Event Planning, Themed Nights, Costume hire etc etc.

As a trial – I have agreed to set a STANDARD fee for all parties - £299. All UK Bride members and possibly Good Party Members can have this service for £199 – That’s £100 of. I’ll be putting a lot of effort into UK Bride sending my new leaflets and letters out via a 2nd class stamp.

£199 at first didn’t seem a lot of money BUT on average it works out to be £150 profit a night. I need to build myself up to a stage where I’m taking on loads of work and people are beginning to recognise my “brand.” Once I’m at a comfortable stage I can start to dish out work. That price will go up to £349 with the same £100 off etc etc.

It’s very hard to explain but I’m pretty confident it will work.
I may try and run two companies alongside each other (Vectis’s new website) and this although that could be a recipe for disaster.

It’s currently branded “Charlie Brown’s Wedding Discos” – I’d love it to be “Charlie Brown’s Marquees” “Charlie Brown’s Event Management” etc etc.
This may seem very adventuress now and OTT but I reckon I can do it. I’m young, keen, and energetic. I have a good few years yet to build and work on my “BRAND” before any major decisions need to be made.

Although I love DJ’ing and would like to keep updating my gear by buying new mixers and booths etc – Seeing Julian and his little empire today inspired me to focus more on making money than doing it as a hobby and buying new equipment because it’s “nice.”

Here’s my new website designed by Martin (Vectis Vibe) – It’s smashing and I love it to bits...but may not fit in with my “Brand” hence the two companies running alongside each other.

http://www.charliebrownsentertainment.com/index.php - need to send in my PAT etc to get the Platinum award.

Whatever happens – I’ve had a great day and learnt a lot. Julian is a great guy with a very supportive team. The only reason he invited me to come up and visit him is because of my comment regarding “who will be the fool this time next year.”

I arrived at 2.05pm and left at 6.52pm....it’s been a hectic and enjoyable day.
Thoughts? Ideas? Am I barmy? What do you think to the site? Obviously the big fading pictures will be changed once the new logo is fitted.

I admit - I'm torn. £199 is a very cheap price....I could take Julian's 15 years experience or ride it alone on instinct.

I really don't know what to do. :o

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Julian is a nice guy, but he doesn't know our business or pricing structure or understand the problems we face.

He is very good at marketing though and shaping people's minds with it too, especially if they are a little younger and a little naive. (Not meant in a nasty way CB)

[StarZSoundS]

but he doesn't know our business or pricing structure or understand the problems we face.




:agree: :agree:

[Charlie Brown]

That's where I'm torn....

[StarZSoundS]

Here’s my new website designed by Martin (Vectis Vibe) – It’s smashing and I love it to bits...but may not fit in with my “Brand” hence the two companies running alongside each other.

http://www.charliebrownsentertainment.com/index.php - need to send in my PAT etc to get the Platinum award.






The design is really eye-catching.Captures everything.Dare I say outstanding!!:beer1: :beer1: :beer1:


QUICK EDIT....I'm referring to Martins Logo....

I'm not sure i'm in love with that Pamphlet thats also pictured!!

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Why would you want to give everyone £100 off?

In a years time, people will still be expecting the same price and not £299. You can't put your prices up £100 in a year. Trust me. You'll lose plenty of custom no matter how good you are.

£199 bookings will gain you £199 bookings.

£400+ bookings will gain you £400+ bookings and the right market to be in if you want to make money.

The brochure and logo is good, but is very clubby looking. Is this what brides want? I am far from convinced they do or perhaps you are aiming for a different market?

Love the new website by the way.

[Ukbride Owner]

Thank you ref design, you can see we put alot of effort into getting it right.

In reply to not knowing the industry I have to confess I don't! Charlie explained to me that sometimes people charge £75 for a disco!!!

I have looked at the poll that I ran for you guys. I have calculated a profit that Charlie would be happy with (he has no kids or mortgage remember), so his prices don't have to match everyone elses.

I have then taken into account the 15 years of mistakes that I have made on the journey to be a millionnaire.

I have made it clear to Charlie that he DOES NOT HAVE TO TAKE MY ADVICE.

But he has been making some big mistakes, as he knows.

Ask yourself this, why is Julian helping Charlie for FREE, why has he taken hours and hours of his and his staffs time to help this 16 year old lad?

Answer: because if I can get a 16 year old with no experience to make money from UKbride, many more of you will sign up to ukbride.

The by product is that Charlie learns a lot and makes a lot along the way (but he will have to work for it)

[Mark Wild]

I sometimes feel you should still be playing football with jumpers for goalposts, eyeing up the local talent and relaxing a little bit more, your 16 Charlie. Obviously a switched on guy but don't forget to enjoy yourself while your young mate. Get yourself to uni, learn some stuff, play some sport, and worry about some of this stuff a little bit later on in your life. Just saying mate. :)

Great brochures btw shame they are aimed at the wrong market, perfect for the "Charlie Brown Discos" I always associate you to though. Great job you and VV have done on the website as well, really nice. ;) :D

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

why is Julian helping Charlie for FREE, why has he taken hours and hours of his and his staffs time to help this 16 year old lad?


Some of us have done this already and not to make money either. ;)

[Excalibur]

Thank you ref design, you can see we put alot of effort into getting it right.

In reply to not knowing the industry I have to confess I don't! Charlie explained to me that sometimes people charge £75 for a disco!!!



Only the upmarket ones, Julian. ;) ;) Round here you can't get more than £60 :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(


Some of us have done this already and not to make money either. ;)

Virtue is its own reward. ;) ;)



Edit: Not everything in the above post is totally, completely, and absolutely serious. You'll have work out which bits for yourselves.

[Vectis]

Oh well I wasn't going to comment publicly in case it was seen as a conflict of interests, but as Julian's jumped in...

... I still won't discuss the design goals and rationale behind the new website :zip:

... but I have some strong thoughts on the UK Bride proposal.

Mainly

1. Everything that Darren has already said
2. This is a ploy to get "bargains" for UK Bride members. Charlie drops his price, UK Bride milk the fact to death and reap the rewards. It's not about a marketing opportunity for Charlie, it's about a marketing opportunity for UKB
3. The marketing materials presented to date:

a) use the wrong type of imagery - as Darren said, it's a wedding not a nightclub
b) are price-focused and not quality or capability-focused
c) in my mind appeal to the spit-n-sawdust, want-everything-for-nothing, backstreet social club type of bride and not the market that Charlie could (and does) aspire to
d) because of b) and c) significantly limit the scope for upselling other products and services and therefore constraining the overall profit opportunity
e) wouldn't appeal to very many folks over the age of about 25 IMHO
f) ignore the CP market entirely

... I think I'll stop there.

[Charlie Brown]

I sometimes feel you should still be playing football with jumpers for goalposts, eyeing up the local talent and relaxing a little bit more, your 16 Charlie. Obviously a switched on guy but don't forget to enjoy yourself while your young mate. Get yourself to uni, learn some stuff, play some sport, and worry about some of this stuff a little bit later on in your life. Just saying mate. :)


You may be right....but I think I would find that a bit degrading and wouldn't have it any other way. I enjoy the challenge...meeting new people...exchanging ideas.

Why should I follow the crowd and spend 5 years messing around? It may be the "norm" but if I'm really really really happy doing what I am now?

I'll be honest...this meeting with Julian today has been something I've been looking forward too from the moment he invited me up. Same with Darren or whenever a new prospect or glimmer of hope to improve what I'm doing comes my way.

Whatever happens - I've still learnt some invaluable lessons today that I'll remember for life.

[Mark Wild]

Whatever happens - I've still learnt some invaluable lessons today that I'll remember for life.

Like what?

[Ukbride Owner]

I have to say I do agree with Mark, this is very early at 16, you are only young once, get the balance right.

The help that Charlie has recieved so far is NOT helping him to even break even. He is too focussed on buying lights instead of making money. He has to learn to budget.

Ref brochures would any of you be happy to put your leaflets on here for me to judge?

[SC Events]

I have to say I do agree with Mark, this is very early at 16, you are only young once, get the balance right.

The help that Charlie has recieved so far is NOT helping him to even break even. He is too focussed on buying lights instead of making money. He has to learn to budget.

Ref brochures would any of you be happy to put your leaflets on here for me to judge?

I would if I had some...anyone fancy something to do to kill some spare time lol :D

[Charlie Brown]

He is too focussed on buying lights instead of making money. He has to learn to budget.


:agree: Very important.

[thex-faders]

Changed your image charlie?
http://www.charliebrownsentertainment.com/images/charliepic.jpg http://www.charliebrownsentertainment.com/about.php

Aside from that, a couple of years back we had a call regarding something similar where we where aksed about an advertising oppertunity with a company linked to the NHS i think? They basically said that for £350 or so we could get an advert placed in a magazine booklet type arrangement that went to every hospital and nurse in the region!

Wow we though, a chance to make it big and start earning the big bucks. The guy who came round to sell us the idea gave us all the figures and said we could increase our turnover and profit 5 fold just through this one source!
Sounded great... and then we came back down to the real world and realised at the end of the day we dont have the time, money nor experiance really to take on the increase workload.

Im sure the meeting was really helpful to you charlie but as you said your young [like me] and if I was you... why not go for it in a couple of years? If you want to be a full time DJ and not go university as you mentioned in a thread a while back then why not carry on how you are gaining the experiance and in a couple of years with a stable brand name under your belt go the full hog and become an agency who provides it all, disco's, marquees etc.

It seems like a bit of a leap in my view. The potential increase in gigs etc is rather steep. could you deal with it?

Hopefully thats useful?
Tom

[Vectis]

He is too focussed on buying lights instead of making money. He has to learn to budget.


:agree: ... and that won't stop until the minute he moves into his own place :p


Ref brochures would any of you be happy to put your leaflets on here for me to judge?

Sure. If I had any. Actually I do, but they're about 3 years old and out of date.

Brochures and my target market are mutually exclusive. I found I was sending out about 3 per year so didn't bother after the first batch.

Nowadays my unconverted customers are offered a personal meeting, or are treated to a bespoke response to their enquiry. Most of my weddings return £400+ and I'm turning work away on a regular basis.

[Excalibur]

The help that Charlie has recieved so far is NOT helping him to even break even. He is too focussed on buying lights instead of making money. He has to learn to budget.
?

" Annual income £20, annual expenditure £19 19s 6d, result: Happiness.
Annual income £20, Annual expenditure £20 0s 6d, result:Misery. "

A virtual pint for the first one to identify the quote.

[Mark Wild]

" Annual income £20, annual expenditure £19 19s 6d, result: Happiness.
Annual income £20, Annual expenditure £20 0s 6d, result:Misery. "

A virtual pint for the first one to identify the quote.

Wilkins Micawber :cool:

[Ukbride Owner]

2. This is a ploy to get "bargains" for UK Bride members. Charlie drops his price, UK Bride milk the fact to death and reap the rewards. It's not about a marketing opportunity for Charlie, it's about a marketing opportunity for UKB

Ehhh? UKbride is charging nothing to Charlie for this work, I don't make ANY money if brides choose to book with Charlie!!!

3. The marketing materials presented to date:

a) use the wrong type of imagery - as Darren said, it's a wedding not a nightclub
b) are price-focused and not quality or capability-focused
c) in my mind appeal to the spit-n-sawdust, want-everything-for-nothing, backstreet social club type of bride and not the market that Charlie could (and does) aspire to
d) because of b) and c) significantly limit the scope for upselling other products and services and therefore constraining the overall profit opportunity
e) wouldn't appeal to very many folks over the age of about 25 IMHO
f) ignore the CP market entirely

... I think I'll stop there.

LOL you are welcome to your OWN opinion :p

[Excalibur]

Wilkins Micawber :cool:

Bog off smartarse. :p :p :D :D :D :D

I'd have settled for : Dickens.;)

[Vectis]

Changed your image charlie?

What, you mean that's NOT Charlie? :confused: Little liar... :D

[SC Events]

" Annual income £20, annual expenditure £19 19s 6d, result: Happiness.
Annual income £20, Annual expenditure £20 0s 6d, result:Misery. "

A virtual pint for the first one to identify the quote.

Will this do....It was said by Mr Wilkins Micawber in Charles Dickins' David Copperfield. :D

EDIT: Just saw Mr Bellshill`s reply, beat me to it!

[Vectis]

Ehhh? UKbride is charging nothing to Charlie for this work, I don't make ANY money if brides choose to book with Charlie!!!

So there's nothing at all on your website exploiting "exclusive offers" made by UK Bride advertisers to UK Bride members?

[StarZSoundS]

He is too focussed on buying lights instead of making money.



Have you any idea of the responsibility it is to be the 3rd most important person at a strangers wedding Julian.

Having the success of that couples special day more or less solely in your hands.Charlie needs hands on experience and may feel that having the latest lights will get him another succesful wedding under his belt.I would strongly suggest that this is what Charlie needs most at the moment....not a clubby type brochure thats going to make him even more of a nervous wreck!!

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

[Ukbride Owner]

Sure. If I had any. Actually I do, but they're about 3 years old and out of date.

Brochures and my target market are mutually exclusive. I found I was sending out about 3 per year so didn't bother after the first batch.

Nowadays my unconverted customers are offered a personal meeting, or are treated to a bespoke response to their enquiry. Most of my weddings return £400+ and I'm turning work away on a regular basis.

Out of interest how many £400 bookings do you actually do per year?

Just because Charlie will send out hundreds of brochures every month (not 3 a year) doesnt mean that quality will stop, or bespoke services are offered of a personal meeting removed.

Quite the opposite, to make big money you HAVE to work hard, probably harder than many of you (in the first few years). But Charlie and I have a plan to work SMART. Hard first, smart later!!! :) :) :)

Also the brochure is aimed ONLY at the wedding market and only set to UKbride members (other brochure will be needed which are CUSTOM built to different targets).

Charlie's brand is a National looking brand (unlike his website at the moment which looks local). Design is in the eye of the beholder so none of your personal comments are wrong.

BUT, it cannot be denied that it is professional looking, eye catching and although I think the 'clubbing' comment is fair, the UKbride member who receives will not confuse it with a nightclub, as we have subtly including wedding images.

In this cost concious state of mind that we are in at the moment, brides are (unfortunately) thinking, costs FIRST, quality second.

Charlie and I will tap into that thinking!!! :) :) :)

[Charlie Brown]

Like what?

Accounts - how to do my books. Basic stuff I didn't know about. Spreadsheets etc.
Tax - The ins and outs.
Marketing - Vital tools and tips that have helped Julian that I can deploy into my own business.
Freebies - Letterheads, Business Cards, Leaflet, Logo, Extra stuff on the UK Bride site.
Experience - I love chatting and talking to successful people - maybe why Darren and I get on? I like to listen and put their advice into practise?
Skipped games - Bonus. :p


If you want to be a full time DJ and not go university as you mentioned in a thread a while back then why not carry on how you are gaining the experiance and in a couple of years with a stable brand name under your belt go the full hog and become an agency who provides it all, disco's, marquees etc.

It seems like a bit of a leap in my view. The potential increase in gigs etc is rather steep. could you deal with it?


Howdy Tom,

That's grand but WHY should our/my age effect when we do things? What's stopping us now?

I don't get what "waiting" has to achieve? The sooner I/We start - the quicker we're out there - building our "brand" and "company."


Have you any idea of the responsibility it is to be the 3rd most important person at a strangers wedding Julian.

Having the success of that couples special day more or less solely in your hands.Charlie needs hands on experience and may feel that having the latest lights will get him another succesful wedding under his belt.I would strongly suggest that this is what Charlie needs most at the moment....not a clubby type brochure thats going to make him even more of a nervous wreck!!

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Marketing and equipment is very different. After looking at the budget Julian spends on Marketing - I don't think DJ's do enough. What will get you more bookings? A new flashing light or some investment in Google etc? ;)

[STEVE HANLEY]

Charlie you go for it mate.........Big respect.

Awesome website by the way, If the one I'm getting Vectis to do for me is anywhere near as good. I'll be a happy man.:D :)

[Ukbride Owner]

So there's nothing at all on your website exploiting "exclusive offers" made by UK Bride advertisers to UK Bride members?

EXPLOITING??? no

We asked our brides if our advertisers offered an exclusive discount to UKbride members would you

a) Definitely use them
b) Definitely look into them in more detail
c) Would make no difference at all

The resounding answer was b

I make NO money from sales of the services that are offered!!!

[Vectis]

Out of interest how many £400 bookings do you actually do per year?

More than target for the last 3 years running.





In this cost concious state of mind that we are in at the moment, brides are (unfortunately) thinking, costs FIRST, quality second.

Charlie and I will tap into that thinking!!! :) :) :)

There always have been and always will be cheapskates. This won't go away when/if the "cost consciousness state of mind" recedes. UK Bride has already been shown to be doing a great job of targeting this sector and I take my hat off to you for your achievements in this space.

However there are many wedding couples for whom quality, capability and value come way above price on their list of requirements.

[thex-faders]

Howdy Tom,

That's grand but WHY should our/my age effect when we do things? What's stopping us now?

I don't get what "waiting" has to achieve? The sooner I/We start - the quicker we're out there - building our "brand" and "company."


I was basing it on my own experiance. started Djing at 16, friends birthday etc, then moved on to more gigs through collage and now we are doing 2 /3 gigs a month whilst at uni. Its been a natural progression.

If your not considering uni at all then by all means go for it tbh. Once im done at uni ill be looking for a full time job so will be looking at Djing to fill the gap in between, and if nothing takes of DJing may become a full time occupation.

Im just saying your business can progress naturally with you. If uni is definately out of the picture for you then by all means. put all your eefort and time into it. But I think there is an option to do it at a later date if you think uni will be a good option [Which i think it is! Check out the facebook for the numerous photos of nights out, the girls and the general good times! facebook.com/DJTomR]

Best of luck whatever your decision buddy!
Tom

[Vectis]

EXPLOITING??? no

...

I make NO money from sales of the services that are offered!!!

I never implied that you did.

But you DO see increased traffic across your site as a result of promoting "exclusive" offers by your advertisers to your members, as you've confirmed above.

Increased traffic = increased sales opportunities therefore you DO (albeit indirectly) benefit financially.

[Ukbride Owner]

You must also all remember that I can ask ANY question to the members and very quickly get a 1,000 answers. This helps me to make the right decisions. It's very powerful.

Charlie has seen today just how many members we get every day, he has seen just how much one months of membership looks like.

I have been open with him and showed him my Google account and Facebook account he has seen that I have spent THOUSANDS of pounds to market UKbride.

The big point I wanted to get across to Charlie was that the cost of promotion isn't an issue IF the reward is HIGHER!!!

Watch this space Doubting Thomases, my reward is helping Charlie make lots of money, I vow not to take a PENNY from him!!!


More than target for the last 3 years running.




Your reluctance to give me a number speaks volumes! :D :D :D

[WWDJ]

A new flashing light or some investment in Google etc? ;)

Well not the flashing light for sure, but get in the Google game and you can spend money faster than my missus if you are not very careful.

Network, talk to venues and personal recommendation and you will soon fill most of the 52 saturdays in a year. Remember there is only one of you too.

It's ok giving the impression of being a national business, but with petrol at night on £6 a gallon (leaving aside the hours involved), do you really want to be, because are you really going to make any more money?

"Turnover is vanity, profit is sanity ......"

[StarZSoundS]

EXPLOITING??? no

I make NO money from sales of the services that are offered!!!


I genuinely think Julian is using the exercise to try and get inside the Head of a DJ...Which is fair enough.God knows what he'll find when he gets there!!:eek: :eek: :eek:


Charlie ....calm down.You are acting a bit like somebody who's been playing for the under-16's.... who's been allowed to train with Drogba,Terry and Lampard.;) ;) ;) ;)

[Vectis]

Your reluctance to give me a number speaks volumes! :D :D :D

Not a problem; I'm just not a paid-up member of the MDD willy waving club but for you I'll make an exception.

2009-10 Target gigs 100; Wedding/Corporate 60; Other 40
Actual Wedding/Corporate 68; Other 39

2008-09 Target gigs 100; Wedding/Corporate 60; Other 40
Actual Wedding/Corporate 72; Other 45

2007-08 Target gigs 80; Wedding/Corporate 50 Other 30
Actual Wedding/Corporate 52 Other 55

Virtually all Wedding/Corporate gigs have a "from" price of £395 for a basic 4-hour evening disco. Virtually all are upsold extras and £700-800 is not uncommon.

The '100 gig limit' is self-imposed as it's all I can cope with due to other interests, and I have no ambition to scale out beyond just me.

[Ukbride Owner]

Well not the flashing light for sure, but get in the Google game and you can spend money faster than my missus if you are not very careful. VERY TRUE GOOGLE IS DANGEROUS IF NOT HANDLED CORRECTLY!!!

Network, talk to venues and personal recommendation and you will soon fill most of the 52 saturdays in a year. Remember there is only one of you too. ALSO VERY TRUE, CHARLIE HAS BEEN ADVISED TO USE UKBRIDE AS ONLY ONE OF HIS MARKETING AVENUES


"Turnover is vanity, profit is sanity ......"

AGAIN VERY TRUE, TODAY CONVERSATION HAS ONLY BEEN ABOUT MAKING MONEY!!!


:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

[Mark Wild]

I think it was very clever, I mean kind, of Julian to dedicate a whole afternoon of his time to young Charlie, such a selfless thing to do :beer1: :beer1: :beer1: :D

[Ukbride Owner]

Not a problem; I'm just not a paid-up member of the MDD willy waving club but for you I'll make an exception.

2009-10 Target gigs 100; Wedding/Corporate 60; Other 40
Actual Wedding/Corporate 68; Other 39

2008-09 Target gigs 100; Wedding/Corporate 60; Other 40
Actual Wedding/Corporate 72; Other 45

2007-08 Target gigs 80; Wedding/Corporate 50 Other 30
Actual Wedding/Corporate 52 Other 55

Virtually all Wedding/Corporate gigs have a "from" price of £395 for a basic 4-hour evening disco. Virtually all are upsold extras and £700-800 is not uncommon.

The '100 gig limit' is self-imposed as it's all I can cope with due to other interests, and I have no ambition to scale out beyond just me.

I shall 'assume' this 'alleged' figures are correct ;)

Thank you for sharing them with us ;) ;) ;)

[simonp]

I shall 'assume' this 'alleged' figures are correct ;)

Incoming :sofa:

[Ukbride Owner]

I think it was very clever, I mean kind, of Julian to dedicate a whole afternoon of his time to young Charlie, such a selfless thing to do :beer1: :beer1: :beer1: :D

That is really kind of you!!!

However, I detect that you are cynical.

I made it clear why I have been helping Charlie. His success is the by product of proving some of you wrong (many of you are now clients of mine).

If a 16 year old makes a lot of money from the site, you couldn't put it down to experience!!! It is only the site and my experience that will make it work!

Good night all, thanks for your time again, always a pleasure ;) ;) ;)

[rob1963]

Hi Charlie,

Great to hear about your enjoyable day & how inspired you were...and I wish you all the very best with your new ideas.

A couple of points.

Firstly, on the new logo you put in your first post, if it didn't say Charlie Brown's wedding discos, the picture would suggest to me that it was either Charlie Brown's club nights or Charlie Brown's 18th birthday parties.

Secondly, I like the new website. However, on the "Meet Charlie Brown" page, it says "Hello...I'm Charlie" right next to a picture of a GIRL! (and one with even more wild hair than you!). It might be an idea to change the pic to one of yourself!

Hope this helps.

:)

[Mark Wild]

That is really kind of you!!!

However, I detect that you are cynical.


Goodnight Doubting Thomas :)

[Vectis]

I shall 'assume' this 'alleged' figures are correct ;)

Eh? :confused:

http://www.vectisvibe.com/2009/pages/quote-fmw.php

http://www.vectisvibe.com/2009/pages/diary.php

[Corabar Entertainment]

He is too focussed on buying lights instead of making money. He has to learn to budget.You'll get no arguments from anyone on here about that, and it's something that has been mentioned to Charlie by more than one member on here on several occasions.

However, I am extremely disappointed to note that your 'marketing strategy' really boils down to "Sell it cheap".

We have spent YEARS trying to get across to people (both DJs and clients) that DJs should not be cheap, and considerable inroads have been made on this. If we all adopted your policies, most of us would be in the gutter rather quickly.

Each time marketing has been mentioned, you have suggested pricing / undercutting, Julian. Surely you will accept that is not the only way to market yourself?


Just because Charlie will send out hundreds of brochures every month (not 3 a year) doesnt mean that quality will stop, or bespoke services are offered of a personal meeting removed....and yet with doing all this, plus the other things mentioned elsewhere in this thread, you are budgeting Charlie's overheads at £50 per gig? You must give me the names of some of your suppliers! :lol: To do that, some serious corners would have to be cut somewhere!

[Charlie Brown]

''

[Corabar Entertainment]

I shall 'assume' this 'alleged' figures are correct ;) Sorry Julian - but that is just rude! :mad:

[Charlie Brown]

Secondly, I like the new website. However, on the "Meet Charlie Brown" page, it says "Hello...I'm Charlie" right next to a picture of a GIRL! (and one with even more wild hair than you!). It might be an idea to change the pic to one of yourself!

Hope this helps.



:lol:

That made me laugh - I don't intend on keeping it there...just need a good picture of me when I'm not looking too orange ;)

Thank you for your input. Glad you like it! :approve:

[Charlie Brown]

=
...and yet with doing all this, plus the other things mentioned elsewhere in this thread, you are budgeting Charlie's overheads at £50 per gig? You must give me the names of some of your suppliers! :lol: To do that, some serious corners would have to be cut somewhere!

Probably cheaper than that.

£850ish a year are my outgoings and £20 a gig to pay Dad for fuel.

£30 Music budget a month. - £360

£81.50 a year for PLI.

£65 for PAT.

£72.50 per month (mum pays half) for Phone Bill - £870 but halved £435

£400 a year on Marketing.

What else is there I'm missing?

[Corabar Entertainment]

If a 16 year old makes a lot of money from the site, you couldn't put it down to experience!!! It is only the site and my experience that will make it work!There will always be plenty of people who buy 'cheap'... it doesn't take a marketing genius to sort that one out!

You do need to bear in mind with our market, that there are a finite number of events that can be done by a DJ.

The vast majority of weddings are on Saturdays, and there are only 52 weeks in a year. Yes, there are some on other days of the week and we all pick up some of those, but Saturdays will always be the mainstay of the wedding DJ. 52 x £199? Just over £10K annual turnover (never mind profit!)

Now, what might be useful, would be tips on how to persuade brides to buy quality, rather than price - after all, 'bargains' aren't always the cheapest!

[WWDJ]

Probably cheaper than that.

£850ish a year are my outgoings and £20 a gig to pay Dad for fuel.

£30 Music budget a month. - £360

£81.50 a year for PLI.

£65 for PAT.

£72.50 per month (mum pays half) for Phone Bill - £870 but halved £435

£400 a year on Marketing.

What else is there I'm missing?

Well assuming these are your cost of sales ....
- New equipment to replace any that breaks or repairs to said equipment
- Produb?
- Contribution to car tax, repairs and insurance
- .....
- 20 quid a month to keep your hair orange ;)

[DJ James Lake]

Also the brochure is aimed ONLY at the wedding market and only set to UKbride members (other brochure will be needed which are CUSTOM built to different targets).

Charlie's brand is a National looking brand (unlike his website at the moment which looks local). Design is in the eye of the beholder so none of your personal comments are wrong.

BUT, it cannot be denied that it is professional looking, eye catching and although I think the 'clubbing' comment is fair, the UKbride member who receives will not confuse it with a nightclub, as we have subtly including wedding images.

In this cost concious state of mind that we are in at the moment, brides are (unfortunately) thinking, costs FIRST, quality second.

Charlie and I will tap into that thinking!!! :) :) :)

Speaking personally from a graphic design background and also knowing the wedding market extremely well (no £200 weddings here either) the design is great but so far off the mark for the targetted audience its unreal unless your brides are all of this type.

http://therhonddarover.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/chav.jpg

Charlie if you want to make it into the better paid work make it classy, this design would be great for getting you plenty of 18ths but forget it if you think its going to get you weddings.

[WWDJ]

http://www.vectisvibe.com/2009/pages/diary.php

Vectis ... are you really unavailable, provisionally booked or booked until the end of 2018 ? :eek:

[Corabar Entertainment]

Probably cheaper than that.

£850ish a year are my outgoings and £20 a gig to pay Dad for fuel.

£30 Music budget a month. - £360

£81.50 a year for PLI.

£65 for PAT.

£72.50 per month (mum pays half) for Phone Bill - £870 but halved £435

£400 a year on Marketing.

What else is there I'm missing?

Stationery, printing, TAX, NI, computer, other office machinery (printer?), mobile, broadband connection, equipment repair/maintenance/replacement..... we could go on and on for ever here!

Plus, if you're going to be sending out hundreds of leaflets a month (as Julian said) I'd rethink that £400 marketing budget. (After all, it will cost you considerably more than that just to stay on UK Bride after the first year ;) ... let alone any other marketing you want to do.)

Then, of course, we've got to look at the fact that you will hopefully be driving your self soon, and then have all the costs of the vehicle to factor in.

[Vectis]

Vectis ... are you really unavailable, provisionally booked or booked until the end of 2018 ? :eek:

Huh?

I'm scaling down the disco work to around 50 gigs next year and I'm going to be very choosy about what and where. Top paying easy gigs only for me :)

[StarZSoundS]

You do need to bear in mind with our market, that there are a finite number of events that can be done by a DJ.



Now, what might be useful, would be tips on how to persuade brides to

I think the first problem is what Folk outside of the business find hardest to grasp.

Maybe we need tips on how to persuade Brides to get married on Mon/Tues/Wed/Thurs...etc??;) ;) ;)

[Charlie Brown]

Why do my threads always turn into something......odd?

Night all - A lot to think about.

[STEVE HANLEY]

There will always be plenty of people who buy 'cheap'... it doesn't take a marketing genius to sort that one out!

You do need to bear in mind with our market, that there are a finite number of events that can be done by a DJ.

The vast majority of weddings are on Saturdays, and there are only 52 weeks in a year. Yes, there are some on other days of the week and we all pick up some of those, but Saturdays will always be the mainstay of the wedding DJ. 52 x £199? Just over £10K annual turnover (never mind profit!)

Now, what might be useful, would be tips on how to persuade brides to buy quality, rather than price - after all, 'bargains' aren't always the cheapest!

Very wise words Angela.... I have had several calls from Anna but we keep missing each other. I intend to speak to her tomorrow. I'd love to invest but I am still sceptical.

One thing I will say though if it works it's a lot cheaper and a lot less hassle than doing wedding fayres. But what I've seen so far that's still to be proven

[DJ INDIE]

That's where I'm torn....

Im really enjoying this thread;

We have a very successful guy here - purely business based and its good to see his strategies:

I completely get Julians model, and from what Charlie's mentioned can see the long term intention, and that starts with the reflected price (blow all competition out of the water, right? on a price and professional look basis) then with the gigs, use that money to expand in time, whilst enhancing and developing the brand. The brand name then becomes synomonous with the product.

That development in itself will keep future advertising down as a lot of the ground work will have been done and developed.

I also think he's not thinking a one man business here long term, which is where his model comes in:

sell 10 apples for £1 each = £10
sell 100 apples for £50p = £50

thats £40 extra - and before anyone jumps in - it doesnt have to be charlie doing the work does it? therefore multi-ops, subbing work out etc etc


Whats more frightening (and ive sussed it for a while) once you have the marketting model etc - i reckon nowadays you can create a successful business in most trades by simple online marketting. Regardless of your competency.

I know if I had more money to invest in my business I could double turnover almost overnight AND apply the same model to add ons and other businesses.



this threads a definite good conflict of interest.

[Excalibur]

I could foresee a problem if I were to offer a £100 discount to brides.
































I'd be paying them £40 a gig!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

[wensleydale]

I disagree with a lot of this Charlie and would be very careful what you do- I dont agree at all that for the business to do well you need to be cheaper.

Thats not really clever marketing.

[Steve the DJ]

Why do my threads always turn into something......odd?

Night all - A lot to think about.

Not odd, just that the more experienced members bring you back down to earth and it's that grounding and balance that you need at this time young Skywalker. ;)

We can't have you getting carried away, it has to be offset by some reality.

By the way I like the flyer design, really smart, great for a generalist mobile DJ business but not soft enough for the Wedding market IMHO.

Remember who you are selling to if you want to earn a good fee.

[StarZSoundS]

Julian....

The logo guy in your office!!!

Would he knock one up for me.....happy to pay!!!

Not sure what I'm going to do with it when I get it but it may be fun??

Not sure my market would support the guy with two turntables mixing tho...

It needs to appeal to the more Senior primarily.You know Incontinence pads,Mobility Scooters,Roll-Up Fags...that sort of thing.

Joking aside...it may be something on here others are interested in??

[Corabar Entertainment]

Im really enjoying this thread;

We have a very successful guy here - purely business based and its good to see his strategies:

I completely get Julians model, and from what Charlie's mentioned can see the long term intention, and that starts with the reflected price (blow all competition out of the water, right? on a price and professional look basis) then with the gigs, use that money to expand in time, whilst enhancing and developing the brand. The brand name then becomes synomonous with the product.

That development in itself will keep future advertising down as a lot of the ground work will have been done and developed.

I also think he's not thinking a one man business here long term, which is where his model comes in:

sell 10 apples for £1 each = £10
sell 100 apples for £50p = £50

thats £40 extra - and before anyone jumps in - it doesnt have to be charlie doing the work does it? therefore multi-ops, subbing work out etc etc


Whats more frightening (and ive sussed it for a while) once you have the marketting model etc - i reckon nowadays you can create a successful business in most trades by simple online marketting. Regardless of your competency.

I know if I had more money to invest in my business I could double turnover almost overnight AND apply the same model to add ons and other businesses.



this threads a definite good conflict of interest.Understand where you're coming from, and agree with some of what you say, but we are talking about a business model specifically for Charlie here: he is a one-man operation at the moment and I doubt that he has loads of money to invest (remember that Charlie recently told us that he couldn't afford to stay on at his school of choice).


Joking aside...it may be something on here others are interested in??Martin, you do know that we already have rather talented graphic design persons on this forum, don't you? :confused:

[Charlie Brown]

Im really enjoying this thread;

We have a very successful guy here - purely business based and its good to see his strategies:

I completely get Julians model, and from what Charlie's mentioned can see the long term intention, and that starts with the reflected price (blow all competition out of the water, right? on a price and professional look basis) then with the gigs, use that money to expand in time, whilst enhancing and developing the brand. The brand name then becomes synomonous with the product.

That development in itself will keep future advertising down as a lot of the ground work will have been done and developed.

I also think he's not thinking a one man business here long term, which is where his model comes in:

sell 10 apples for £1 each = £10
sell 100 apples for £50p = £50

thats £40 extra - and before anyone jumps in - it doesnt have to be charlie doing the work does it? therefore multi-ops, subbing work out etc etc


Whats more frightening (and ive sussed it for a while) once you have the marketting model etc - i reckon nowadays you can create a successful business in most trades by simple online marketting. Regardless of your competency.

I know if I had more money to invest in my business I could double turnover almost overnight AND apply the same model to add ons and other businesses.



this threads a definite good conflict of interest.
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Thank you! It may be ambiguous but in time could be done. I know it's not an overnight job and could take 10 years. If people really thought about it and not switch off at the sign of £199...then it's actually a clever idea. However - Angela is right - I need to see EXACTLY what my overheads are. It may not be feasible at £199.


I could foresee a problem if I were to offer a £100 discount to brides.



I'd be paying them £40 a gig!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

:lol: :D



Thats not really clever marketing.

Selling better but cheaper than competitors on a large scale isn't good marketing? What would happen if Coca-Cola started selling their tins of coke at £1.50? Would people still buy it or go for Pepsi which is only £0.79?


Not odd, just that the more experienced members bring you back down to earth and it's that grounding and balance that you need at this time young Skywalker. ;)

We can't have you getting carried away, it has to be offset by some reality.

By the way I like the flyer design, really smart, great for a generalist mobile DJ business but not soft enough for the Wedding market IMHO.

Remember who you are selling to if you want to earn a good fee.

Cheers Steve. You may be right...it probably wouldn't focus on the high end of the market - something which I really wanted to do - but if you look at the Stats from UK Bride it's very clear that people do want to spent under £300.


Julian....

Joking aside...it may be something on here others are interested in??

If people are moaning about £117....they'd probably have a heart attack when they see the design prices.

It actually may not work....

Let's say we brought the £199 up to £249. Overheads are £40 each gig so profit is £209. If you had 10 guys out you would have to pay them £100 each to make an okay profit. Maybe not feasible.

[Charlie Brown]

(remember that Charlie recently told us that he couldn't afford to stay on at his school of choice).


.....I can IF I'm going to do well....it's a waste of money/can't afford to throw that money away - If I'm more focused on this than Othello. :D

[StarZSoundS]

Martin, you do know that we already have rather talented graphic design persons on this forum, don't you? :confused:


Nope Angie!!

Please tell.......


Lots of other "new" members might be interested!!:) :) :) :) :) :) :)

[Vectis]

My advice to Charlie (who is understandably keen to trial the UKB plan) is as follows.

1. Develop the Charlie Brown's Entertainment brand for the custom and bespoke market - sell it through hotels, manors, fayres etc. and deliver the customer planning meetings and a range of extras

2. Retain the Charlie Brown's Disco brand (which was to be superceded by Entertainment) and repackage this in the UKB model as a fixed-price no-frills offering which, to be honest, could be delivered by a fairly competent DJ using a minimum standard of equipment and therefore easy to multi-op or sub out if necessary should the volume be too much for one man. Your £199 would get you a 4/5 hour evening gig with your first dance requests and that's about it.

Use common imagery and styling to link the two brands but keep them sufficiently distant in case one needs to be dropped.

I think this will allow Charlie to experiment without a great deal of risk involved.

[Marc J]

Martin, you do know that we already have rather talented graphic design persons on this forum, don't you? :confused:


Nope Angie!!

Please tell.......


Lots of other "new" members might be interested!!:) :) :) :) :) :) :)

Shaun (EliteDJ) for one.

Nice new site Charlie (and Martin). Just a few points: -

1) I'd put a link to the contact page in the main navigation. There is a large graphic link on most pages, and a small link in the footer, but it should be easily linked to from every page.

2) Not sure about the background - looks too much like wallpaper to me!

3) I'm not usually a stickler for validation but 160 errors? Mostly all fixed by using self closing tags so easy enough!

[soundtracker]

When I was a young lad(about age 17 - many many years ago) We started up a little disco locally to us, coz in all honesty, We didn't think that those around at the time were much cop! Most of them were charging £20 a night, which sounds pitiful, but was actually in line with what I was earning a week when I started with Natwest. So we(my mates & me) went into the market at £15.00, undercutting everybody, much to their annoyance, and picking up bookings, just on price. However we worked hard at our product(probably without much forethought!) and made sure that people had a great night, and wanted to book us. This worked like a dream, and within two years we ended up working 3 or 4 nights a week, despite the fact that by now, we had increased our prices significantly, and were actually the most expensive outfit locally.
My point is (oh yes, there is one!) I fully understand where Julian's advice is coming from, as its exactly the same as we did, however, we never had the balls to see it through to anything other than a local success, possibly due to the fact that in the 70's it was much more difficult to get the exposure now afforded by t'internet, and also that we had "steady" day jobs and careers that would have been hard to walk away from.
Having said all that Charlie, looking back, we all agree that we spent far too much time DJing, and not enough on wine, women and general debauchery, so it is essential to get that work/life balance right.
Sixteen is very young, let your (extremely) blonde hair down, have a good time, get some qualifications, do the "Uni"thing, and then when you have a little more life experience under your belt, concentrate on taking over the world.

[Paul The Party Dj]

Good grief - what a fascinating thread!

I should point out / remind everybody that I have signed up to UK Brides.

I think it's a shame Julian hasn't been a forum member for longer because he obviously doesn't appreciate the proven credibility of many of the members.

My ten pence worth ...

£199 is not the price of a top Wedding DJ - it's not even half the price of a top Wedding DJ. For me £199 is maybe an easy Friday night mates rate (prepares to be shot down) gig finishing before 12.

If Charlie was my son (Joe my son is 16) I'd be encouraging him to continue to Uni if his grades were good enough and he wanted to go. He could gain a lot more life experience in the long term that way - plenty of opportunities to get involved in running big events / student radio / long holiday breaks to still do Wedding gigs etc.

In business setting targets and planning are everything. I think all our young forum members should consider business studies as an option at school / college.

Cheers everyone ;o)

[Vectis]

1) I'd put a link to the contact page in the main navigation. There is a large graphic link on most pages, and a small link in the footer, but it should be easily linked to from every page.


The intent was to have the phone number with the logo but as the logo isn't settled yet... I'm in agreement with your point though :)




2) Not sure about the background - looks too much like wallpaper to me!


That's not my first choice... but the customer is always right don't you know? ;)




3) I'm not usually a stickler for validation but 160 errors? Mostly all fixed by using self closing tags so easy enough!

And the customer sometimes lets the cat out of the bag a little bit too soon for my liking... ;) Once the branding issues are sorted and agreed there's still a fair bit of optimisation and tweaking to be done on the code.

[wensleydale]

Not sure I get your point about coke Charlie.
Whilst they aren't more expensive than Pepsi they also aren't a lot cheaper.

But more importantly coke is something where the supply is essentially unlimited.
At the moment there is only one of you.

[A1DL]

Selling better but cheaper than competitors on a large scale isn't good marketing?


Charlie - on a national/international scale it possibly is for some businesses, generally those selling products as opposed to services.

Coca Cola have >90,000 employees, turnover ~$30billion and earnings of ~$6billion net profit before tax.

You are an individual schoolboy doing mobile discos in between your studies, sport & girlfriends, talking of a £400 marketing budget.

You're really not comparing apples with apples. Planet earth to Charlie, come back down here please! :)

[[email protected]]

My advice to Charlie (who is understandably keen to trial the UKB plan) is as follows.

1. Develop the Charlie Brown's Entertainment brand for the custom and bespoke market - sell it through hotels, manors, fayres etc. and deliver the customer planning meetings and a range of extras

2. Retain the Charlie Brown's Disco brand (which was to be superceded by Entertainment) and repackage this in the UKB model as a fixed-price no-frills offering which, to be honest, could be delivered by a fairly competent DJ using a minimum standard of equipment and therefore easy to multi-op or sub out if necessary should the volume be too much for one man. Your £199 would get you a 4/5 hour evening gig with your first dance requests and that's about it.

Use common imagery and styling to link the two brands but keep them sufficiently distant in case one needs to be dropped.

I think this will allow Charlie to experiment without a great deal of risk involved.

:agree:

I think that's excellent advice Martin! :)

[Steve the DJ]

Cheers Steve. You may be right...

I am... ;)


...it probably wouldn't focus on the high end of the market - something which I really wanted to do...

Then do it!

Spend your money on targeting the right clients and producing a quality brand, not on attracting lots and lots of business at a lower price.

Fundamentally (IMHO), I think you are the wrong age to be committing to high volume, low value work.

When you don't have high overheads and lots of existing commitments is exactly the time when you can afford to build a bespoke business model that is fussy, try doing that when your kids don't eat or you lose the roof over your head if you don't work. :eek:


...but if you look at the Stats from UK Bride it's very clear that people do want to spent under £300.

And people wonder why I don't want to waste my money on it... :lol:


You are an individual schoolboy doing mobile discos in between your studies, sport & girlfriends, talking of a £400 marketing budget.

You're really not comparing apples with apples. Planet earth to Charlie, come back down here please! :)

:approve:

[DJ James Lake]

:agree:

I think that's excellent advice Martin! :)

It is good advice but for it to work the marketing has to be spot on, which at the moment with the designs as they are it is not.

Because of your age Charlie, you will struggle to get accepted as a professional as all of us that started out young did.

A lot of people see young dj's stereotypically that they are only going to play up to date music which in most cases is completely wrong, the flyer design will put that image in some people minds as it just shouts out clubby which could put potential brides off in a flash is it really worth the risk of alienating clients before you even get a chance to sell yourself?

Its really great you are taking things seriously and good luck to you in the future but for any business to succeed you need the correct tools to start with.

The flyer design would be great for the younger end of the market for 18ths etc but definitely not for weddings which are a classy event (on the whole) and the design should reflect this. If you want upmarket have upmarket marketing materials not what the local club hands out on a friday night.

If you want a good idea, take a walk round your local wedding shops and look at the other literature about and you'll see what I mean.

I am not convinced that the advice you have been given is 100% right for your business and personally anything coming from a salesman who has at the end of the day is trying to get you to part with cash should be taken with a pinch of salt.

[Charlie Brown]

:agree:

I think that's excellent advice Martin! :)

:agree:

You may all think I'm a tad odd for wanting to start "properly" at 16 but I have this spark inside of me. It's telling and wanting me to push myself. I want the challenge. I'm going to make a ton of mistakes - but hey, that's how we learn? Something is bugging me to go for it. At the moment I still have school, going out, mates, girls and the rest of it and that won't change - but the thought of taking a back-seat now and just waiting for the phone to ring occasionally makes me sad.

I think it' a major risk. What harm will it do though? Pay for a website - £99 for 500 leaflets to be professionally printed - load of 2nd class stamps - done. I could always try it for a year...I'll only end up working hard? What happens if it's a success and I can have people work for me? It could be an epic fail and I could loose money? At the end of the day our job is to make money. Trying a different campaign or strategy won't harm. Taking a back-seat is defiantly out of the equation. :o

Once you meet me in person - You'll understand why.

[Charlie Brown]

My UK bride advert has been tweaked for 4 hours....I now have my first enquiry.....Turns out she's in bloody Skegeness. :sj:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

The help that Charlie has recieved so far is NOT helping him to even break even.

I could take that as a personal insult as I have given a lot of my time to Charlie. Did you know Julian that he has stayed at my house twice for 2-3 days at a time so that he could 'shadow' me and learn and experience what I do?



However, I am extremely disappointed to note that your 'marketing strategy' really boils down to "Sell it cheap".


I agree. Do you tell wedding photographers or bridal fashion companies the same?



I think it's a shame Julian hasn't been a forum member for longer because he obviously doesn't appreciate the proven credibility of many of the members.


Very true.

[WWDJ]

My UK bride advert has been tweaked for 4 hours....I now have my first enquiry.....Turns out she's in bloody Skegeness. :sj:

That's the joy of being national not local :) ... more tweaking required ?

[StarZSoundS]

My UK bride advert has been tweaked for 4 hours....I now have my first enquiry.....Turns out she's in bloody Skegeness. :sj:


Does that mean you are now looking for a DJ with ridiculous Blonde Hair and Glasses in Mablethorpe!!!:devil: :devil: :devil: :devil: :devil: :devil:

[Charlie Brown]

:lol:

Yes...maybe to make this scheme work you need to be 40 with plenty of cash and experience.

Julian and I could be being a bit ambiguous.

[andyw]

I could foresee a problem if I were to offer a £100 discount to brides.


I'd be paying them £40 a gig!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

your lucky, you would never get away with just paying that down here.:)

charlie, i think you are fantastic, so enthusiastic it is brilliant. i am all for you having a good bussiness model and a decent plan, if what julian is doing is good for you then fine go for it, remember all the costings if you are going to do this full time then include money that you will need to live on. i think martins advice is spot on and could work for you, my advice is take a step back, and carefully think of all the options open to you and make the most of them, try to give yourself a good back up plan so if 2/3 years from now you decide it's not working/or your dont want to do it no more then you have something to fall back on.

[Charlie Brown]

charlie, i think you are fantastic, so enthusiastic it is brilliant. i am all for you having a good bussiness model and a decent plan, if what julian is doing is good for you then fine go for it, remember all the costings if you are going to do this full time then include money that you will need to live on. i think martins advice is spot on and could work for you, my advice is take a step back, and carefully think of all the options open to you and make the most of them, try to give yourself a good back up plan so if 2/3 years from now you decide it's not working/or your dont want to do it no more then you have something to fall back on.

Cheers Andy.

I agree with the "plan to fall back on" business. Something I seriously need to consider. :)

[Ukbride Owner]

Julian....

The logo guy in your office!!!

Would he knock one up for me.....happy to pay!!!

Not sure what I'm going to do with it when I get it but it may be fun??

Not sure my market would support the guy with two turntables mixing tho...

It needs to appeal to the more Senior primarily.You know Incontinence pads,Mobility Scooters,Roll-Up Fags...that sort of thing.

Joking aside...it may be something on here others are interested in??

Hi, sorry we are only designing for Charlie, we need to keep to the main core of our business (I know I am turning down good money, but it's not really what we want to get into), we are magazines publishers.

I do take that as a compliment (hard to go them on here lol ;)

PS: Not had a chance to read through all of the posts on here yet.

Just to clarify something though. None of you (except Charlie) have seen our business plan, we are keeping that close to our chests at the moment.

Charlie's prices are £299 for an evening event (it is only UKbride members who will get the discount FOR A LIMITED PERIOD OF TIME ONLY!!!)

Nottinghamshire has a lower spend than London, Surrey, Berkshire, Kent and Sussex for example and so the prices have to be adjusted.

We have done our market research ;)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Nottinghamshire has a lower spend than London, Surrey, Berkshire, Kent and Sussex for example and so the prices have to be adjusted.

We have done our market research ;)

Not in this industry obviously...:bang:

[Leicester Ben]

Nottinghamshire has a lower spend than London, Surrey, Berkshire, Kent and Sussex for example and so the prices have to be adjusted.

Well I am 30 minutes from Nottingham and work there on a regular basis with fees starting at £375 for weddings (DJ only) and we have 61 weddings booked in for 2010, mainly in the East Midlands.

The bottom line is that if you charge £200, you will get £200 weddings, if you charge £400 you will get £400 weddings!

My point is that in Nottingham there are some great venues where clients pay top money for a DJ, with prices at £199 I doubt Charlie would get these posh bookings.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Well I am 30 minutes from Nottingham and work there on a regular basis with fees starting at £375 for weddings (DJ only) and we have 61 weddings booked in for 2010, mainly in the East Midlands.

The bottom line is that if you charge £200, you will get £200 weddings, if you charge £400 you will get £400 weddings!


Thank you Ben. :cool:

[Ukbride Owner]

I am... ;)



And people wonder why I don't want to waste my money on it... :lol:



:approve:

You guys (and gals) are totally missing the point. It is NOT UKbride that is making these figures up, neither do we target the bottom end of the market.

These brides-to-be have been asked a question. They have answered without seeing the other results, they are sat at home with their laptop, they can answer however they wish.

I usually don't publish poll results until I have had 5,000 answers as that is when the dust settles.

I guess none of you have ever seen a poll like this before, so perhaps it is a shock to you. But it is what it is (nothing to do with UKbride).

Do remember this though (which has been brought up before), this is what they THINK they will spend, perhaps when they get quotes from many of you on here, they may be shocked and didn't realise that it costs more.

It's only Charlie's pricing structure (which IS profitable for CHARLIE this year), that wont cause a shock ;) ;) ;)

[Ukbride Owner]

If you want a good idea, take a walk round your local wedding shops and look at the other literature about and you'll see what I mean. OMG don't take that advise!!!!

I am not convinced that the advice you have been given is 100% right for your business and personally anything coming from a salesman who has at the end of the day is trying to get you to part with cash should be taken with a pinch of salt.

I AM NOT TAKING ANY CASH FROM CHARLIE!!! AND FOR YOUR INFORMATION I AM THE OWNER AND MANAGING DIRECTOR OF MY OWN VERY SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS. :D :D :D :D :D

[Vectis]

You guys (and gals) are totally missing the point. It is NOT UKbride that is making these figures up, neither do we target the bottom end of the market.

These brides-to-be have been asked a question. They have answered without seeing the other results, they are sat at home with their laptop, they can answer however they wish.

I usually don't publish poll results until I have had 5,000 answers as that is when the dust settles.

I guess none of you have ever seen a poll like this before, so perhaps it is a shock to you. But it is what it is (nothing to do with UKbride).

Do remember this though (which has been brought up before), this is what they THINK they will spend, perhaps when they get quotes from many of you on here, they may be shocked and didn't realise that it costs more.

It's only Charlie's pricing structure (which IS profitable for CHARLIE this year), that wont cause a shock ;) ;) ;)


I don't think anyone here is disputing the fact that (number plucked out of the air because I can't be bothered trawling the previous thread) 50% of brides are planning to spend peanuts on their wedding entertainment. As we well know, there are plenty of monkeys out there willing to work for said foodstuffs.

A significant proportion of the membership of this forum strive to better themselves, and the image of the industry in general, and target the 30% (or whatever) who do want to spend reasonable money to get the level of service they desire.

That's where I think the disconnect lies. UK Bride lays out its stall to allcomers - effluent as well as affluent. MDD (by and large) leans towards the more affluent end of the market. Maybe www.cheapdisco.com (sorry mods) might be more interested :)

[Ukbride Owner]

Not in this industry obviously...:bang:

Yes Darren in this industry!!! We have checked to see the quantity of people who are happy to spend over £500 on their disco, the % in the South is MUCH higher than in Nottinghamshire!!!

Sorry but the poll results don't lie :) :) :)

[Vectis]

Yes Darren in this industry!!! We have checked to see the quantity of people who are happy to spend over £500 on their disco, the % in the South is MUCH higher than in Nottinghamshire!!!

Sorry but the poll results don't lie :) :) :)

I can tell you from my own experience that there are far more DJs in the south chasing £500 gigs than there are in Notts...

... supply and demand. Your stats only tell half the story.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Yes Darren in this industry!!! We have checked to see the quantity of people who are happy to spend over £500 on their disco, the % in the South is MUCH higher than in Nottinghamshire!!!

Sorry but the poll results don't lie :) :) :)

Firstly how do you know they are accurate? Brides could just click anything without thinking about it too much.

Secondly, you have said yourself several times that brides could change their mind and spend more.

[Ukbride Owner]

I have another poll that has been answered over 22,988 times for your interest...

Saturday 11790 51.%
Sunday 1066 4%
Mid week 3292 14%
Not sure yet 6850 29% (ie not yet booked the date)

Total 22998

[Ukbride Owner]

Firstly how do you know they are accurate? Brides could just click anything without thinking about it too much.

Secondly, you have said yourself several times that brides could change their mind and spend more.

It's a great point. It's accurate because of the quantity.

We asked this soft question to thousands of members,

a - Are you totally in Love
b - Slightly in Love
c - Not really in love


The % who said c was lower than 0.5% which I guess meant they didn't read the question. We also swapped positions of the answers (so that it wasn't just the last one they chose).

It didn't matter which order we put them in "Not really in Love" was ALWAYS lower than 0.5%.

[Steve the DJ]

You guys (and gals) are totally missing the point. It is NOT UKbride that is making these figures up, neither do we target the bottom end of the market.

I am finding this constant "you don't get it" or "you have totally missed the point" retort when someone disagrees quite rude to be honest with you.

I am not missing any point, your stats so far prove (just like every other site that is similar to yours) that the vast majority of visitors planned budget is significantly less than we would charge to deliver our standard service.

Yes a few of them may, possibly, spend a bit more in reality but experience tells little old me that trying to convert these few is a great deal of work for very little reward.

So forgive me for targeting my budget on media that has a demographic more in tune with my pricing structure, but spending £117 (or whatever it is) on something which has 60 - 70% of it's visitors looking to spend up to £500 (or even more) rather than 2% makes a hell of a lot more sense than any strategy you have yet proposed.


Sorry but the poll results don't lie :) :) :)

Nor do they tell the whole story as has already been mentioned.

[Ukbride Owner]

FAO Vectis

I am just looking at your pricing structure...

£399 rate refers to an evening party of maximum 5 hours music duration finishing by 1am.

Are you not VAT registered???

[Ukbride Owner]

I am finding this constant "you don't get it" or "you have totally missed the point" retort when someone disagrees quite rude to be honest with you.


I didn't think being rude on this forum was a problem?

I have received nothing but rudeness on this site since I have joined!!!

I am helping Charlie, you may not all agree with my 15 years self employed experience in the wedding industry, but if you through stones, expect some to come flying back!!! :p :p :p :p :p :p :p :p :p :p :p :p

[Vectis]

FAO Vectis

I am just looking at your pricing structure...

£399 rate refers to an evening party of maximum 5 hours music duration finishing by 1am.

Are you not VAT registered???

Can't see how this is even remotely related to this thread :confused:

The answer's no, by the way, as I've not hit threshold. But it's in the business plan for next year. Maybe sooner if the last 3 months is anything to go by :)

[StarZSoundS]

Yes Darren in this industry!!! We have checked to see the quantity of people who are happy to spend over £500 on their disco, the % in the South is MUCH higher than in Nottinghamshire!!!

Sorry but the poll results don't lie :) :) :)


I'm not sure but this may be saying that when some of us have protested that...

"You can't get that round here":eek: :eek: :eek:

or

"That the Streets are paved with Gold down South" :eek: :eek: :eek:



They may have been giving an accurate description of the situation!!;) ;)


Julian....with all the DATA you have.....Give us A golden figure....something we can all refer to this year.

What is the average price (nationally) that a Bride will pay for a DJ(no extras...starcloths,dance floors etc)...this year....in your opinion.:D ;) :D ;)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I have another poll that has been answered over 22,988 times for your interest...

Saturday 11790 51.%
Sunday 1066 4%
Mid week 3292 14%
Not sure yet 6850 29% (ie not yet booked the date)

Total 22998

What was the question?

"Which day comes between Friday and Sunday"?
:D

[Vectis]

What is the average price (nationally) that a Bride will pay for a DJ(no extras...starcloths,dance floors etc)...this year....in your opinion.:D ;) :D ;)

We already established that. Based on the UKB figures (at 1000 votes) it was £319.

[SC Events]

What was the question?

"Which day comes between Friday and Sunday"?
:D

:lol: :D

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I have received nothing but rudeness on this site since I have joined!!!


Woah. Just hold it there Julian. That is simply not true.

People aren't being rude - they are asking questions and making points about the subject being discussed.

Just because some people don't agree with your opinion or marketing, doesn't mean they are rude.

[Ukbride Owner]

Not a problem; I'm just not a paid-up member of the MDD willy waving club but for you I'll make an exception.

2009-10 Target gigs 100; Wedding/Corporate 60; Other 40
Actual Wedding/Corporate 68; Other 39

2008-09 Target gigs 100; Wedding/Corporate 60; Other 40
Actual Wedding/Corporate 72; Other 45

2007-08 Target gigs 80; Wedding/Corporate 50 Other 30
Actual Wedding/Corporate 52 Other 55

Virtually all Wedding/Corporate gigs have a "from" price of £395 for a basic 4-hour evening disco. Virtually all are upsold extras and £700-800 is not uncommon.

The '100 gig limit' is self-imposed as it's all I can cope with due to other interests, and I have no ambition to scale out beyond just me.


£700-800 let's call it £750 x 100 = £75,000

VAT registration threshold

If you're in business, you must register for VAT if your VAT taxable turnover for the previous 12 months is more than £70,000. :) :) :)

[StarZSoundS]

We already established that. Based on the UKB figures (at 1000 votes) it was £319.



I'll be the first to admit that i'm LEGITIMATE and below that.....

Anyone care to join me??:) :) :) :) :) :)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I'll be the first to admit that i'm LEGITIMATE and below that.....

Anyone care to join me??:) :) :) :) :) :)

That has nothing to do with this thread really.

[Steve the DJ]

I didn't think being rude on this forum was a problem?

Funnily enough I think you have got away with murder and have seen many members edited, deleted and sin binned for similar (just like this post probably will be), but hey ho, I'm not in charge.

I'm sorry that you feel other members trying to give Charlie a balanced view is rude, it must be annoying for such a wonderful, talented, supreme businessman as yourself to have irritating, insignificant, small minded "pretend" business oiks getting involved... :bang:

I'll let you get on with helping others and will not post again on anything that involves you or your company.

:Censored:

[womble]

£72.50 per month (mum pays half) for Phone Bill

Ouch! How is it that much for your phone bill?

[Ukbride Owner]

Funnily enough I think you have got away with murder and have seen many members edited, deleted and sin binned for similar (just like this post probably will be), but hey ho, I'm not in charge.

I'm sorry that you feel other members trying to give Charlie a balanced view is rude, it must be annoying for such a wonderful, talented, supreme businessman as yourself to have irritating, insignificant, small minded "pretend" business oiks getting involved... :bang:

I'll let you get on with helping others and will not post again on anything that involves you or your company.

:Censored:


Woah, woah, woah...

It's your forum, not mine!!!

I will get my coat and leave.

GOODBYE ALL AND GOOD LUCK!!! :beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Woah, woah, woah...

It's your forum, not mine!!!

I will get my coat and leave.

GOODBYE ALL AND GOOD LUCK!!! :beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

Julian

You have to accept that some people know more about our industry than you do and like it or not, on this forum, everyone's opinion counts.

Everytime someone disagrees with you or what you are saying, you say you are leaving. There's no need.

I actually believe threads like this are good for us and you.

But, I don't like it when you post things like you have received nothing but rudeness since you've been here because frankly that isn't true.

You have been extended every courtesy and the hand of friendship from the forum owners here.

Just because people disagree doesn't mean they are being rude.

[SC Events]

I think some people could be a bit more courteous towards Julian as he has taken up quite a bit of his time to help Charlie and to also help us lot out.

Not all of you may like what Julian is offering and yes, he may not understand the Mobile DJ market as well as many of you, but I feel some posts are worded a bit 'Strong'.

So far through UK Bride (2 weeks I think it has been now) I have had 2 people interested in my services and have asked me for more information.

Just my 2p worth :o :)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I think some people could be a bit more courteous towards Julian as he has taken up quite a bit of his time to help Charlie and to also help us lot out.



Hold on Scott. Julian is not here for the good of his health. He is here to gain business.

He has told us the reasons for 'helping' Charlie and been quite open about it.

[Vectis]

£700-800 let's call it £750 x 100 = £75,000

VAT registration threshold

If you're in business, you must register for VAT if your VAT taxable turnover for the previous 12 months is more than £70,000. :) :) :)

I so wish every wedding gig was £750 :)

I'm not going to post a full set of accounts, but I can assure you that my business has not hit threshold yet.

A quick check through last year's book shows 9 gigs exceeding £700. Now from 52 weddings, that's not uncommon. 17% is not "uncommon".

Thanks for looking out for me though :beer1:

[SC Events]

Hold on Scott. Julian is not here for the good of his health. He is here to gain business.

He has told us the reasons for 'helping' Charlie and been quite open about it.

I know he`s here to gain business, but he has been helping aswell us by finding out information directly from brides themselves, so IMO that makes him quite a valuable resource.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I know he`s here to gain business, but he has been helping aswell us by finding out information directly from brides themselves, so IMO that makes him quite a valuable resource.

I agree, but he's not doing it for nothing. ;)

[Vectis]

I know he`s here to gain business, but he has been helping aswell us by finding out information directly from brides themselves, so IMO that makes him quite a valuable resource.

All business intelligence is useful.

But it should be a two-way street. Sadly there seems to be a roadworks or something up Julian's end (a no-entry sign maybe?) ;)

[A1DL]

But it should be a two-way street. Sadly there seems to be a roadworks or something up Julian's end (a no-entry sign maybe?) ;)

Nail on the head, Martin. Lost it for me at post no.3 in this 120+ post thread, as selling a naive youngster a brochure that looks like a flyer for Gatecrasher, when you supposedly have 15 years experience in the wedding industry, doesn't stack up however you come at it.

[Shaun]

The flyer design would be great for the younger end of the market for 18ths etc but definitely not for weddings which are a classy event (on the whole) and the design should reflect this. If you want upmarket have upmarket marketing materials not what the local club hands out on a friday night.



I completely agree. A very strange design concept for the wedding market. If it were marketing to youths and clubland it's good, but for brides it's completely off the mark.

[StarZSoundS]

I think some people could be a bit more courteous towards Julian as he has taken up quite a bit of his time to help Charlie and to also help us lot out.




Quite honestly the way some people have addressed Julian is bordering on outrageous not strong!!:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

The Guy has had a fine idea,develped it skillfully and made himself a Millionaire in the process.And maybe thats what rankles with some???:confused: :confused: :confused:


He the proceeds to come into the Lions Den to be met with sarcasm and grief....If thats how we respond to people who are not part of the DJ fraternity then no wonder the business is in the state it is in.

How about we cut the guy a bit of slack....If you don't like what he's saying....avoid the thread.There's plenty of others to keep you occupied.I, for one, have been fascinated by what he has to say because I know I don't know it all.

He is trying to manipulate Charlie to show us the error of our ways by example.As long as Charlie is in agreement with this then I'm happy!!If you're business is exactly how you want it then you shouldn't be on the thread at all...it is clearly a marketing thread from the title....and you're not going to learn anything from it!!



And finally lets not blame Julian for what his Brides are saying.Sometimes the truth hurts.He adapted the poll to reflect what we wanted to ask and delivered the results.:) :) :) :)

If Chesterfield loose 7-1 on Saturday I doubt wether Spirits High will want to go round and smack the guy who delivered the news on the Radio in the Gob....so why treat Julian this way?? :confused: :confused: :confused:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Could you point out where people have been rude to him please as I am getting fed up with people saying that and not giving examples.

And for the last time, this is a forum for things to be discussed. Do not avoid the thread if you disagree. Have your opinion about it. That's what we are here for.

Julian will help us to help his business, nothing more and nothing less. If people don't agree with his opinions or the way he does things, they have a right to say so.

Shall I wrap Julian up in cotton wool to make sure none of these big nasty DJs disagree with him? No. He wouldn't want that either, he is quite capable of standing his own ground, so enough of the 'poor old Julian' comments. Thanks.

[andyw]

How about we cut the guy a bit of slack....If you don't like what he's saying....avoid the thread.There's plenty of others to keep you occupied.I, for one, have been fascinated by what he has to say because I know I don't know it all.



don't think that would help, we need tobe able to debate things in an adult way,we all need to learn and listen from others, and try to adapt the things that maybe will help us and ignore the bits that is irrelvant to us, but then julian also needs to listen to what we have to say and realise what expirience is on this forum.

as martin said it's a 2 way road,

[Spirits High]

If Chesterfield loose 7-1 on Saturday I doubt wether Spirits High will want to go round and smack the guy who delivered the news on the Radio in the Gob....so why treat Julian this way?? :confused: :confused: :confused:

If Chesterfield loose 7-1 on Saturday I'll laugh as my team AFC Wimbledon are playing at Gateshead and it'll mean Chesterfield have missed out on the playoffs :D :D :D :D

[DJ James Lake]

Julian could actually help us all out here if for one minute he stood back and too at look at what we are all saying.

We do not want to discount prices. We offer a professional service at professional prices. The amount of care and pride we take in providing that service is really being misunderstood.

If Julian concentrated on getting the message across about the importance of quality on a brides special day and that cheap isn't always good. Then his site would be very useful for the bulk of us here and would attract far more advertisers from this forum.

But by offering big discounts, you might as well stick all the £50 sids on there and be done with it in the first place.

Perhaps one of the admins could set up a poll on here about interest in UK Bride advertsing if it stops promoting in way a way that cheapens our efforts. For at the moment I have no interest whatsoever unless a totally different approach is taken by the site. Even its polls cheapen the impression of discos for brides to be.

Julian please start listening and be humble enough to take some advice of potential clients advertising needs, clubby looking flyers and discounts are not the right direction.

Help us promote quality.

[andyw]

Shall I wrap Julian up in cotton wool to make sure none of these big nasty DJs disagree with him? No. He wouldn't want that either, he is quite capable of standing his own ground, so enough of the 'poor old Julian' comments. Thanks.

i know people who will pay good money to be wrapped up like that:)
i think the main thing here is that for ukbride it's about numbers and on this forum it's about quality.it don't matter to julian whether we get £500 or £100 per booking he will get the same from us

[Paul The Party Dj]

I think Julian has helped us out already with the information he has shared. We all know many of our potential clients want to pay much, we all know that if we place adverts a lot of the calls will be "tyre-kickers" out for the best deal.
We also know however that many of our clients are thankful they booked us and not a sixty-quid sid. We have to use the information to develop our pitch. Cheap DJ's and hotel resident DJ's (see Shakermakers excellent post from earlier "Interesting conversation") are not what many Brides want.
We have to educate them!

[StarZSoundS]

Could you point out where people have been rude to him please as I am getting fed up with people saying that and not giving examples.




I'm sorry Darren try post 111.

Now unless the Author has read a post that has completely changed his opinion of UKB it rankles of Sarcasm......isn't sarcasm rude?? I don't mind when people are rude to me....I'VE GOT USED TO IT.

But it is quite daunting when you first start posting to have everybody wanting to have a swipe at you....I know....I've been there!!

Look the Guy don't love it that much.....He's :Censored: off 5 times!!

And yes....that censored word does begin with F. ;) ;) ;) ;)

[Ukbride Owner]

Okay, I have calmed down a little. ;)

I am just frustrated, perhaps you are too.

Let's look at FACTS, and facts only. the poll results for pricing of DJ's are now at 2580 votes...


Wedding Discos!

Are you planning on having a DJ for your Wedding and if so how much do you plan to spend?

Poll Results

Total Votes:
2580

I have already got my Wedding Disco sorted
24%
I am planning to spend up to £200
24%
I am planning to spend up to £300
20%
I am planning spend up to £400
7%
I am planning spend up to £500
8%
I am planning spend MORE than £500
3%
I am not having a Wedding Disco
15%


I accept that it doesn't give you the full picture. But it is the biggest picture you have ever seen! We also have discussed that this is what they anticipate spending (more than likely before getting a quote).

Here's some questions if you can all answer then we can get an average...

A) - For a standard package how much should be charged for a Wedding Disco (I know you will want to say well that depends, but lets try and get a figure)

B) - How is the best way to get your business in front of brides-to-be?

[sweetie]

As someone who is not based in the Uk and is an impartial observer on this thread I do think that the written word can be read as more rude and hostile than intended or interpreted if spoken and I also agree that Julian's comment can be read as slightly condescending also. I also would think that many of ye great salespersons should be able to convince a lot of these brides the value of paying more for the service you provide. Here in Ireland, many of my clients initially feel my prices are expensive but the majority of inquiries I manage to convert to clients by using some methods learned from forums like this.

[Paul The Party Dj]

Charlie. I have no doubt you will do well in this business and in life, your heart is in the right place and you want to do well. However, as some have already pointed out, you can only expect big paying gigs on one or two nights a week - Saturday and Friday. Julian's Wedding Day stats show Saturdays are still the day for Weddings - midweek Weddings are generally smaller affairs. Please read my earlier post about keeping your options open - you could still do College and University and probably do 20 Saturday Weddings a year in your home area, even if you went away to Uni.
Event management, marquee hire, etc - yeah all good ways of making a living BUT my recommendation would be to take work that you can do with the minimum of help. A good roadie is a great help, but any more staff than that can be a nightmare.

[OllieJames]

This thread has given me a banging headache and quite frankly has angered me a little. Now, I may be speaking out of turn here and am ready to be shot down, but I find it disgraceful, as Angie has pointed out, that Charlie's being marketed as a £199 wedding DJ, whether it's for a limited time or not? This lot, and a lot of other DJs that are not members of MDD have tried for a very long time to make brides realise that for quality you do pay more. A lot of guys do this for a living, and rely on DJing to feed their families, pay their bills etc - and I know full well, no matter how many gigs they do a year, weddings at £199 will not keep them happy, although a lot don't rely on it for a living, and could possibly work for a considerable amount less. As the 'poll results' show - brides do not want to pay a lot for a DJ, and I think by reducing costs and marketing Charlie at £199 isn't helping us whatsoever.

I agree that the marketing designs that have been posted do not relate to high end weddings, and are more suited to mobile club/18th birthdays/21st birthdays. This needs to be changed if his target audience is weddings.

Charlie, from a personal perspective - I appreciate your desire, and love for DJing - but from having chats with you on various occasions - it would appear that you work your backside off as it stands. Are you sure you can take on this extra work? Although you may get a substantial quantity of gigs out of this scheme, you may regret working for a lot less than you could do. Not forgetting when you have to pay full whack for the UKB membership. I'm all up for giving advice/help and learning from individuals much older & wiser than myself... but it seems like, quite frankly a :Censored: huge jump from what you or myself are currently doing. You're young, just like myself - pace yourself - don't wreck yourself before your time ;)

Now, take what you like from my post... but I feel that all the work that has been done by other DJs, regarding the 'fight' against iPod weddings, and "60 quid Sids" is beginning to be un-done by promoting DJs for a lot less than they're worth whether the DJ in question is getting loads of work out of it or not.

Apologies for the rant.

[DJ James Lake]

This thread has given me a banging headache and quite frankly has angered me a little. Now, I may be speaking out of turn here and am ready to be shot down, but I find it disgraceful, as Angie has pointed out, that Charlie's being marketed as a £199 wedding DJ, whether it's for a limited time or not? This lot, and a lot of other DJs that are not members of MDD have tried for a very long time to make brides realise that for quality you do pay more. A lot of guys do this for a living, and rely on DJing to feed their families, pay their bills etc - and I know full well, no matter how many gigs they do a year, weddings at £199 will not keep them happy, although a lot don't rely on it for a living, and could possibly work for a considerable amount less. As the 'poll results' show - brides do not want to pay a lot for a DJ, and I think by reducing costs and marketing Charlie at £199 isn't helping us whatsoever.

I agree that the marketing designs that have been posted do not relate to high end weddings, and are more suited to mobile club/18th birthdays/21st birthdays. This needs to be changed if his target audience is weddings.

Charlie, from a personal perspective - I appreciate your desire, and love for DJing - but from having chats with you on various occasions - it would appear that you work your backside off as it stands. Are you sure you can take on this extra work? Although you may get a substantial quantity of gigs out of this scheme, you may regret working for a lot less than you could do. Not forgetting when you have to pay full whack for the UKB membership. I'm all up for giving advice/help and learning from individuals much older & wiser than myself... but it seems like, quite frankly a :Censored: huge jump from what you or myself are currently doing. You're young, just like myself - pace yourself - don't wreck yourself before your time ;)

Now, take what you like from my post... but I feel that all the work that has been done by other DJs, regarding the 'fight' against iPod weddings, and "60 quid Sids" is beginning to be un-done by promoting DJs for a lot less than they're worth whether the DJ in question is getting loads of work out of it or not.

Apologies for the rant.

Well put Ollie

[DJ James Lake]

Okay, I have calmed down a little. ;)

I am just frustrated, perhaps you are too.

Let's look at FACTS, and facts only. the poll results for pricing of DJ's are now at 2580 votes...


Wedding Discos!

Are you planning on having a DJ for your Wedding and if so how much do you plan to spend?

Poll Results

Total Votes:
2580

I have already got my Wedding Disco sorted
24%
I am planning to spend up to £200
24%
I am planning to spend up to £300
20%
I am planning spend up to £400
7%
I am planning spend up to £500
8%
I am planning spend MORE than £500
3%
I am not having a Wedding Disco
15%


I accept that it doesn't give you the full picture. But it is the biggest picture you have ever seen! We also have discussed that this is what they anticipate spending (more than likely before getting a quote).

Here's some questions if you can all answer then we can get an average...

A) - For a standard package how much should be charged for a Wedding Disco (I know you will want to say well that depends, but lets try and get a figure)

B) - How is the best way to get your business in front of brides-to-be?

Surely the pole just proves that your marketing is targetted towards the lower end of the market and at present the site does not reflect what professionals actually charge. Yes there are plenty of cheapo discos out there and if you want them to advertise good luck you'll always have to discount advertising rates to keep them.

If the importance of quality is promoted then the figures for the higher brackets will lift, and in turn will attract more advertisers who actually have the budget to pay full whack for UKB advertising rates.

For me personally I wouldn't even think about advertising until the majority is in the £400 - £500 bracket as my lowest package comes in at £350 and is not the most popular package.

The packages I offer for weddings range from £350 for a basic setup to £750 for the top package.

[Steve the DJ]

<ignoringmyownpreviouspostmode>


I'm sorry Darren try post 111.

Now unless the Author has read a post that has completely changed his opinion of UKB it rankles of Sarcasm......isn't sarcasm rude??

Don't be sorry, that post is full of sarcasm which is exactly how it is intended, the only flaw in your example is that is the last thing I have said and will ever say to this man on the forum.

My last reaction to a post that I feel is rude and arrogant is not exactly a great example is it?

I have made numerous posts beforehand trying to discuss the issues, none of which I believe are rude, slightly tongue in cheek on occasion perhaps but not offensive, but Julian is a closed shop to anything but his own opinion.

</ignoringmyownpreviouspostmode>


I don't mind when people are rude to me....I'VE GOT USED TO IT.

Therefore sir you are an idiot... :p :D

[James]

My two Cents.

At the end of the day, it's competition, do or die, dog eat dog, if Charlie, or anyone for that matter wants to charge £199 and go with that strategy, then it's their choice.

Just because everyone else is charging 2 or 3 times that, doesn't mean everyone else has to, you know?

In the long run, he'll build himself up a good customer base, and if he does a good job, word of mouth will spread, not to mention all the hits on his website etc.

I can see what Julian is saying, and for a 16 year old single lad with no ties, it's a good strategy i think, maybe not so good for the older folk with mortgages, kids etc.

Personaly, it's not for me, i wouldn't answer the phone for £199, but if i was 16 with no ties, i'd jump at the chance.

[Vectis]

He'll build himself up a good customer base

I disagree with this point. He'll actually build up a £199 customer database.

[James]

yup, but for a 16 year old, it's not a bad wage.

once he's a bit older & more experienced, then he can adjust his prices accordingly.

[OllieJames]

Personaly, it's not for me, i wouldn't answer the phone for £199, but if i was 16 with no ties, i'd jump at the chance.

I'm 17 with no ties, and I'm not jumping at the chance - agreed with you, it's not for me either.

[James]

And also, don't forget guys, we are in the middle (so they say) of a recession now, a lot of people aren't as 'flush' as they once were.

Pre- recession, price may not have been a factor for some people when booking a DJ

[Mark Wild]

This is just turning into yet another price thread.

[James]

a price thread i could handle, a katie price thread, i could not.

[OllieJames]

This is just turning into yet another price thread.

Yes, but to be honest - it turned into a price thread from post 1.

[andyw]

yup, but for a 16 year old, it's not a bad wage.

once he's a bit older & more experienced, then he can adjust his prices accordingly.

but if he is doing it full time then he will have to get one every week and the after expenses it wont be great,if he gets 75 gigs a year which is 1.5 a week is total income would only be £15,000 i think charlie needs to sit down and work out how much he needs to live on and how much his expenses are, then work out how many gigs he will have to do to get that in, and also how is he going to suppliment his money on weeks with no gigs.

[DJ INDIE]

again i think the BAnd Waggon has a lot of people hanging on to it for no real reason.

Charlie has been touted as a £199 Wedding DJ - FALSE

Charlie has in fact only been touted as a £199 Wedding DJ to UK Bride members only, (i assume he advertises elsewhere and to other people too) where he has been given information to the average spend Brides are expecting to pay, and thus doesnt waste his time over quoting, and is free to carry on elsewhere as he wishes.

in this model, he has insider knowledge of projected budget spend of the Brides and has a plan in place to get that business.

That is good business.


If the projected £199 to £299 gigs dont appeal to you - fine.

Dont forget though UK Bride members are also free to advertise elsewhere - we are not all tied in to deal only with UK Bride members!!

[OllieJames]

Charlie has been touted as a £199 Wedding DJ - FALSE.

Charlie has in fact only been touted as a £199 Wedding DJ to UK Bride members only

Which still gives the target audience the impression that he's been touted as a £199 wedding DJ? So it's not false?

I'm going to give this thread a miss for a while and see how it develops...

[DJ James Lake]

again i think the BAnd Waggon has a lot of people hanging on to it for no real reason.

Charlie has been touted as a £199 Wedding DJ - FALSE

Charlie has in fact only been touted as a £199 Wedding DJ to UK Bride members only, (i assume he advertises elsewhere and to other people too) where he has been given information to the average spend Brides are expecting to pay, and thus doesnt waste his time over quoting, and is free to carry on elsewhere as he wishes.

in this model, he has insider knowledge of projected budget spend of the Brides and has a plan in place to get that business.

That is good business.


If the projected £199 to £299 gigs dont appeal to you - fine.

Dont forget though UK Bride members are also free to advertise elsewhere - we are not all tied in to deal only with UK Bride members!!



Well I guess under that basis I am a £1000 a night dj but give discounts depending on what package people book.

[DJ INDIE]

Its not false on two counts;

he is a £199 DJ to the UKBride market that he knows their projected average spend. He is free to be a £299 DJ to other customers etc etc

if you look carefully he is a "FROM £199...." he can put his prices up whenever, upsell other extras etc etc - its a simple marketting ploy to get the initial contact.


Well I guess under that basis I am a £1000 a night dj but give discounts depending on what package people book.

but he isnt downgrading himself per say - just targetting this price and strategy at ONE market. the UK Bride one.

[Marc J]

2) Not sure about the background - looks too much like wallpaper to me!


That's not my first choice... but the customer is always right don't you know? ;)

No, the customer is always right until they insist on the Wallpaper from "The Shining"....then you put your foot down :D

[StarZSoundS]

No, the customer is always right until they insist on the Wallpaper from "The Shining"....then you put your foot down :D


Does it remind you of anything Bellshill.....it looks like yours!!:sofa: :sofa:

[Mark Wild]

Does it remind you of anything Bellshill.....it looks like yours!!:sofa: :sofa:

Not even close ;) :D

[Charlie Brown]

OI!

:boxer2:

My background represents me - Different, quirky, unique, abstract, amazing and super! ;)

How about using the £199 offer ONLY Sunday to Friday?

Martin is knocking me up a 2nd website...I'm going to have two identities. :sj:

£199 - no frills, no event meeting, no playlist planning - just a basic 4 hour disco 15 miles from Nottingham Town centre.

Your thoughts?

[Mark Wild]

OI!

My background represents me - Different, quirky, unique, abstract, amazing and super! ;)


1 out of 6 ain't bad :eek: :D

[wensleydale]

OI!

:boxer2:

My background represents me - Different, quirky, unique, abstract, amazing and super! ;)

How about using the £199 offer ONLY Sunday to Friday?

Martin is knocking me up a 2nd website...I'm going to have two identities. :sj:

£199 - no frills, no event meeting, no playlist planning - just a basic 4 hour disco 15 miles from Nottingham Town centre.

Your thoughts?

But what are you trying to achieve?
Why limit yourself if you can offer a meeting, playlist planning etc etc and get more for it.

I'd also question how you can truly provide a decent service if you dont plan playlists.

There's no right or wrong here Charlie but I dont think you can say that you now have a "great marketing plan" if that just consists of knocking £100 off for UK Bride customers- in fact I wouldnt say that's really marketing at all- just discounting.

[theoloyla]

Spot on Darren

[Charlie Brown]

But what are you trying to achieve?
Why limit yourself if you can offer a meeting, playlist planning etc etc and get more for it.

I'd also question how you can truly provide a decent service if you dont plan playlists.

There's no right or wrong here Charlie but I dont think you can say that you now have a "great marketing plan" if that just consists of knocking £100 off for UK Bride customers- in fact I wouldnt say that's really marketing at all- just discounting.

There are bound to be a few Wednesdays, Sundays and Fridays I'm free. Why not fill them up for a £199 wedding? I'll devote the rest of my time to my website where prices start from £275.


Spot on Darren

Which quote? :confused:

[Ukbride Owner]

Its not false on two counts;

he is a £199 DJ to the UKBride market that he knows their projected average spend. He is free to be a £299 DJ to other customers etc etc

if you look carefully he is a "FROM £199...." he can put his prices up whenever, upsell other extras etc etc - its a simple marketting ploy to get the initial contact.



but he isnt downgrading himself per say - just targetting this price and strategy at ONE market. the UK Bride one.



Bingo :beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

[Penfold42]

Yeah.....but how many people will hang him out to dry on £199?
'You said.....£199....why is it now...XXXX?'

How many people will then just walk on by thinking never to try again as it's wasting my time....BUT.....and more importantly......How many will that one bride tell..........

[Ukbride Owner]

Charlie as I told you yesterday it is your business and you don't have to follow my carefully thought out plan.

But change my plan based on Market research, not simply because there are slot of people on here shouting that you are too cheap.

You do have an advantage over them (at the moment), you don't have a mortgage or kids to feed. From a business point of view you have to accept that people on this forum are not friends, they are the competition!!!

I think taking advice from the competition is of course foolish.

I am sure there ARE many people on here who you have a good laugh with and some out of your area with years more experience that are happy to offer help.

But don't change the stratergy lightly, this is to UKbride members only, how many Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays do you have free at the moment. We calculated 120 more gigs could still be filled (if you wanted to work that hard).

We can withdraw the discount whenever we want to. You will get word of mouth, their price is £295!!!

[Penfold42]

Charlie as I told you yesterday it is your business and you don't have to follow my carefully thought out plan.

But change my plan based on Market research, not simply because there are slot of people on here shouting that you are too cheap.

You do have an advantage over them (at the moment), you don't have a mortgage or kids to feed. From a business point of view you have to accept that people on this forum are not friends, they are the competition!!!

I think taking advice from the competition is of course foolish.

I am sure there ARE many people on here who you have a good laugh with and some out of your area with years more experience that are happy to offer help.

But don't change the stratergy lightly, this is to UKbride members only, how many Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays do you have free at the moment. We calculated 120 more gigs could still be filled (if you wanted to work that hard).

We can withdraw the discount whenever we want to. You will get word of mouth, their price is £295!!!

Hmmmm........strange how people ON HERE have offered advise FREE.....and working the same area....is that competition??? I would say that's help. :confused:

[wensleydale]

I think taking advice from the competition is of course foolish.


But taking advise from someone trying to sell you advertising is a very wise move.
;)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

From a business point of view you have to accept that people on this forum are not friends, they are the competition!!!



Julian

I respect your views and the fact that you have a successful business, but I don't think you understand our industry or this on-line community well enough.

I have friends and colleagues the length of this country who I have helped or who have helped me.

I totally totally disagree with that statement.

[Vectis]

From a business point of view you have to accept that people on this forum are not friends, they are the competition!!!


Methinks Julian has been spending too much time around his own forum with its predominantly short termist bridezilla membership.

I'm practically in another country for gawd's sake :)

[DJ James Lake]

Charlie as I told you yesterday it is your business and you don't have to follow my carefully thought out plan.

But change my plan based on Market research, not simply because there are slot of people on here shouting that you are too cheap.

You do have an advantage over them (at the moment), you don't have a mortgage or kids to feed. From a business point of view you have to accept that people on this forum are not friends, they are the competition!!!

I think taking advice from the competition is of course foolish.

And your a salesman selling advertising....of course you can be totally trusted :D

I think you'll find Charlie has benefitted hugely from advice give on the forum, in fact at the age he is I doubt he would have got as far has he had already.

[discomobiledj]

And your a salesman selling advertising....of course you can be totally trusted :D

:rofl:

On a serious note, I can't believe the length of this thread.

Charlie, at the end of the day it's YOUR business, you should do as you see fit, BUT remember, you're 16 for God sake.

Yes you can work every Friday, Saturday and Sunday for the next however many years but do you really want to look back and think what if?

Before I got tied down I went travelling with my future wife around Australia for 6 weeks, something I could never do now because I have to many commitments.

Be a typical youngster (you're at that funny age, not quite a child, not quite an adult!), go to clubs etc, have fun with the ladies and most of all enjoy life.

[OllieJames]

It's a load of balls that we're not friends on here Julian. I've met and worked at the same venues as James Lake and Matt Herridge, both have which have helped me out hugely with their advice. Yes, they're competition in Northampton, but it is incredibly foolish to not have friends within your industry. Not forgetting the incredible amount of help and support i've had from the rest of the guys on here too.

[Penfold42]

It's a load of balls that we're not friends on here Julian. I've met and worked at the same venues as James Lake and Matt Herridge, both have which have helped me out hugely with their advice. Yes, they're competition in Northampton, but it is incredibly foolish to not have friends within your industry. Not forgetting the incredible amount of help and support i've had from the rest of the guys on here too.

Calm down Timothy! :D

[Charlie Brown]

Be a typical youngster (you're at that funny age, not quite a child, not quite an adult!), go to clubs etc, have fun with the ladies and most of all enjoy life.

But why should? Why should I follow the crowd?

[Ukbride Owner]

I do stongly agree with Steve here, with regard 'live a little'...

I wake up and think about work and the last thing at night I think about work. It's not healthy really is it!

Btw Charlie has already paid me for his package on my site. There is no benefit to me if Charlie does well other than proving that my site is powerful enough to make money if marketed to properly.

But before you all shout again ref prices, Charlie can profit from the lower wedding budgets.

Darren on the other hand is concentrating on the higher end of the Market!

Darren I accept that you disagree with my comments re: competition!

[Charlie Brown]

I do stongly agree with Steve here, with regard 'live a little'...


I bet it's addictive? Making money IS addictive.




.....I'm just not very good at it. :D

[DJ INDIE]

at 16 i was at college 5 days a week , messing around, then spending all my money (about £5 !) on booze and having a laugh.

at 18 i was doing a mind numbing job 5 days a week, just so i could get bladdered with my mates on friday and saturday.



charlie, you can make much more working 2 days a week than a lot of people do in a week and have 5 days a week off! - i wish i had that option at 16!!


also the likes of Darren and Julian have given you priceless advice , help and lets be honest massive favours and a huge step up the business ladder - so put them to good use and reap the rewards the 5 days you are NOT working, and enjoy the two you ARE.

[OllieJames]

Calm down Timothy! :D

Perhaps it was slightly blunt, but I find it very annoying when comments like that are made, before the individual has done their research properly. I'm sure I'm not the only one!! :D

[Charlie Brown]

Perhaps it was slightly blunt,

Yeah...bit OTT Ollie.

I can understand why Julian said it. He doesn't know the forum that well and is an innocent observation anyone make.

[Ukbride Owner]

It is addictive Charlie, sadly enough it's my hobby too!!!

My brother is an electrician and hates his job. He never talks about his work from the moment his boots hit the floor after a hard days work.

Who is sadder? I don't know.

Getting balance is important, as I told you yeterday I don't actually do the work anymore, sure I manage my team, but my businesses doesn't really need me anymore. I only work 4 days a week. I never work lates, earlies or weekends.

But it did take me 13 hard years to get here!

To be really succesful (which I don't class myself as), you have to sacrifice some of your life. But 16 - 25 years old are the fun times of your life (don't worry there's plenty more fun later on, but then there is the mortgage to think about, the wife and the kids.

It is your life and ONLY you can make that decision. Whatever makes you happy.

Did you start to go through our list of things to do btw?

[OllieJames]

Yeah...bit OTT Ollie.
He doesn't know the forum that well.

Why say it then? I give up! ;)

[Charlie Brown]

Why say it then?

It was a rational comment that wasn't thought through properly.

On reflection, I'm sure Julian wish he didn't say it.

[Ukbride Owner]

Ollie if you read my post carefully it wasn't a blatent blow at ALL members of the forum. But you are very young too, and you will learn that BUSINESS IS BUSINESS.

It's a nasty unfair game somtimes.

Keeping ahead of the competition is something I believe is very important.

I do think Charlie has been a little too open with his plans. How many views has this thread had! How many DJ's across the county have thought, bl**dy hel l that's a good idea!

I can assure you that there are not many friends on the business world!!!

How many of you think that I am only here to make money from DJs, my agenda was only to set the record straight, see my first posts.

Charlie has seen for himself I get big deals, and in two weeks time 'the big one' which is worth millions, not hundreds.

I am learning so much on here about how you guys think.

[Excalibur]

Julian

I respect your views and the fact that you have a successful business, but I don't think you understand our industry or this on-line community well enough.

I have friends and colleagues the length of this country who I have helped or who have helped me.
I totally totally disagree with that statement.
That would be a fact. ;) ;) I'd guess that Darren has given more help than received.

Methinks Julian has been spending too much time around his own forum with its predominantly short termist bridezilla membership.

I'm practically in another country for gawd's sake :)
And even when you weren't, you were. ;) ( For new readers, Vectis was formerly a Lancastrian. )


And your a salesman selling advertising....of course you can be totally trusted :D

I think you'll find Charlie has benefitted hugely from advice give on the forum, in fact at the age he is I doubt he would have got as far has he had already.
Because he has had the good sense to act upon good advice given here, Charlie is already years ahead of the "Wannabes".

Julian, very few of us on here regard the others as " Competition". More often they're regarded as Help, Safety Net, or Spare Capacity.
And as for charging £199 for a wedding I couldn't even consider it.

I've spent so much time berating folk who add money onto their standard fee as soon as the "W" word is mentioned, that a 330% price hike would be hypocritical. :D :D :D :D :D

[Ukbride Owner]

Like all forums there are many more Viewers than writers!!!

Perhaps that helps you to see that my comment is valid. Again don't take my comment out of contex from the full post!

And again the price structure is for CHARLIE and CHARLIE only!

[StarZSoundS]

You are asking me to help persuade 'my' brides to spend more on their disco.



Julian...like your opinion on this!!


Maybe the problem is this.... the Bride is not sure what she is investing in when she books a DJ.If you were pondering wether to buy a house for £150,000 or another one for £300,000 you would at least have a good look round both before deciding.

You cannot see how good your DJ is until after the event!!Having a flashy Website and pictures of lights,( which may or may not belong to him) does not guarantee you that you have made the right choice for your Entertainer(?).

I have seen £250 Wedding DJ's do a far better job than £500 Wedding DJ's(hastens to add AND VICE VERSA).But it is an imponderable.More than anything the Bride wants her chosen one to engage with her Guests....and paying more gives her no more of a guarantee of that!!

So why not take a chance with MR £250 and have that extra layer on your cake........:eek: :eek: :eek:

[Corabar Entertainment]

Wow! I'm really sorry that I've been so busy this week and not around too much.... I'm missing all the fun! :D
Julian could actually help us all out here if for one minute he stood back and too at look at what we are all saying.

We do not want to discount prices. We offer a professional service at professional prices. The amount of care and pride we take in providing that service is really being misunderstood.

If Julian concentrated on getting the message across about the importance of quality on a brides special day and that cheap isn't always good. Then his site would be very useful for the bulk of us here and would attract far more advertisers from this forum.

But by offering big discounts, you might as well stick all the £50 sids on there and be done with it in the first place.

Julian please start listening and be humble enough to take some advice of potential clients advertising needs, clubby looking flyers and discounts are not the right direction.

Help us promote quality.Totally agree with that :thumbsup:


yup, but for a 16 year old, it's not a bad wage.

once he's a bit older & more experienced, then he can adjust his prices accordingly.


but if he is doing it full time then he will have to get one every week and the after expenses it wont be great,if he gets 75 gigs a year which is 1.5 a week is total income would only be £15,000 i think charlie needs to sit down and work out how much he needs to live on and how much his expenses are, then work out how many gigs he will have to do to get that in, and also how is he going to suppliment his money on weeks with no gigs.Sorry - just to pull you up on that... that is TURNOVER, not INCOME!


From a business point of view you have to accept that people on this forum are not friends, they are the competition!!!

I think taking advice from the competition is of course foolish.Sorry Julian, but that is soooooooooooooooo far off-base, it's on a different planet!

You don't know us that well, but trust me: there are plenty of members on here who would bend over backwards to help another forum member - without ANY expectation of reward, and purely to help that other member out - even (or, more accurately, especially ) where our markets overlap, as obviously we can more easily help / cover etc for people close by.

The back-stabbing world of which you speak is (generally) limited to the less-professional, undercutting DJs.

Apart from actually helping each other out in the physical world, we are all on here every day sharing tips and tricks that might help another member improve their business / gain more bookings, etc, and certainly not to feed false information to the competition!!!!! :mad:

[Booche]

I aggree were not all here to steal/out-do whatever you want to call it each other as myself personnally have 2 perfect examples of help and helping others on here,

1. Offering to help another member FREE of charge to load/unload equipment etc just purely to gain more experiance and to get to know people on the forum also this member is in my covered "area" so does that make him competition, in my eyes no as he puts alot of work into what he does and it pays off but im not ringing his venues up trying to undercut him and vice-versa,

2. Another forum member driving nearlly 2hours just to come and lend a hand for me out of just purely being in the same business and knowing what its like to be either stuck or having a gig which if only covered by yourself (one-man/woman) would be a struggle, again this person isn't trying to poach/steal or whatever business, he is doing it to lend a hand.

I personnally see this forum as a friends forum who are in the same line of business regardless of price,services or what they have to offer.

Cheers Dave :)

[Danno13]

Just to give another angle on the competitor vs colleague argument, I did a quick tot up the other day and looking at 4 the DJs (3 of whom post on here) who I've worked with the most over the last 3-4 years, this equated to just shy of £20,000 of work (and from memory, another £900 just this month)!!!

And that's not even looking at work they've done on my behalf where I make a comission, or around 6-7 other DJs I can think of who've passed the odd lead/booking/hired from me from etc. etc. Or of course, the help and advise I've had from countless DJs both in real life and on forums.

Nah.. there are no friends in business... :soapbox:

[JDB Entertainment]

Okay I have sat back very quietly and watched this thread and now feel the time is right for my only post of this thread!

Firstly to Charlie

Charlie, I have watched you from when you joined this forum and have to say the help and advice you have had from other forum members has been invaluable and will and has made a difference to the way you work and run your business.

I am sure you will agree that without this forum you would not be where you was today.

Darren especially has spent a lot of time with you and shown you many different parts of the business and this in my opinion is something I am sure a lot of forum members would love to have had the opportunity, myself included.

Maybe your "new" website and your day with Julian should have been 2 seperate threads. (Mods?!)

As for your day with Julian...

The flyer as has been previously mentioned does not shout Wedding DJ/Disco to any potential customer in terms of design apart from the obvious words "Wedding DJ/Disco" and is would be better aimed towards the 18th/21st Birthday Parties.

Julian is not a DJ and although he may run a successfull business it is a completely different business to our's. I appreciate he is trying to help you, but I feel (and don't take this personally Julian) he is a little bit out of his depth here as he is not in the Industry.

Yes we can all do Market Research and I for one as most of you know used to be a Car Salesman but being a DJ is a completely different job to running an Advertising Business.

If you want to target the £199 Weddings be my guest, however you are worth more than that in my opinion and from previous forum posts you are/were aspiring to be a £400+(example) DJ.

This to me is a step back for yourself and although I hope you prove me wrong I would maybe have a day away from the forum and your business and think exactly what you are aiming to achieve, etc.

To Julian

As previously said I appreciate the fact you are trying to help Charlie and yes of course it is for your own benefit aswell.

I also accept the fact you have told Charlie he does not have to take your advice/business plan.

One thing I will say you have done since joining this forum is actually shown how close the forum members are and how much we strive(well most of us) to not be £60 Sids and actually give the business of "A DJ" a good reputation and name.

I am full time at this business and without this forum would still be doing gigs for a lot less than what I charge now. I would have also not have learnt a lot more important stuff such as PLI, PAT, etc. if it was not for this forum.

The members of this forum may be competition when it comes to taking on gigs if they are in the same area, however I know a lot of the DJ's in my area I have either worked for, they have worked for me or I have hired kit from them and without this forum I would not have met these people.

Networking with the likes of Dan, Ben, Phil, Scott, etc. has been invaluable for me.

So I will take this opportunity to thank them and also the forum! :beer1:

I have already stated in another "UK Bride" thread that I will not be investing in advertising on UK Bride and have my reasons for this, which if you would like to know I will PM you. I do wish all those advertising on UK Bride the best of luck and hope they do well from it.

FINALLY to the rest of the forum

It is good to see that although we are in the same business and in effect competition to each other for one reason or another, that we do help each other out and offer advise, etc.

I have took a bit of a backseat in posting on this forum and have gained alot of knowledge etc. from it.

All this "UK Bride" stuff has made me realise maybe it is time I gave more back to this forum than I have been.

I have had a lot of personal issues over the past 6 months as Dan, Phil, Scott, etc. know and this is why I have not posted much, however here is to me hopefully helping and/or making a difference to at least 1 forum member and also to all of the members of this forum!! :beer1: :beer1:

James

P.S. This is OFFICIALLY my longest post on MDD! Hope I didn't bore you! :P

[OllieJames]

Julian, I'm well aware that business is business, whether I'm young or not. However I believe you need to learn more about this business before you make statements like that. Although they're both businesses, they are very different. In this game, it's foolish to not have good contacts/friends as the others have pointed out, although I can imagine this is not the case in marketing/wedding forums.

[Ukbride Owner]

Great comments, I will take some of them onboard!

[yourdj]

Love the site! ;)

Have not had time too have a good browse.
flash is brilliant with the logo on - im trying to work out how to do that now :D
I would say there is allot of information too take in and the navigation may be confusing too some but much better than the other rubbish out there. :)

That logo is EXCELENT and although the designer may have produced a more clubby style some tweaks will make that in to a splendid leaflet :)

Put the prices up as im sure people have said - or you will get some proper idiots :o
Its cheap to attract UK bride people and it wont help your business trust me. :)

Excellent work, but as said have fun while your young and definitely go travelling and go too uni - trust me on that one :)

oh - if you get that printed get a matt finish with spot UV (shiny on the logo area etc) it will cost more but be well worth it!!

[Corabar Steve]

Charlie, I have watched you from when you joined this forum
That's clever, he was here 2 months before you! :sj: :sj:

[Ukbride Owner]

THE CHARLIE CHALLENGE,

Okay Charlie you have been debated thoroughly (190 posts), so it seems you have two clear choices...

1) Take on board the experience of the DJ's on this forum, they have many more years experience in DJing than me (I have none).

a) Increase your prices to £399 (I think this price is acceptable by the DJ's on here).
b) Don't offer discounts
c) Change the logo and the leaflet to be more weddingy
d) Get a balance in your life you are very young


2) Listen to me, I have many more years experience in marketing (most on here have none).

a) Charge £299.
b) Offer a £100 discount to UKbride members ONLY (as the poll shows that that is the 'expectation' of brides.
c) Keep the designs that we have done and the logo. Brides are bombarded with weddingy leaflets everyday from UKbride, so this one will stand out from the crowd.
d) Get a balance in your life you are very young.

[Corabar Steve]

All you are doing is encouraging undercutting. A practice that is pretty much universally despised

[Jambo]

Well what a thread!

I have sat here and read through the posts this morning took and age to get through the lot.

I think that Charlie has been given some extremely valuable advice and help by everyone on this forum and also dare I say from Julian!

I think the main thing here is what Charlie decides to do with all of this help and advice!

The intelligent thing to do would be to take all of this information and go away and use it to come up with his own business strategy! He has a lot to think about, he does not really have to go with what the forum members say or what Julian has advised but he can take bits from all of this and come up with something unique that suits his own situation and experience.

Where the £199.00 UKB discos are concerned it could be used as a very good marketing ploy if it was for a short introductory period only, Charlie could actually gain a lot of "word of mouth" bookings through the UKB forum if the clients that take up his £199.00 offer think that he is good and professional which he can then charge his original intended fees for his services.

Of course Julian has his own vested interest in the service that he has offered to Charlie but as Julian has stated there is no obligation on Charlie's part to either act on or accept Julians advice and help!

Charlie I wish you a lot of success with you Djing career, you are young and energetic and remind me of myself at your age! I was working as a DJ 6 nights a week between the age of 18-20 but then other things came along and my direction changed.

One thing I will say is that when I gave up doing Disco's 15 years ago I was charging £275 a night back then, yes there were the guys that would do it for £50-£100 back then and I have seen a lot of them at friends weddings but at the end of the day the right clients will always pay that bit extra for a quality service.

I was given a bit of advice years ago by and old associate and that was "never sell yourself short" there are always going to be those who will do things cheaper but that does not mean that you have to lower yourself to their rates or standards.

Be Lucky mate and I hope hat you manage to find a happy medium from all the advice that you have been given!

[Jambo]

THE CHARLIE CHALLENGE,

Okay Charlie you have been debated thoroughly (190 posts), so it seems you have two clear choices...

1) Take on board the experience of the DJ's on this forum, they have many more years experience in DJing than me (I have none).

a) Increase your prices to £399 (I think this price is acceptable by the DJ's on here).
b) Don't offer discounts
c) Change the logo and the leaflet to be more weddingy
d) Get a balance in your life you are very young


2) Listen to me, I have many more years experience in marketing (most on here have none).

a) Charge £299.
b) Offer a £100 discount to UKbride members ONLY (as the poll shows that that is the 'expectation' of brides.
c) Keep the designs that we have done and the logo. Brides are bombarded with weddingy leaflets everyday from UKbride, so this one will stand out from the crowd.
d) Get a balance in your life you are very young.

Julian

Why does the choice have to be so straight cut, why cannot Charlie accept all of the advice and take on board the points that you make from the polls within your site and combine everything and the come up with a happy medium that suits himself?

BTW I have a lot of experience in the wedding industry offering customers various services for the past 29 years!

[rob1963]

I don't understand why it's good for a business to offer their services very cheap.

Not everyone goes on price alone.

If they did, the many on here who charge a decent amount wouldn't get any work!

:confused:

[Jambo]

I don't understand why it's good for a business to offer their services very cheap.

Not everyone goes on price alone.

If they did, the many on here who charge a decent amount wouldn't get any work!

:confused:

Rob I totally agree, undercutting and discounting unless aimed at a specific target audience for a very short period of time is very unhealthy for the industry as a whole! all it ends up doing is devaluing the industry to a point where all of the good people retire due to not being able to make a decent living and leaving the bad DJ's to further degrade the industry!

[Corabar Steve]

What Julian seems to be forgetting is that if Charlie wants to make a living out of this industry, a £199 gig will barely cover his costs & certainly won't be 100% profit.

Outgoings & the actual costs of gigs have been discussed on this forum many times. Julian is clearly unaware of just how much goes into doing a gig other than the actual playing time (Both financially & physically. Time & costs of preparation, travel, paperwork, cost of music, insurance, PAT, etc....)

Yes you can make money out of £199 gigs, but not enough if you want to be in this business full time & for any length of time.

[Vectis]

THE CHARLIE CHALLENGE,

Okay Charlie you have been debated thoroughly (190 posts), so it seems you have two clear choices...

1) Take on board the experience of the DJ's on this forum, they have many more years experience in DJing than me (I have none).

a) Increase your prices to £399 (I think this price is acceptable by the DJ's on here).
b) Don't offer discounts
c) Change the logo and the leaflet to be more weddingy
d) Get a balance in your life you are very young


2) Listen to me, I have many more years experience in marketing (most on here have none).

a) Charge £299.
b) Offer a £100 discount to UKbride members ONLY (as the poll shows that that is the 'expectation' of brides.
c) Keep the designs that we have done and the logo. Brides are bombarded with weddingy leaflets everyday from UKbride, so this one will stand out from the crowd.
d) Get a balance in your life you are very young.


My advice to Charlie is based on #2, Julian will be pleased to know :)

Sure, I could've milked Charlie's initial idea to build a second website and identity to support this experiment, but I'm not like that.

After due deliberation (and with 25 years DJ industry experience outranking Julian's 15 years marketing ;) ) I've recommended the following to Charlie...

a) Charge £299.
b) Offer a £100 discount to UKbride members ONLY (as the poll shows that that is the 'expectation' of brides.
c) Launch an offer BASED ON the UK Bride designs and logo, for a limited period (ie not hurting the Christmas season) AND for non-Saturday weddings only. The offer is for a specific package which doesn't include the pre-meeting, has a limited travel radius and is time-bound to 5 hours. This cuts Charlie's costs per gig to somewhere around the £50-60 mark and once you take prep and travel time into consideration still returns him over £20/hour.

To support this we have a new page on the website with no links in or out to the main website, and which can be linked to his ad on UK Bride. The final content isn't yet agreed with Charlie but it's at

http://www.charliebrownsentertainment.com/ukbrideoffer.php for thoughts and comments.

d) Get a balance in your life you are very young.


We've also adopted the UK Bride provided logo element, as I do think this is quite cool :beer1:


Don't forget that the objective here is to prove or disprove some of the claimed facts which Charlie is keen to do. However, to do it in such a way that is easily reversible and will not harm his business. It should also generate some pocket money in the meantime ;)

[Corabar Steve]

Pocket money being the key phrase.

[Vectis]

Pocket money being the key phrase.

Quite. And we all know what the outcome is going to be, but Charlie is young, optimistic and enthusiastic about the idea. At least this way it won't cost him anything to try it out :)

[Corabar Entertainment]

My advice to Charlie is based on #2, Julian will be pleased to know :)

Sure, I could've milked Charlie's initial idea to build a second website and identity to support this experiment, but I'm not like that.

After due deliberation (and with 25 years DJ industry experience outranking Julian's 15 years marketing ;) ) I've recommended the following to Charlie...

a) Charge £299.
b) Offer a £100 discount to UKbride members ONLY (as the poll shows that that is the 'expectation' of brides.
c) Launch an offer BASED ON the UK Bride designs and logo, for a limited period (ie not hurting the Christmas season) AND for non-Saturday weddings only. The offer is for a specific package which doesn't include the pre-meeting, has a limited travel radius and is time-bound to 5 hours. This cuts Charlie's costs per gig to somewhere around the £50-60 mark and once you take prep and travel time into consideration still returns him over £20/hour.

To support this we have a new page on the website with no links in or out to the main website, and which can be linked to his ad on UK Bride. The final content isn't yet agreed with Charlie but it's at

http://www.charliebrownsentertainment.com/ukbrideoffer.php for thoughts and comments.

d) Get a balance in your life you are very young.


We've also adopted the UK Bride provided logo element, as I do think this is quite cool :beer1:


Don't forget that the objective here is to prove or disprove some of the claimed facts which Charlie is keen to do. However, to do it in such a way that is easily reversible and will not harm his business. It should also generate some pocket money in the meantime ;)Now THAT is more sensible / feasible! ;)

[Jambo]

I totally agree, but I still think that Charlie needs to find a medium that he is happy with, offering 1/3 off of your normal fees will may not have the desired effect, in fact it may work in reverse where the client may see him as being desperate for the work!

I would suggest offering the UKB a £50 discount which shows that he is offering them a substantial disocunt while not looking desperate for work! This should be a time limited offer for the bride to book before a certain date, this would also allow Charlie to offer the discount on all of his packages rather than just offering a very basic services and may also have the affect of attracting the bride that has a higher budget in mind for her DJ and not just attract the lower end of the market!

Offering a budget price and offering a discount to a target audience should really be viewed as 2 seperate things as offering a low budget price offer will only attract those at the lower end of the market but offering a discount across his range of packages will attract brides with verying budgets.

Charlie dont tie yourself to offering a low end service as you may find that will shape the way in which people view your service in the future!

[DJ INDIE]

it looks like some are now getting the idea - the price and strategy given is for the UKBRIDE market, and Charlie is free to do whatever else for other markets and customers.

I dont understand why everyone thinks he'll be tied in for ever - he is also free to turn gigs down if he's booked for more money elsewhere!

[Ukbride Owner]

My advice to Charlie is based on #2, Julian will be pleased to know :)

Sure, I could've milked Charlie's initial idea to build a second website and identity to support this experiment, but I'm not like that.

After due deliberation (and with 25 years DJ industry experience outranking Julian's 15 years marketing ;) ) I've recommended the following to Charlie...

a) Charge £299.
b) Offer a £100 discount to UKbride members ONLY (as the poll shows that that is the 'expectation' of brides.
c) Launch an offer BASED ON the UK Bride designs and logo, for a limited period (ie not hurting the Christmas season) AND for non-Saturday weddings only. The offer is for a specific package which doesn't include the pre-meeting, has a limited travel radius and is time-bound to 5 hours. This cuts Charlie's costs per gig to somewhere around the £50-60 mark and once you take prep and travel time into consideration still returns him over £20/hour.

To support this we have a new page on the website with no links in or out to the main website, and which can be linked to his ad on UK Bride. The final content isn't yet agreed with Charlie but it's at

http://www.charliebrownsentertainment.com/ukbrideoffer.php for thoughts and comments.

d) Get a balance in your life you are very young.


We've also adopted the UK Bride provided logo element, as I do think this is quite cool :beer1:


Don't forget that the objective here is to prove or disprove some of the claimed facts which Charlie is keen to do. However, to do it in such a way that is easily reversible and will not harm his business. It should also generate some pocket money in the meantime ;)



I am happy with your suggestions, I think it is a good compromise!!! :beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

Hey we are getting somewhere!!!

Charlie can still happily promote away at 'FROM *£199' which as we know will attract a lot of interest.

HORRAY!!!!! :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

I like the design of the webpage too, (can I polite ask that you call my site 'UKbride' not 'UK bride' and obviously when you are ready add the links to the site.

Julian

BTW - I too am 42, I actually have 26 years experience in the Marketing Industry (only 15 of them are self employed in the wedding marketing industry)... So you are outranked my friend ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

it looks like some are now getting the idea - the price and strategy given is for the UKBRIDE market

And what exactly is the UK Bride market? People getting married, so where is the difference?

[Jambo]

DJ Indie

I think the worry is that Charlie may be projecting the wrong image to his target clientelle and it may not have the desired affect of attracting more business!

He could project a far better image by offering a discount rather than a set price of £199.00 this way he could still offer those brides that want a pre event meeting a playlist consultation the discount but charge a higher fee!

It would also mean that the brides that have a higher budget for their Disco would not dismiss him as they will not view him as being at the lower end of the market!

I think that maybe he should be advertising on UKbride saying please call for free advice, £50 discount offered for all UKbride subscribers!

[Vectis]

HORRAY!!!!! :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)


Indeed :cool:



BTW - I too am 42, I actually have 26 years experience in the Marketing Industry (only 15 of them was self employed in the wedding marketing industry) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)

Ah, semantics. Actually my 25 years isn't contiguous as I've actually been DJing since the age of 10 (really... I have a picture somewhere to prove it) but had two short periods of abstinence for other career/family reasons. So this year will be my 33rd :D

[Ukbride Owner]

And what exactly is the UK Bride market? People getting married, so where is the difference?

I think it is because it is 'perceived' that UKbride ONLY attracts the bottom half of all brides in the UK.

Which we don't! :)

[Ukbride Owner]

Indeed :cool:



Ah, semantics. Actually my 25 years isn't contiguous as I've actually been DJing since the age of 10 (really... I have a picture somewhere to prove it) but had two short periods of abstinence for other career/family reasons. So this year will be my 33rd :D

LOL you have to have the last laugh, he who laughs last, laughs loudest!!!

:beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I think it is because it is 'perceived' that UKbride ONLY attracts the bottom half of all brides in the UK.

Which we don't! :)

According to your poll it does. You can't have it both ways now Julian, can you?

Either the poll is accurate as you say it is or it's not. ;)

[DJ James Lake]

I think the poll actually shows quite accurately that it markets very well to the bottom end of the market.

Which shows to me at least that from an advertisers point of view that if you want to target the higher paying functions the site as it stands is of very little use as my bottom package is way above the main price bracket.

Now to me if I was trying to sell advertising to a client and the client said your product is not right for me because it doesnt reach the target market I would look at how to change it so it does, not continually tell the client to lower there prices.

[simonp]

LOL you have to have the last laugh, he who laughs last, laughs loudest!!!


No, He who laughs last ............. doesn't get the joke :p

[Ukbride Owner]

According to your poll it does. You can't have it both ways now Julian, can you?

Either the poll is accurate as you say it is or it's not. ;)

The poll has been answered over 2500 times, I think the dust will settle at those figures if EVERY SINGLE BRIDE in the UK joined UKbride.

ie: I don't think the other half are all the 'rich' people.

There will be some that may not be attracted to the site. The main carrot is win a £25,000 wedding. If you were planning on spending £80,000, my carrot would be useless.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

my carrot would be useless.

There are treatments for men your age. :D

[Ukbride Owner]

I think the poll actually shows quite accurately that it markets very well to the bottom end of the market.

Which shows to me at least that from an advertisers point of view that if you want to target the higher paying functions the site as it stands is of very little use as my bottom package is way above the main price bracket.

Now to me if I was trying to sell advertising to a client and the client said your product is not right for me because it doesnt reach the target market I would look at how to change it so it does, not continually tell the client to lower there prices.

My point here is that the other half of brides in the UK are not necessarily the rich people. Also the brides who have answered the poll may not have a clue of how much their disco will cost. ie: If I said to you how much do you think it will be to advertise on UKbride. If you have not done any research you would have to pluck a figure from the sky.

72,000 brides to be join every year, it cost me thousands to get them there, I sponsor 50,000 keywords on Google alone, like "weddings", "wedding dress" etc. The site is not designed for the bottom end of the market.

Apart from my figures what other information do you have that supports the thinking that the other half of brides are the top end of the market? Actual proof?

[DJ James Lake]

ie: I don't think the other half are all the 'rich' people.

.

See this is where you go wrong, you really dont listen to what is being said here and I doubt you will change your thoughts anytime soon.

Its not about rich people its about how important the special day is to the bride. For a bride its a once in a lifetime day (or in theory) and they want perfection.

I really am beginning to wonder whether you really know anything about the wedding market.

Yeah you might have a successful website but you obviously came on here trying to gain more advertising. So far you have picked up a few new advertsisers and great for you, but if you want the bulk you really need to look at working with us and listening. You have all the tools on this and the people to help on this forum to educate brides to be about the dangers of trying to cut corners. If done UKBride will gain a lot more advertising revenue which at the end of the day is what you came here for in the first place.

[Mark Wild]

If done UKBride will gain a lot more advertising revenue which at the end of the day is what you came here for in the first place.

In all fairness I think Julian was initially attracted to MDD as he wondered why his analytics were showing so many hits from here, correct me if I'm wrong.

[DJ James Lake]

In all fairness I think Julian was initially attracted to MDD as he wondered why his analytics were showing so many hits from here, correct me if I'm wrong.

I think it still mounts to the same end strategy regardless. Why do you think he would interested in why the hits were coming from here in the first place?

[Mark Wild]

Why do you think he would interested in why the hits were coming from here in the first place?

I can't speak for Julian, but, if my analytics were showing a large number of hits from a forum, I'd be intrigued to investigate the reason why. My point is he didn't initially come here to tout for business, he's seen an opportunity after the fact granted, which is just good business acumen.

[Corabar Entertainment]

In fairness, I don't think it should come as a surprise to any of us that there is a large proportion of brides in the UK who are not our target market.

Of course there are many, many, brides out there that are going to pay £200 for their disco, but, looking at actual NUMBERS of brides willing to pay more, it is still pretty substantial.

As I have read on here many times (or things similar), you have a large number of suppliers chasing the bulk of the leads, but fewer chasing the others, meaning that there are actually MORE available bookings per capita for the 'silver service' DJs out there.

Think of the 'Low Hanging Fruit' principle.

What would be nice, is if brides could be educated on why they shouldn't be putting the entertainment to the bottom of their budgeting list, and why it is worth spending that bit extra.

All but a few of those brides will have more than sufficient budget to pay 99% of the fees of the DJs on here... it's just that they are choosing to spend it on wedding favours, stationery, cakes and flowers!

[DJ James Lake]

My point is he didn't initially come here to tout for business, he's seen an opportunity after the fact granted, which is just good business acumen.

But is also good business acumen to listen to why potential customer won't use your services.

[Ukbride Owner]

I am listening. And I don't want to start into a slagging match again.

Mark is right I only came on here to defend my corner, as my site was instantly thought of as a con.



See this is where you go wrong, you really dont listen to what is being said here and I doubt you will change your thoughts anytime soon. - Let's keep it nice :)

Its not about rich people its about how important the special day is to the bride. For a bride its a once in a lifetime day (or in theory) and they want perfection. I totally agree with that, they want their dream day, unfortunately they want it all in for £1,000!!!

I really am beginning to wonder whether you really know anything about the wedding market. I do know an awful lot, and I am happy to share my knowledge with you, I have hundreds of poll results that have been answered thousands of times, I can keep publishing them on here if you are happy to ACCEPT that the results are what they are.

Look at it this way...

How easy would it have been for me to say

a) 75% want to spend £800 on their disco

b) 20% want to spend £500

c) 5% want to spend £300

Anyone want to advertise for £117 a year.

I HAVE BEEN HONEST WITH MY ANSWERS - DONT SHOOT THE MESSENGER I AM JUST GIVING YOU THE RESULTS OF THOUSANDS OF ANSWERS FROM BRIDES TO BE!!! :) :) :) :)

[Mark Wild]

But is also good business acumen to listen to why potential customer won't use your services.

That has nothing to do with the point I was trying to get across.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

What would be nice, is if brides could be educated on why they shouldn't be putting the entertainment to the bottom of their budgeting list, and why it is worth spending that bit extra.


Agreed and the more guys like Julian understand our industry, the more we can be helped by people like him.

[Ukbride Owner]

That has nothing to do with the point I was trying to get across.

Mark are you starting to see things me way a little? :beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

As a former marketing professional I know that if I can get you on board I have reached the pinnacle of my career and can retire!!! :) :) :)

[DJ James Lake]

Agreed and the more guys like Julian understand our industry, the more we can be helped by people like him.

I totally agree but surely to understand you have to listen though, and the way things are coming across it doesn't look that way.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I am listening. And I don't want to start into a slagging match again.

Mark is right I only came on here to defend my corner, as my site was instantly thought of as a con.


See comments like that don't do you any favours Julian. I started the thread about your site after I was contacted. I have just re-read the first 5 or so pages of the thread until you turned up and apart from a couple of dismissive comments, no-one said your were trying to con people.

I have been more than fair so far, so please try and think about comments you are making as this isn't the first time that you've made unfair remarks that simply aren't true.

[DJ James Lake]

Look at it this way...

How easy would it have been for me to say

a) 75% want to spend £800 on their disco

b) 20% want to spend £500

c) 5% want to spend £300

Anyone want to advertise for £117 a year.

I HAVE BEEN HONEST WITH MY ANSWERS - DONT SHOOT THE MESSENGER I AM JUST GIVING YOU THE RESULTS OF THOUSANDS OF ANSWERS FROM BRIDES TO BE!!! :) :) :) :)

I have never agreed your polls aren't accurate but thats where the problems lie and the basis to my whole point.

You are in a position to help educate.

I will ask one question of you.

Are you prepared to help forum members by assisting in educating brides to be with the dangers of always buying cheap?

[Ukbride Owner]

See comments like that don't do you any favours Julian. I started the thread about your site after I was contacted. I have just re-read the first 5 or so pages of the thread until you turned up and apart from a couple of dismissive comments, no-one said your were trying to con people.

I have been more than fair so far, so please try and think about comments you are making as this isn't the first time that you've made unfair remarks that simply aren't true.

I TOTALLY take back my comment. I used the word 'con' to speed the answer up. It was being put down though by some and was not seen at positively by some members either. That is why I stepped into the ring, NOT to sell advertising.

I am happy help!!! If I wasn't I would have left ages ago (in fairness I have already left twice :) :) )

You tell me what you want to say to my members and I will run a story or do whatever it takes.

But it wont conjure up the cash for the bride.

[DJ James Lake]

But it wont conjure up the cash for the bride.

There you go again.

[Corabar Entertainment]

But it wont conjure up the cash for the bride.It's not a case of 'conjuring up the cash' Julian...


What would be nice, is if brides could be educated on why they shouldn't be putting the entertainment to the bottom of their budgeting list, and why it is worth spending that bit extra.

All but a few of those brides will have more than sufficient budget to pay 99% of the fees of the DJs on here... it's just that they are choosing to spend it on wedding favours, stationery, cakes and flowers!You yourself have told us that from your research, brides put us to the bottom of the pile!

[DJ INDIE]

The Ukbride market is a selection of people getting married. Poll results have been published exclusively to MDD to show projected average spend, and a plan put in place to win business and use that to grow a business.



Everyone else is a different selection, you have no idea at all of projected budget, and can quote as high or as low as you like.

There are also a few HUGE glaring errors a lot of you are making about cost and bottom end of the market quotes and the site. I thought a lot of the business minded on here would see. But too many seem to be slamming the site rather than using it to their advantage.



And what exactly is the UK Bride market? People getting married, so where is the difference?

[DJ James Lake]

The Ukbride market is a selection of people getting married. Poll results have been published exclusively to MDD to show projected average spend, and a plan put in place to win business and use that to grow a business.

Where exactly is that plan that would help grow my business when the projected average spend reflected in the polls is below the price of my lowest package which is the lowest I can go out for and still maintain a living after my costs. And please dont say discount rates.


There are also a few HUGE glaring errors a lot of you are making about cost and bottom end of the market quotes and the site. I thought a lot of the business minded on here would see. But too many seem to be slamming the site rather than using it to their advantage.

I dont think that is the case at all, what we are saying is as the site stands at the moment there is no advantage to advertsing. What we are also saying is that through education it could be.

[Ukbride Owner]

Where exactly is that plan that would help grow my business when the projected average spend reflected in the polls is below the price of my lowest package which is the lowest I can go out for and still maintain a living after my costs. And please dont say discount rates.



I dont think that is the case at all, what we are saying is as the site stands at the moment there is no advantage to advertsing. What we are also saying is that through education it could be.

James I have just checked for you there are just 6 brides (in two weeks) who live in Northamptonshire and have said that they are spending OVER £400 on their wedding disco, small numbers I know. But that is in just 2 weeks since the poll has been running.

so that equates to 156 leads a year. The spend for those brides in NORTHAMPTONSHIRE is a MINIMUM of £62,400.

I have their name, addresses, email, telephone number, quantity of guests, wedding budget and wedding date. They have ALL opted in to 3rd party information.

Are you interested in THAT list?

[Jambo]

I TOTALLY take back my comment. I used the word 'con' to speed the answer up. It was being put down though by some and was not seen at positively by some members either. That is why I stepped into the ring, NOT to sell advertising.

I am happy help!!! If I wasn't I would have left ages ago (in fairness I have already left twice :) :) )

You tell me what you want to say to my members and I will run a story or do whatever it takes.

But it wont conjure up the cash for the bride.

Julian, we undertand that it will not conjure up any extra cash for the bride but it may make them reconsider the priorities for the wedding and divert some of the cash that they had allocated for something else to spend on getting a better Disco for their evening entertainment!

[DJ James Lake]

James I have just checked for you there are just 6 brides (in two weeks) who live in Northamptonshire and have said that they are spending OVER £400 on their wedding disco, small numbers I know. But that is in just 2 weeks since the poll has been running.

so that equates to 156 leads a year. The spend for those brides in NORTHAMPTONSHIRE is a MINIMUM of £62,400.

I have their name, addresses, email, telephone number, quantity of guests, wedding budget and wedding date. They have ALL opted in to 3rd party information.

Are you interested in THAT list?

I would be but personally I need more convincing from the site that it is working towards increasing the higher end of the market before I would commit to anything. The amount of interest in that level would have to increase dramatcally to make it viable considering the number of pro djs in my area that would be also following up those leads

[Jambo]

I think that the whole problem here lies with the brides priorities! Brides need to be re-educated to realise that the evening entertainment is the last (if not only where evening guests are concerned) memory of their wedding, they could have the best dress, a wonderful service, beautiful bridesmaids but of the entertainment in the evening falls short of guests expectations then they will leave having not enjoyed themselves!

[StarZSoundS]

Julian, we undertand that it will not conjure up any extra cash for the bride but it may make them reconsider the priorities for the wedding and divert some of the cash that they had allocated for something else to spend on getting a better Disco for their evening entertainment!

Why would Julian do that??


He's going to prejudice his Caterers,Dressmakers,Limo Suppliers and Cake people....by doing that.

The Bride has so much to spend on a Wedding.Julian wants all his Advertisers (In different departments) to have a slice of it.He's not bothered how big each slice is??How popular is he going to be with the Cake Supllier if he tells his Brides they are spending the money wrongly!!!

I think we need to be more realistic!!:confused: :confused: :confused:

[DJ James Lake]

Why would Julian do that??


He's going to prejudice his Caterers,Dressmakers,Limo Suppliers and Cake people....by doing that.

The Bride has so much to spend on a Wedding.Julian wants all his Advertisers (In different departments) to have a slice of it.He's not bothered how big each slice is??How popular is he going to be with the Cake Supllier if he tells his Brides they are spending the money wrongly!!!

I think we need to be more realistic!!:confused: :confused: :confused:

Going at it from the wrong angle. Its not us that need to be more realistic its brides, the need educating that they may need to increase there budget to get what they want.

[Corabar Entertainment]

Why would Julian do that??


He's going to prejudice his Caterers,Dressmakers,Limo Suppliers and Cake people....by doing that.

The Bride has so much to spend on a Wedding.Julian wants all his Advertisers (In different departments) to have a slice of it.He's not bothered how big each slice is??How popular is he going to be with the Cake Supllier if he tells his Brides they are spending the money wrongly!!!

I think we need to be more realistic!!:confused: :confused: :confused:£5-£10 off of every other thing they are going to buy would easily boost their entertainment budget by a hundred or two. we're not talking about slashing other budgets, just a small re-allocation of priorities here.

We all know from experience that there are a lot of brides who put very little importance on the DJ and so do not allocate funds - instead getting the cheapest they can find, whilst blowing huge amounts on other things. We all also know that, after the event, many brides really regret having done so.

[Jambo]

Why would Julian do that??


He's going to prejudice his Caterers,Dressmakers,Limo Suppliers and Cake people....by doing that.

The Bride has so much to spend on a Wedding.Julian wants all his Advertisers (In different departments) to have a slice of it.He's not bothered how big each slice is??How popular is he going to be with the Cake Supllier if he tells his Brides they are spending the money wrongly!!!

I think we need to be more realistic!!:confused: :confused: :confused:


Julian doesnt have to tell brides that they are spending too much on anything else, I feel that they really need to be educated to realise that to get a decent, experienced and professional DJ they need to spend a bit more money, also they need to realise just how important the evenings entertainment really is.

I attended a wedding many years ago where the DJ was so bad that many of the guests (me included) ended up leaving the wedding and going to the local pub!

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I have deleted posts with too much advertising on them as this is starting to get silly.

[Ukbride Owner]

I have deleted posts with too much advertising on them as this is starting to get silly.

Cool, no worries at all.

It is hard to get the message across without getting too pluggy. :beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

[StarZSoundS]

Julian doesnt have to tell brides that they are spending too much on anything else, I feel that they really need to be educated to realise that to get a decent, experienced and professional DJ they need to spend a bit more money, also they need to realise just how important the evenings entertainment really is.



But all of these threads are peppered with mentions of the Dress,Cake, Catering etc etc.

If we are now talking the cost of the whole Canoodle its a totally different Ball-Game.

All he's got to do is talk the Brides into spending £25,000 not £20,000 and he's away.Easy!!:confused: :confused: :confused:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Cool, no worries at all.

It is hard to get the message across without getting too pluggy. :beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

I understand.

I have PM'd you.

[Steve the DJ]

Sorry, I just can't stop myself...


...so that equates to 156 leads a year. The spend for those brides in NORTHAMPTONSHIRE is a MINIMUM of £62,400.

No it isn't, you have had 6 Brides in 6 weeks in his area, in the next 6 weeks you might not get any!

You can't expect to be taken seriously when you use narrow data and then try and use that to predict the future, it's just...

:Rob James:

It is that dodgy car salesman liberal approach to facts that turns people off. :(

[Booche]

Ive been asked by Charlie to pop this in to hopefully make his magazine spread look abit better :)

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s177/ghostriderbaby/cbmag.png

[SC Events]

That looks fantastic...for 18th's and 21st's. :)

It just doesn't scream 'Wedding' at me.

[Charlie Brown]

Well Ladies & Gentlemen...

Charlie Brown has had 4 enquiries today and they all want a quote...I'm hoping they are not the £199 bookings - but still - It's filling last minute dates in my diary!

[Shakermaker Promotions]

UK Bride - I've sat and read your comments both on this subject and over the past few weeks. How can you say that people have been rude to you!!? It's a forum with different opinions. If everyone thought the same thing, it would be very boring.

I can't take your comments personally as I have not really taken that much interest in what you've said to be honest (and I don't mean that to sound bad). As far as I can see (going on what I've read so far), you come across as a bit of a 'know all'. Fair enough, you've had 15 years experience or whatever it is but that does not mean that you know this industry. You may think you do judging by what your subscribers may say but how many of them know our industry either?

Best of luck to Charlie. He has a passion for what he does (as do most of us) and it's really nice and encouraging to see someone his age doing something worthwhile. He has goals that he has set himself and good luck to him. I'm sure he has a decent head on his shoulders.