Fireworks triggered by music

[Corabar Entertainment]

A client phoned us the other day with a garbled message from the company who is doing the fireworks at his wedding.

We asked to speak direct to the fireworks company, but the client didn't have their contact details to hand and so said he would get them to contact us. (We're waiting for their call).

Prior to speaking to them, I was wondering if anyone on here had any prior experience / knowledge that might shed some light on what they may be after.

All we have so far is that the firework company want to run the music for the fireworks through our system... BUT the link is somehow a trigger for the fireworks so that the fireworks go off in time to the music.

As I mentioned, the client really doesn't have much of an idea, but he mentioned 'phantom power', 'XLR', 'DII Standard', and that the fireworks company told him that 'it would be the same thing that we were using to control lights' (which we can only assume is 'DMX' :confused: )

Any ideas from anyone prior to this company contacting us? :daft:

[Excalibur]

Any good?

[Jiggles]

DMX + Fireworks/ pyro = Major disaster waiting to happen! Dangerous! It will be a specialist detonation program they will have.

[DJ Jules]

Phantom power & DI sounds like they expect you to use a Direct Injection box (which is what you'd use to connect a high impedance source to a low impedance input - e.g. Guitar to Mixer) to connect their music to your system.

Fireworks aren't allowed to be triggered using DMX - there's something in the DMX specs from memory which states that it's a protocol for non-critical systems only.

I'd expect the firework company to be using software to play back the music with markers at specific points in the song to electronically trigger the fireworks - they may be using a DI box to lift the earth to remove the noise classically associated with connecting a laptop to a mixing desk.

But, I have no practical experience of fireworks, or firework control software so I'm guessing (except for the DI bit).

Julian

[Corabar Entertainment]

Peter: :lol:

Callum: (as the forum expert on blowing things up :D) Yes - kind of got the gist of that, but how does it connect/work, etc

[Jiggles]

Fireworks aren't allowed to be triggered using DMX - there's something in the DMX specs from memory which states that it's a protocol for non-critical systems only.


Yeh there is no error checking in the system. One wrong signal being transmit and BOOM! someones injured!

RE Angela

Depends on what system they use. I think they are wanting a connection from a PC into your PA. Kind of like How longs a piece of string!

[Excalibur]

Yeh there is no error checking in the system. One wrong signal being transmit and BOOM! someones injured!

RE Angela

Depends on what system they use. I think they are wanting a connection from a PC into your PA. Kind of like How longs a piece of string!

It sort of depends which way things are going. If their system is fully self contained, and they just want to run a signal into your PA so the punters hear the music, it's not too tricky. If they want your music to actually be the trigger, that's way out of my league. :o :o :o

I'd recommend ( as you've probably realised) that the only proper course of action is to speak directly to the Firework Man. ( And take the extra big box of cables to the gig )

[Corabar Entertainment]

Phantom power & DI sounds like they expect you to use a Direct Injection box (which is what you'd use to connect a high impedance source to a low impedance input - e.g. Guitar to Mixer) to connect their music to your system.

Fireworks aren't allowed to be triggered using DMX - there's something in the DMX specs from memory which states that it's a protocol for non-critical systems only.

I'd expect the firework company to be using software to play back the music with markers at specific points in the song to electronically trigger the fireworks - they may be using a DI box to lift the earth to remove the noise classically associated with connecting a laptop to a mixing desk.

But, I have no practical experience of fireworks, or firework control software so I'm guessing (except for the DI bit).

JulianAh.... that's starting to clear some fog! :)

:thanks:

[Larry B Entertainment]

I'd expect the firework company to be using software to play back the music with markers at specific points in the song to electronically trigger the fireworks - they may be using a DI box to lift the earth to remove the noise classically associated with connecting a laptop to a mixing desk.


Julian

Found some info here........
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13526_3-9985586-27.html

[discomobiledj]

This might help explain it....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6976248.stm

Bottom of the page.

[CRAZY K]

Ah.... that's starting to clear some fog! :)

:thanks:

Might be worth running this past your Insurance people--just to be safe in view of the unusual type of activity and the attitude of Insurers these days:eek:

Also how much PLI do they want--they would have very high cover I would imagine in their business.

[Corabar Entertainment]

At this point in time, I'm not even sure that we're going to be able to give them what they want.

However, I can't see how it would affect our PLI in any way (care to elaborate? :confused: ) ..... although it might be a good idea for US to ask for a copy of THEIR PLI! ;)

[TONYTIGER]

I have no idea how it works but have done it,if that makes sense.
Process went like this put music required on memory stick (10 min) send to firework company they then gave me a cd on the night i played cd and gave them a signal feed out of the mixer which they fed into there system .

It worked perfect but don,t ask me how :confused:

[CRAZY K]

At this point in time, I'm not even sure that we're going to be able to give them what they want.

However, I can't see how it would affect our PLI in any way (care to elaborate? :confused: ) ..... although it might be a good idea for US to ask for a copy of THEIR PLI! ;)

Simple--an incident occurs involving a nasty accident involving fireworks--there was one over here at Wicksteed Park where Steve and I are working next month--:eek:

As a result of an "accident" people were badly injured---as a result they stopped having Firework displays for a while--nasty injuroes to people--

I just think in this rotten claim culture we have presently anyone will try suing anyone--especially if they get free legal aid--so best to be sure your covered--dont ask me how they would make you liable--they just make it up and have a go no win no fee--obviously you need a defence lawyer from the Insurance Co.

The lady currently claiming against Simon Cowell for loss of earnings because he said she could not sing is a classic example--but he has to pay lawyers to fight it ridiculous as it is.

Just my view

;)

[Corabar Entertainment]

I have no idea how it works but have done it,if that makes sense.
Process went like this put music required on memory stick (10 min) send to firework company they then gave me a cd on the night i played cd and gave them a signal feed out of the mixer which they fed into there system .

It worked perfect but don,t ask me how :confused:Hi Tony

Can you recall how you linked from your mixer to their system?

[TONYTIGER]

Hi Tony

Can you recall how you linked from your mixer to their system?

Hi ,just took a pair of XLRs off booth output quite long which they plugged into there system all they seem to need is master signal of what you are playing as all the info must be on the cd they gave me.

[Corabar Entertainment]

OK - Thanks..... that sounds simple enough!!! :lol:

Still waiting for the firework company to contact us, but I'll let you all know as soon as I do.

If all they need is XLRs, not sure why client is talking about phantom power, etc :confused: ....unless, of course, they were trying to explain THEIR system to him, rather than stating what they needed from us? :confused: :confused: Hopefully, all will become clear when we actually get to speak to them. Just wanted to have a little background info before they called so that we could be a little bit prepared..... THANKS EVERYONE! :approve: :thanks:

[Chris1984]

They will want to do one of 3 things.
1) you send them audio in which they let the fireworks off too - they will just need a feed so they can here the music - this is the most common

2) they send you audio so they are self contained

3) you send them a time code feed which you won't have the kit to do and is a very rare thing even on the big shows.

It will more than Lilly they just want a feed to a monitor that they have so they can here the music.

[Excalibur]

Angela, i've already posted a picture of my chief technical officer with the detonator, here's the head of IT, programming a particularly tricky routine into the touch screen laptop. ( He has to do that sort of thing, it's way too advanced for me. :( :( :o :o You can tell that by the baffled expression I'm wearing. )

They're both available for advice if needed, for a reasonable fee.

[rob1963]

Is that a laptop I see?

Whoaaaa Peter...you've certainly moved with the times!

:D :D :D

[Excalibur]

Is that a laptop I see?

Whoaaaa Peter...you've certainly moved with the times!

:D :D :D

Rob, to be serious, in this game it's not possible to stand still. If you try to do that, you go backwards. My present way of working is as ideal as I can make it at the moment. Having a laptop as secondary/backup playout and download capability is in my opinion the best way.


I know we're all different, so what works for one maybe doesn't for another. Rob, I know you appear to do all you preparation in advance, so that you don't need to download at the gig, but I just couldn't cope without that option now.

[Vectis]

Personally I find it easier to keep the socks paired throughout the laundry cycle; definitely saves time later.

THESE (http://www.lakeland.co.uk/sock-savers/F/keyword/Sockies/product/22398) really help, too :D

[Excalibur]

Personally I find it easier to keep the socks paired throughout the laundry cycle; definitely saves time later.

THESE (http://www.lakeland.co.uk/sock-savers/F/keyword/Sockies/product/22398) really help, too :D

Vectis, my friend, if I hadn't met you in person, I'd think you were the most nitpicking, pernickety, detail obsessed, nerdy control freak ion the entire universe. ;) :eek:

For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure, Martin's actually as normal as it's possible for a DJ to be. :beer1: :D :D

EDIT: Martin, I find that having odd socks actually gives you more pairs to choose from. ;) ;) :D :D :D

[Corabar Entertainment]

Chris: Thanks for your input.... I'll let you know the outcome as soon as we've spoken to them

Peter: Thanks for the offer, but I've got several expert technicians of that ilk readily to hand here! ;)

...Oh and socks? laptops? downloading at gigs?.... :ontopic:

[Corabar Entertainment]

Just an update to say, I haven't forgotten about this and letting everyone know what the outcome is, it's just that the bloody fireworks company STILL haven't contacted us! :bang: :bang: :bang:

[rob1963]

Let's hope they're more reliable on the night itself!

[Excalibur]

Just an update to say, I haven't forgotten about this and letting everyone know what the outcome is, it's just that the bloody fireworks company STILL haven't contacted us! :bang: :bang: :bang:

Let's just hope they furnish you with a little more than a fuse, a match., and a stopwatch. ;) :D :D :D :D

[Corabar Entertainment]

Having just had casue to look up this thread to link to in another thread, I've realised I never gave the outcome.

The client decided that the fireworks company didn't know what they were talking about and got fed up with them faffing around, so he cancelled them and booked another company.... who clearly DID know what they were doing, and the whole thing went off without a hitch :)

[Corabar Steve]

Having just had casue to look up this thread to link to in another thread, I've realised I never gave the outcome.

The client decided that the fireworks company didn't know what they were talking about and got fed up with them faffing around, so he cancelled them and booked another company.... who clearly DID know what they were doing, and the whole thing went off without a hitch :)
We ran a lead from their PC to my rig, sound came out of our speakers & the fireworks were triggered by the PC.

Total pros & a fantastic show. A pleasure to deal with (& they were on site longer than me, they were there about half an hour before me & were still there when I left))

[Excalibur]

Having just had casue to look up this thread to link to in another thread, I've realised I never gave the outcome.The client decided that the fireworks company didn't know what they were talking about and got fed up with them faffing around, so he cancelled them and booked another company.... who clearly DID know what they were doing, and the whole thing went off without a hitch :)

Now this is really weird, but I thought, nay was certain, that you had done. :daft: :daft: :daft: :daft: Unless it was by PM, perhaps. :confused: Nowadays, I forget a lot of things.


We ran a lead from their PC to my rig, sound came out of our speakers & the fireworks were triggered by the PC.
Whaaaaaaaaaat? You let them plug into your rig? :confused: :eek: :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

[Tom Lovick]

Ok, back on track, if you contact Chris at Sonning Fireworks, (www.sonningfireworks.co.uk) he has designed his own firework computer system.

[Corabar Entertainment]

Ok, back on trackI beg your pardon? :eek:

Have you actually bothered to read this thread?


Now this is really weird, but I thought, nay was certain, that you had done. :daft: :daft: :daft: :daft: Strange thing is, Peter - I thought I had done as well!

[Tom Lovick]

I beg your pardon? :eek:

Have you actually bothered to read this thread?


I did skim read the thread, sorry if i grabbed the wrong end of the thread but i felt it was going a bit off.

Sorry if i'm completely wrong!!! :)

The software that Chris at Sonning Fireworks made is an altered version of this (http://www.fireone.com/software.htm)

He is a very clever intelligent man and The software allows you to programme in which beats of the song you want the fireworks on and it will even but in time for the firework to get up into the sky!!

All very clever indeed and when he came to do the fireworks for my school i did not understand a thing about the software :p (We do a lighting countdown for the fireworks

[Corabar Steve]

I did skim read the thread, sorry if i grabbed the wrong end of the thread but i felt it was going a bit off. The last time I looked your user title said Member of Sin Bin not Moderator.

You've been told before to leave the moderating to us. Final warning

Sorry if i'm completely wrong!!! :)You were.

[lonfire]

The software that Chris at Sonning Fireworks made is an altered version of this (http://www.fireone.com/software.htm)

He is a very clever intelligent man and The software allows you to programme in which beats of the song you want the fireworks on and it will even but in time for the firework to get up into the sky!!

All very clever indeed and when he came to do the fireworks for my school i did not understand a thing about the software :p (We do a lighting countdown for the fireworks

Hi all,
I know this thread has kinda been put to bed, however i thought I would comment. I'm said person Chris from Sonning Fireworks. I noticed this forum on my Google analytics stats ;-)

Just to clarify my software for our firing system is NOT an altered version of fireones software (before i get sued for hacking and copyright infringement!). In fact its not even using the fireone hardware!

The software i have written from the ground up (being that I am also a senior software developer for a UK software house) and is the third firing system i have writen. Sonning fireworks has been going 11+ years now and we have been computer/electricaly firing shows since the company was started.

I infact also own Lumatech Systems (http://www.lumatech-systems.co.uk) which sells this software and provides consultation and support to other fireworks companies that wish to get into computer/electrical firing.

I see the OP got their issue sorted which is great, but if anybody ever has any issues with fireworks, firing systems or is involved in an event where fireworks are involved i'd be happy to chat to them about it.

And before anybody does try it, as the other posters have said never use DMX to fire fireworks ;-) i'd be happy to explain why!

Mods i hope this is ok, just thought it was worth a post..

Regards
Chris

[Corabar Entertainment]

I see the OP got their issue sorted which is great, but if anybody ever has any issues with fireworks, firing systems or is involved in an event where fireworks are involved i'd be happy to chat to them about it.

And before anybody does try it, as the other posters have said never use DMX to fire fireworks ;-) i'd be happy to explain why!:thumbsup: Good to know if anything similar ever crops up again.

:thanks:

[Tom Lovick]

Hi all,
I know this thread has kinda been put to bed, however i thought I would comment. I'm said person Chris from Sonning Fireworks. I noticed this forum on my Google analytics stats ;-)

Just to clarify my software for our firing system is NOT an altered version of fireones software (before i get sued for hacking and copyright infringement!). In fact its not even using the fireone hardware!

The software i have written from the ground up (being that I am also a senior software developer for a UK software house) and is the third firing system i have writen. Sonning fireworks has been going 11+ years now and we have been computer/electricaly firing shows since the company was started.

I infact also own Lumatech Systems (http://www.lumatech-systems.co.uk) which sells this software and provides consultation and support to other fireworks companies that wish to get into computer/electrical firing.

I see the OP got their issue sorted which is great, but if anybody ever has any issues with fireworks, firing systems or is involved in an event where fireworks are involved i'd be happy to chat to them about it.

And before anybody does try it, as the other posters have said never use DMX to fire fireworks ;-) i'd be happy to explain why!

Mods i hope this is ok, just thought it was worth a post..

Regards
Chris

Good to have you here Chris!

Sorry I got it wrong, Tom Walford told me that it was a version of Ionfire. :p

Thanks,

Tom

[lonfire]

Hi,
Just as a quick bit of info. Most computer firing systems run from laptop based systems, so the feed you will get will be a line level feed from the laptop output. So with most DJ mixers you can just use a 3.5mm jack to 2xPhono lead. However if the laptop is near the fireworks and the PA is indoors you wont wanna run an unbalanced signal all that way! Hence why in the OP posts they were talking about DI boxes and such. Most DJ mixers don't have line level balanced inputs, so best bet if the laptop is more than 2m from the PA would be to use two passive DI boxes (one to balance and one to unbalance). Combine the L+R into a mono feed.

Or of course the fireworks company might be using a stand alone field controller and SOME of them have balanced outputs. You'll still need something to unbalance the signal the other end however.

As for us we carry DI boxes and a soundcraft spirit folio for this reason when we have to use somebody elses PA.. Or alternatively we rock up with either D&B Q7, or C7 stacks depending on the size of the crowd (or occasionally L'accoustics kiva or D&B Q1 line arrays for bigger events)..

I hope this is useful/interesting!

Regards
Chris

[Corabar Entertainment]

Good to have you here Chris!

Sorry I got it wrong, Tom Walford told me that it was a version of Ionfire. :p

Thanks,

Tom...and yet you appear to have got it wrong again :lol:



I hope this is useful/interesting!

Regards
ChrisYep. :thanks:

More than ever now, I really do feel that the original company that inspired this thread didn't entirely know how to handle the situation (maybe inexperienced?), and I'm so glad the client changed supplier! :D

[Tom Lovick]

...and yet you appear to have got it wrong again :lol:

ssshh... :lol: Chris went to my school you know! Don't embarrass me! :p

[lonfire]

Hi,

Tom Walford told me that it was a version of Ionfire

Tom, IonFire is my own software.


More than ever now, I really do feel that the original company that inspired this thread didn't entirely know how to handle the situation (maybe inexperienced?), and I'm so glad the client changed supplier!

Indeed, this does tend to happen. Fireworks companies feel they have to get into computer/electrical firing but they don't quite understand the technology. Luckily i've been in the entertainment industry for a long time as well as being a software developer and a director of a fireworks company. All the key skills required to make it work!

The show rob is talking was this at Reading Blue Coat School, enjoy!

Regards
Chris

[Tom Lovick]

IonFire is my own software.


Ah ok! Sorry was a tad confused. Looks amazing though, and hats off to you!




The show rob is talking was this at Reading Blue Coat School (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFOg__UAGhM)

I know the RBCS pyromusical display is always amazing! On every November, first Thursday normally. Come along this year if you want! a display not to be missed.

[lonfire]

ssshh... :lol: Chris went to my school you know! Don't embarrass me! :p

A very, very, very long time ago!

Don't worry Tom, we all have to start somewhere! As you get older you'll realise you can learn stuff off everybody you meet, sometimes it will how to do something and sometimes it will be how not to do something! Learn from the people that have a positive influence on you and when you are older pass this info/style of helping people on to other young people. Also you'll learn that sometimes the people you thought were really clever and knowledgeable weren't as clever and knowledgeable as they made out, so don't take everything you are told as gospel! (excluding me if we are talking about fireworks ;-) ahahaha).. When we are younger we make mistakes, sometimes we'll make them more than once before we realise what they are! Thats life.

Sorry for going OT, feeling a bit philosophical!

Regards
Chris

[Tom Lovick]

Hi Chris,

This is the video of the whole RBCS fireworks display: http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=10150108576030774

[lonfire]

ermm... thats your editted version of the whole night.. not the fireworks or the most important bit the fireworks sync'd to the music which was done live..