Pricing yourself out of business...

[Steve the DJ]

...and funnily enough I am not talking about being considered too expensive. :D

I was having a chat last night with another forum member about how we had both seen an increase in "good guys" (i.e. legal, insured, professional, good kit, reliable etc.), going out for less and less money.

Nothing unusual in that as there has always been a wide range of pricing amongst DJs and times are tough, but what we both agreed is that pricing in some areas was becoming so cheap that there was now very little difference in price between hiring a DIY Disco and running an iPod or booking a DJ.

The example that sparked the discussion was a 6 hour 30th Birthday Party booking in the South East that had been offered out and snapped up at £150. This is a prime Saturday in August, in Berkshire and is becoming more frequent. This isn't a North vs. South discussion, it's happening everywhere.

If we put aside the argument for one moment about why you charge what you charge (because it is your choice), I believe that some DJs are going to price themselves out of business because they are now completely removing any value they ever added by competing at levels dangerously close to the cost of a fairly decent system hire.

Again I reiterate I am talking about "good" DJs, not the "cowboys" we all bemoan.

I believe many DJs are literally going to price themselves out of existence because more and more customers are going to want to do their own thing. Why should they book a DJ who they think (rightly or wrongly) is going to be unreliable, loud, full of themselves and ignore there requests?

What can the DJ be offering that is going to make any difference to my party if they are only £20 or £30 more than the cost of a hire?

Of course things are tough at the moment and you have to be competitive if you want to work but can't people see they are eroding any extra value they have as an experienced DJ over and above someone choosing to DIY?

In my opinion (and that of several others who have been in the game a long time), over the next 5 years more and more people will take control of the music at their parties, this sector will grow.

So many DJs who are already competing at close to hire prices will be forced into real cowboy pricing territory or to hang up the headphones.

And you will only have yourselves to blame.

Discuss. :)

[rob1963]

I believe many DJs are literally going to price themselves out of existence because more and more customers are going to want to do their own thing. Why should they book a DJ who they think (rightly or wrongly) is going to be unreliable, loud, full of themselves and ignore there requests?

Why do you think this?

Sorry, but I don't agree...certainly not at my market position. The only people who want to do their own thing are the ones who want the cheapest possible solution. Those people have always been around & always will be, but I don't see how they will suddently start having a negative effect of the business of someone like you or me.

It's ALWAYS been possible to hire gear, and laptops & ipods have been around for a fair few years, so why do you think this is suddenly going to cause a problem? Sorry, but I just don't get it.

If what you say is true, and you bear in mind that we're just creeping out of the worst recession of our lifetimes, and also add in the fact that I charge a reasonable amount & increased my prices late last year, why is 2010 already my second best year for disco bookings in the six years I've been full time, and a mere three bookings short of becoming my best ever year?

:confused:

[RabbittsKaraoke]

Think the suggestion is that there is becoming a three tier market....for discos anyway

Cowboys (cheap as chips)
DIY (middle of the road option - suggested "old ground" for cheaper pro')
Professional DJs (the muts nuts)

Don't know where a dedicated karaoke jock would fit in? Somewhere between DIY and the Pro's?

[CRAZY K]

...and funnily enough I am not talking about being considered too expensive. :D

I was having a chat last night with another forum member about how we had both seen an increase in "good guys" (i.e. legal, insured, professional, good kit, reliable etc.), going out for less and less money.

Nothing unusual in that as there has always been a wide range of pricing amongst DJs and times are tough, but what we both agreed is that pricing in some areas was becoming so cheap that there was now very little difference in price between hiring a DIY Disco and running an iPod or booking a DJ.

The example that sparked the discussion was a 6 hour 30th Birthday Party booking in the South East that had been offered out and snapped up at £150. This is a prime Saturday in August, in Berkshire and is becoming more frequent. This isn't a North vs. South discussion, it's happening everywhere.

If we put aside the argument for one moment about why you charge what you charge (because it is your choice), I believe that some DJs are going to price themselves out of business because they are now completely removing any value they ever added by competing at levels dangerously close to the cost of a fairly decent system hire.

Again I reiterate I am talking about "good" DJs, not the "cowboys" we all bemoan.

I believe many DJs are literally going to price themselves out of existence because more and more customers are going to want to do their own thing. Why should they book a DJ who they think (rightly or wrongly) is going to be unreliable, loud, full of themselves and ignore there requests?

What can the DJ be offering that is going to make any difference to my party if they are only £20 or £30 more than the cost of a hire?

Of course things are tough at the moment and you have to be competitive if you want to work but can't people see they are eroding any extra value they have as an experienced DJ over and above someone choosing to DIY?

In my opinion (and that of several others who have been in the game a long time), over the next 5 years more and more people will take control of the music at their parties, this sector will grow.

So many DJs who are already competing at close to hire prices will be forced into real cowboy pricing territory or to hang up the headphones.

And you will only have yourselves to blame.

Discuss. :)

I think there are some very valid points here despite Robs stonking year---well done Rob:beer1:

Its becoming fairly obvious to me that there is a certain part of the sector who are booking people with higher charges because a lot of people think---well my family will need a bomb under them to get them going at the Reception/ Party/Celebration so lets hire someone who can really get them dancing , naturally this wont come cheap or be a standard charging Disco.

Im afrad offering to let the client choose the music is not the complete answer either---having looked at Saturdays play list I will be surprised if theres much Dancing during the Disco set on the choices given to me, until I intervene.

Where did I put the Macarena:confused:

Incidentally this assumes you are promoting yourself on the Darren basis of--dont let the music do the talking---let the DJ with some personality get people going--- even though they possibly dont want to ;)

Apologies to Darren if I got that wrong:eek:

Just my experience;)
.

[Steve the DJ]

Sorry, but I don't agree...certainly not at my market position.

Good, because I am not talking about your market position, hence the reason I quoted a recent example at £150. :p

With a minimum fee of closer to £300 this topic (in a pricing sense) doesn't apply to you.

However I know of many DJs who have gone sub £250 and are working their way lower and lower.


Think the suggestion is that there is becoming a three tier market....for discos anyway

I think there have always been pricing tiers, I just feel that the line between them all are getting more and more blurred.


Its becoming fairly obvious to me that there is a certain part of the sector who are booking people with higher charges because a lot of people think---well my family will need a bomb under them to get them going at the Reception/ Party/Celebration so lets hire someone who can really get them dancing , naturally this wont come cheap or be a standard charging Disco.

I have seen that as well.

[Pe7e]

Why do you think this?

Sorry, but I don't agree...certainly not at my market position. The only people who want to do their own thing are the ones who want the cheapest possible solution.
:confused:

You couldn't be more wrong Rob, some of the DIY'ers are certainly budget minded, but, in my experience they represent only about 20% - 30% of the DIY market. The majority of my systems go into up market venues or into the marquee in the gardens of stockbroker belt houses. On a recent DIY wedding hire, the bride and groom were both doctors, and the venue was a quality country house hotel, so no shortage of money there.

[DeckstarDeluxe]

I saw the thread you are talking about Steve and I was shocked too. In the end theres always going to be customers which fall into the upper, middle or lower price brandings. Some people rather pay the money for peace of mind, its just a question of finding enough of them :P

[rob1963]

However I know of many DJs who have gone sub £250 and are working their way lower and lower.

So why are they doing this?

Is it simply because the bookings are no longer coming in at their normal rates?

[Steve the DJ]

You couldn't be more wrong Rob, some of the DIY'ers are certainly budget minded, but, in my experience they represent only about 20% - 30% of the DIY market. The majority of my systems go into up market venues or into the marquee in the gardens of stockbroker belt houses. On a recent DIY wedding hire, the bride and groom were both doctors, and the venue was a quality country house hotel, so no shortage of money there.

I have seen this a couple of times too, including a hire that came to nearly £500 including a small PA, radio mic, uplighting but no DJ.

As I said, I believe the DIY hire market will continue to grow and whilst I really fear for the guys at the lower end first this will impact us all.

Well, to an extent I really hope it does as I have already set up a hire business... :whistle:


I saw the thread you are talking about Steve and I was shocked too. In the end theres always going to be customers which fall into the upper, middle or lower price brandings. Some people rather pay the money for peace of mind, its just a question of finding enough of them :P

Of course, but I really believe that too many good people have lowered their prices and dropped "down a band", which in turn adds to the competition and just makes them destroy that part of the market even more.

DJs should add value and be a step up the entertainment ladder from DIY in every price band, not killing each other in the bargain basement and destroying any value they had left.

[Steve the DJ]

So why are they doing this?

Is it simply because the bookings are no longer coming in at their normal rates?

I was hoping that the guys doing it would tell us.

[JTRS]

In todays climate, money is tight and people are watching what they are spending. To the average customer a disco is a disco is a disco and a dj is a dj is a dj.

If they haven't booked a DJ for a while, or perhaps never needed to in the past then to them anyone who advertises as a DJ is just that, they have no idea about the sixty quid sids, the cowboys etc, and simply percieve us as as a person who turns up with music and lights, so to them they have no idea (until it's too late) that you get what you pay for.

I can well understand why many legitimate DJ's are now dropping their prices, if it's a choice between not working and working for less money.

JTRS

[rob1963]

I was hoping that the guys doing it would tell us.

I hope they do too, as it doesn't make sense to me & I'm just wondering how true it is.

Why would people charging less than about £300 have to lower their prices to keep the work coming in when people like you & me who charge more than £300 can keep our prices the same or even increase them & still have the work coming in?

There again, maybe people who charge more are also having to reduce prices due to less bookings, and maybe I'm bucking the trend, in which case why?

:shrug:

[DeckstarDeluxe]

I hope they do too, as it doesn't make sense to me & I'm just wondering how true it is.

Why would people charging less than about £300 have to lower their prices to keep the work coming in when people like you & me who charge more than £300 can keep our prices the same or even increase them & still have the work coming in?

There again, maybe people who charge more are also having to reduce prices due to less bookings, and maybe I'm bucking the trend, in which case why?

:shrug:


I think DJ's like myself are far more of a dj than a businessman and I think there's a few on here that are the other way around.

I admit I use to think everything was about price. So if you got 10 gigs a month at 100 quid you would only get 5 for 200.

Now I know that's not true but I think its a common mistake made.

[rob1963]

I think DJ's like myself are far more of a dj than a buisness man and I think theres a few on here that are the other way around.

I think thats a very fair & interesting point, Neil.

[Vectis]

I think DJ's like myself are far more of a dj than a businessman and I think there's a few on here that are the other way around.


I think thats a very fair & interesting point, Neil.

I KNOW that's a fair point. Doing what I do, I see it all the time, day in day out. And it's not just DJs - it's most folks whose hobby becomes their career, full or part-time.

[TONYTIGER]

I hope they do too, as it doesn't make sense to me & I'm just wondering how true it is.

Why would people charging less than about £300 have to lower their prices to keep the work coming in when people like you & me who charge more than £300 can keep our prices the same or even increase them & still have the work coming in?

There again, maybe people who charge more are also having to reduce prices due to less bookings, and maybe I'm bucking the trend, in which case why?

:shrug:

Hiya Rob ,i think a lot of it is to do with the area you operate in,down here in rural Dorset a mobile can not demand the same price as say the home counties the county has the highest population of retired people than any other county in the UK also not a lot of chimney pots so prices are quite often sub £ 250 ,but they are still good pro discos,but i think i have said before i am finding more & more people are just hiring and doing it themselves.
I think i am right in saying you do a fair few pub quiz type jobs were down here no such work or very few.

[Steve the DJ]

I can well understand why many legitimate DJ's are now dropping their prices, if it's a choice between not working and working for less money.

It's a natural reaction, I think it is blinkered and short termist, but I understand it,


I hope they do too, as it doesn't make sense to me & I'm just wondering how true it is.

Very true in my experience, perhaps I spend more time talking face to face with DJs than you do. I certainly tend to get more honesty from them that way than you ever get on a forum.


Why would people charging less than about £300 have to lower their prices to keep the work coming in when people like you & me who charge more than £300 can keep our prices the same or even increase them & still have the work coming in?

Because there is less work around and they don't know how to sell themselves other than on price.

Which is compounded by the fact most of them don't need to work as a DJ at all, they choose to, the income is not the overiding factor.



There again, maybe people who charge more are also having to reduce prices due to less bookings, and maybe I'm bucking the trend, in which case why?


Yes and no.

There is still premium work out there but a lot of the multi ops that I know of that operate in that area are down considerably on the number of bookings they have which means the DJs they have been using are now looking for work elsewhere, putting further pressure on lower down.

[Steve the DJ]

...so prices are quite often sub £ 250 ,but they are still good pro discos,but i think i have said before i am finding more & more people are just hiring and doing it themselves.

Exactly what I am getting at and I can assure you it isn't just the rural areas anymore, it is spreading.

[rob1963]

i think a lot of it is to do with the area you operate in, down here in rural Dorset a mobile can not demand the same price as say the home counties

Oh no...not the old "You won't get that round here" argument!

I won't slate you for saying that, but I'm sure others will.


I think i am right in saying you do a fair few pub quiz type jobs were down here no such work or very few.

I do indeed. Loads of pubs round here have quiz nights. I do one on Tuesdays, and there are two other pubs on the same road within a couple of miles that also have a quiz on the same night! However, this thread is about mobile discos...but I just wanted to answer your point.

:)

[TONYTIGER]

Oh no...not the old "You won't get that round here" argument!

I won't slate you for saying that, but I'm sure others will.



I do indeed. Loads of pubs round here have quiz nights. I do one on Tuesdays, and there are two other pubs on the same road within a couple of miles that also have a quiz on the same night! However, this thread is about mobile discos...but I just wanted to answer your point.

:)

Why should others slate me its a fact pricing has always been a regional thing ,just like a pint of beer or a litre of fuel simple economics supply and demand.

I only mentioned the quiz thing as you do in your posts " This week end" very good sideline and i wish you well.

[DeckstarDeluxe]

Why should others slate me its a fact pricing has always been a regional thing ,just like a pint of beer or a litre of fuel simple economics supply and demand.

Dangerous mindset to be in.

[Charlie Brown]

I couldn't agree more Steve!

In Nottingham there has been a surge of new websites and companies. )I won't post any links because it may help their Google rankings. :p)

They seem to be offering a good service with all the relevant documents at around £195 a night.

I reckon they saw mine and got scared. :sj:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

its a fact pricing has always been a regional thing

Very blinkered Tony. There are always people in any area that work in higher price markets. There are people round here that say they can't get more than £250.00 too.

[Steve the DJ]

They seem to be offering a good service with all the relevant documents at around £195 a night.

And how much would someone in your area charge for a reasonable sound system hire with some basic lighting that you could plug an iPod into which was delivered, set up and removed?

[yourdj]

In my area when recession hit i put my prices up worked hard too improve marketing and service and im busier than ever. I am doing 6 gigs this week!! admittedly three of them are not brilliantly paid club gigs but the others are.

if people want too book a cheap DJ then they can be my guest. i have been too see other DJ's recently who have dated kit and just dont seem to be very good who are charging £350 plus.

Thats the problem. You have to let the client know why its worth booking you.

[Shakermaker Promotions]

I don't like to talk about pricing on here but what I will say is that maybe I am lucky?
I have had my busiest year to date and my pricing has gone up. I have no intention of dropping my prices. My standard Disco package is a 1/3 more in price than it was 2 years ago and now I have add-on's like Uplighting and Projection too.

I totally understand what you are saying but I personally think that the professionals will always be ok. It will be the ones that do it as an extra to beef up their day jobs that aren't covered with PLI and PAT etc that are already low enough to put people off. They will drop so low that it will be a joke and no'one will go near them or if they do, they won't be my customer anyway.

I hope that makes sense.

[Charlie Brown]

And how much would someone in your area charge for a reasonable sound system hire with some basic lighting that you could plug an iPod into which was delivered, set up and removed?

http://www.disconottingham.co.uk/basic.html

Around £100/110 for someone to come and setup the gear with a few lights.

[DeckstarDeluxe]

http://www.disconottingham.co.uk/basic.html

Around £100/110 for someone to come and setup the gear with a few lights.


People booking that rubbish arent really your target market though Charlie?

[Pe7e]

And how much would someone in your area charge for a reasonable sound system hire with some basic lighting that you could plug an iPod into which was delivered, set up and removed?

I can answer that one for you, I'm only 15 miles away fron Charlie. A pair of Mackie 450v2s and stands, a Numark iDJ2, a radio mic, 4 FX lights and wind up stand, extended hire to allow for a bit of a practise (availability permitting) circa £150 excluding delivery, £200+ inc delivery, but I avoid delivery and set up, if at all possible, even if it means loosing the odd booking, as it spoils the entire business concept, and reduces profitability.

[Steve the DJ]

I can answer that one for you, I'm only 15 miles away fron Charlie. A pair of Mackie 450v2s and stands, a Numark iDJ2, a radio mic, 4 FX lights and wind up stand, extended hire to allow for a bit of a practise (availability permitting) circa £150 excluding delivery, £200+ inc delivery, but I avoid delivery and set up, if at all possible, even if it means loosing the odd booking, as it spoils the entire business concept, and reduces profitability.

Thanks for that, kinda proves my point really, and that kit is superior to what many sub £200 guys would use. :shrug:

[simonp]

I think DJ's like myself are far more of a dj than a businessman

:agree: And I definitely fall into that bracket

[Creature]

Around here the average price is now about £100.00 a nite, talking to local djs this is being price driven as 99% people are accepting the lowest price they can get - they dont seem to care about PAt PI or other legal requirements. And we all know if you dont go out people soon forget about you. Luckily for me I am not reliant on lacal work but even distance work / weekend rallies prices are getting more competative. I have recently turn down 4 bookings for rallies (2 days) because they only offer £100.00 for teh weekend. They wernt amused when I said thats more than my petrol bill in some cases.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Around here the average price is now about £100.00 a nite

Is it? Or is it average in your market?

Tony Penmare gets a lot more than that and is in your area.

[Creature]

Is it? Or is it average in your market?


Nope I dont go out for that unless its a Sun to Wed. normal for me is from £150.00 - £200.00 a nite

Dunno were Tony lives as Lincolnshire is a big county

[Twinspin]

If people ring me for a disco. Ill get the details from them. So i can work out a quote. Once i give them a quote i will not be bargained with.

People have tried it before with me on the line and they just get told no chance.

I still get bookings at the price i charge. So i feel no reason why i should lower my charges and i wont.

[StarZSoundS]

I do indeed. Loads of pubs round here have quiz nights. I do one on Tuesdays, and there are two other pubs on the same road within a couple of miles that also have a quiz on the same night! However, this thread is about mobile discos...but I just wanted to answer your point.

:)[/QUOTE]


You see thats what I don't get.....

Your Website suggests I can book you for a Quiz Night for £90.....But if I wanted you for a Wedding(unlikely...for a number of reasons) you would charge me £300 + (depending on how many Pinspots I wanted....which would actually be none).:eek: :eek:

You are giving up your evening equally for both.....and there doesn't seem to be any synergy between the prices???:confused: :confused:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

If people ring me for a disco. Ill get the details from them. So i can work out a quote. Once i give them a quote i will not be bargained with.

People have tried it before with me on the line and they just get told no chance.

I still get bookings at the price i charge. So i feel no reason why i should lower my charges and i wont.

Then I don't really think you are a business man John. Everyone has to at some point and for some reason.

You still live at home and don't have as many responsibilities as people with dependants and mortgages etc.

[Shakermaker Promotions]

Exactly! Which goes back to the usual argument of....would you rather stay in and earn nothing or go out and work for the night for a few quid less than you would normally charge because you have your limits.

Of course, everyone has their limit. If you are used to getting £500.00 per night and someone wants you to do their function for £150.00...I'd say a definite NO whether I am living at home with the parents or mortgaged up to my eyeballs...You have to have some limits. Sometimes it's just not worth your while as a business to do it. Other times when the margins are different, well...you can be flexible.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Exactly! Which goes back to the usual argument of....would you rather stay in and earn nothing or go out and work for the night for a few quid less than you would normally charge because you have your limits.


I wasn't really talking about that situation.

[TONYTIGER]

It would seem by the pm,s i have received and the posts on this subject my comments re regional pricing seems to ring true with a lot of mobiles out there.
Every Dj has there own criteria on what they want to earn ,some have to make a living from it some do it for a extra bit of money at the week end and some do it for fun and free.
I myself now do it because i enjoy it and money is not a concern re mobiles as i have other interests in the entertainment sector.
I have probably been in the mobile sector of the industry longer than most on this forum and have worked all over the world and my djs still do so.
For anybody to think there are no regional differences for any service or goods is talking out there :Censored:

I have looked at a lot of djs sites and take my hat off to the ones that give some price indication to the enquiring client who is browsing and guess what there is a huge difference so when certain djs start willy waving re the amount we should all be earning it makes me laugh.

Some have indicated there are always better priced jobs in a area and yes i agree but how plentiful and how often and thats were the regions differ.

Here are a few thoughts .London is the most costly city in the world to eat.

I can get double the price for one of my djs in Tokyo than i can in Sao Paulo (that,s Brazil) Fuel is under 10p a litre in Libya.

So when it comes to the paltry subject re mobile pricing were you are based and the infurstructure will determine your price to get regular work.

Thanks to everyone for the support with your mails .:)

[DeckstarDeluxe]

So your argument is that fuel is 10p in Libya and you can get more more in Tokyo than Sao Paulo to why you claim you cant earn more than you currently are?

I think people just think they cant get more money because they actually cant be bothered to get off their back sides and do something about it.

For example I know a chap up the in north east in an "poor area". Yet hes only djed I believe for 5 years or so and is in the right area of the market and doing a pretty decent job. Fair enough he has to travel but then again we are mobile discos.

[simon1969]

Agree with lots of points on here, do people think under pricing is down to inexperience?
And not knowing what prices to charge I can hear people saying they should research prices (which I did when I started doing mobile discos).
Before I went mobile I was getting £40.00 a night for djing.
That was with High Spririts in Sunderland worst £80 quid sid I have ever met
and had the displeasure of working for.
Not saying underpricing is all down to this but part of the problem maybe?

[StarZSoundS]

so when certain djs start willy waving re the amount we should all be earning it makes me laugh.

Some have indicated there are always better priced jobs in a area and yes i agree but how plentiful and how often and thats were the regions differ.



He's 64 years old......And been round the block.His second sentence I totally agree with.Good on yer Tony!!!:beer1: :beer1: :beer1: :beer1: :beer1: :beer1:

[Twinspin]

Then I don't really think you are a business man John

Im not I'm a DJ. My business sense is rubbish. I still havent lowered my fees. I might not get as many bookings as what a cheaper dj would.

But im happy with what i get for gigs. I have got bills to pay myself about £250.00 per month in overheads and expensive advertising bills in telephone directories.

If you come to Hull you will see that lots of people here want a disco for their wedding for £80.00 / £120.00 £150.00 etc etc. Ive been there and done that at £150.00 and im not going there again For any wedding i want £250.00 at least.

and over this summer ive got that at least.

[DeckstarDeluxe]

Im not I'm a DJ. My business sense is rubbish. I still havent lowered my fees. I might not get as many bookings as what a cheaper dj would.

But im happy with what i get for gigs. I have got bills to pay myself about £250.00 per month in overheads and expensive advertising bills in telephone directories.

If you come to Hull you will see that lots of people here want a disco for their wedding for £80.00 / £120.00 £150.00 etc etc. Ive been there and done that at £150.00 and im not going there again For any wedding i want £250.00 at least.

and over this summer ive got that at least.

I bet theres loads of DJ's in Hull that say you cant get more than £150 too right John?

[StarZSoundS]

I bet theres loads of DJ's in Hull that say you cant get more than £150 too right John?


Nuclear fall out just round the corner ....close the thread now.We've been here fifty times before!!:bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang:

[TONYTIGER]

So your argument is that fuel is 10p in Libya and you can get more more in Tokyo than Sao Paulo to why you claim you cant earn more than you currently are?

I think people just think they cant get more money because they actually cant be bothered to get off their back sides and do something about it.

For example I know a chap up the in north east in an "poor area". Yet hes only djed I believe for 5 years or so and is in the right area of the market and doing a pretty decent job. Fair enough he has to travel but then again we are mobile discos.

Read the post,i never said cant earn more i don,t need to,its called taking it easy when you get old.
And you need to take my quote as examples re pricing for everything any were in the world ,in my opinion all the great djs do it because its a passion nothing to do with money that,s just a bonus for doing something you love if your still a dj in another 40 years you will understand.

[Twinspin]

I bet theres loads of DJ's in Hull that say you cant get more than £150 too right John?

Yeah there is and its a load of rubbish. You can get a lot more than that. If i can do it anyone can.

[CRAZY K]

called taking it easy when you get old.


Youll have to explain that to Excalibur and me---m sure we dont have a clue what your talking about.

:Laugh: :Laugh: :Laugh: :Laugh: :Laugh:

[Excalibur]

Youll have to explain that to Excalibur and me---m sure we dont have a clue what your talking about.

:Laugh: :Laugh: :Laugh: :Laugh: :Laugh:

Seems to me I was able to take it easy when I was young. :confused: :confused: Am I going backwards? :confused: :confused: :D :D :D :D

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

if your still a dj in another 40 years you will understand.

Slightly patronising Tony.

I am not talking out of my backside as you so nicely put it. I know there are different markets in each area and that within those markets there are big price differences.

Colin Cook, who doesn't come on here much lives in the NE where people can't get more than £150 a night and yet regularly goes out for £1000+ weddings.

The NE is poor according to some on here, so who is paying that sort of money?

I think it's a shame when people have been in the business for a really long time and are still saying "You can't get that round here".

[Vectis]

It's true that you CAN price yourself out of business.

Late last year I knew I wanted to wind back the number of gigs in 2010 from my average of around 100 to around 50.

So I put up my prices by £100 and trimmed back on some of the included extras. My starting rate for an evening only wedding was therefore £395 for 4 hours. No extras.

That didn't work too well. As in it didn't stop the enquiries or the bookings. I had a few "how much?!!!" discussions - something I was not used to - but to stem the tide I put them up another £100. That worked :)

[Twinspin]

Slightly patronising Tony.

I am not talking out of my backside as you so nicely put it. I know there are different markets in each area and that within those markets there are big price differences.

Colin Cook, who doesn't come on here much lives in the NE where people can't get more than £150 a night and yet regularly goes out for £1000+ weddings.

The NE is poor according to some on here, so who is paying that sort of money?

I think it's a shame when people have been in the business for a really long time and are still saying "You can't get that round here".

Its the same with Hull where i live. A lot of people seem to think you cant get more than £150.00.

But ill tell you a little story. about a booking it was over 2 years ago now i had a call from a groom enquiring about a wedding. He said i do you accept playlists i said i can accept playlists. so he asked me how much.... Im not a big fan of playlists. So i thought ill outprice myself for this.

So i did exactly that at the time and said it will be £350.00. Was not expecting him to call back but how wrong was i. He called back within 2 hours and booked. A deprived Northern city supposedly. Now ive priced by bottom end of the pricing scale at £250.00 thats minimum i wont work for less and im still getting a fair few weddings in my diary still.

[Steve the DJ]

To be honest, I knew before I started this thread where we would end up, going round in the usual circles... :bang:

The facts (as I see it), are a number of DJs/mobile discos are going out to work for almost the same or even less than you can hire a DIY rig for.

In my opinion they are signing their own business death warrant, regardless of where they are in the country, the market they service, their experience, kit, weight, height or shoe colour.

If you don't have enough pride in your ability to at least charge a little more than the cost of hiring some kit then no one will ever have any faith in your ability either.

Sad really. :cry:

[Vectis]

To be honest, I knew before I started this thread where we would end up, going round in the usual circles... :bang:

The facts (as I see it), are a number of DJs/mobile discos are going out to work for almost the same or even less than you can hire a DIY rig for.

In my opinion they are signing their own business death warrant, regardless of where they are in the country, the market they service, their experience, kit, weight, height or shoe colour.

If you don't have enough pride in your ability to at least charge a little more than the cost of hiring some kit then no one will ever have any faith in your ability either.

Sad really. :cry:

Steve - in all honesty do you think that the average DJ even KNOWS how much a hire rig costs?

And therein, I suspect, lies a big part of the problem. If they DID know, then they probably wouldn't knowingly undercut. Unless they were right :muppet: s of course :D

Sounds like some educating might be in order. I feel a spoofy website coming on ... :D :D :D (not really... too much flak)

[simon1969]

To be honest, I knew before I started this thread where we would end up, going round in the usual circles... :bang:

The facts (as I see it), are a number of DJs/mobile discos are going out to work for almost the same or even less than you can hire a DIY rig for.

In my opinion they are signing their own business death warrant, regardless of where they are in the country, the market they service, their experience, kit, weight, height or shoe colour.

If you don't have enough pride in your ability to at least charge a little more than the cost of hiring some kit then no one will ever have any faith in your ability either.

Sad really. :cry:
Yeah but not every DJ uses this forum !!!
Most people on here charge reasonable prices there is always gonna be £60 quid sids too not sure what can be done unless goverment step in with legislation on minium requirements.

[TONYTIGER]

Slightly patronising Tony.

I am not talking out of my backside as you so nicely put it. I know there are different markets in each area and that within those markets there are big price differences.

Colin Cook, who doesn't come on here much lives in the NE where people can't get more than £150 a night and yet regularly goes out for £1000+ weddings.

The NE is poor according to some on here, so who is paying that sort of money?

I think it's a shame when people have been in the business for a really long time and are still saying "You can't get that round here".

Your last statement was not quoted my me " you cant get that round here" as i said not on a regular basis and not very often for the regular guys.
And the mails i have received most people agree.
My last comment on this subject.

[Danno13]

Just because lots of other DJs think you can't get good money, doesn't make it any more true. Nor does the fact you've been in the ents industry for however many years.

If regional price differences were so vast then why do you have supermarkets/gyms etc. all catering to different markets in every area of the country. Surely they're all not trying to compete with the likes of Lidl & Aldi?

I can relate to what Steve is saying, it does get to the point when you think why bother DJing for £2-250 when you can earn the same for sticking a dance floor down, or providing PA equipment etc.

Personally speaking, I'm damned if I'm going to devalue the job that DJs do by bringing my prices down - I'm just slowly making sure I have enough other interests to not have to bother about the people who aren't interested in spending a decent amount for a DJ.

[ppentertainments]

Slightly patronising Tony.

I am not talking out of my backside as you so nicely put it. I know there are different markets in each area and that within those markets there are big price differences.

Colin Cook, who doesn't come on here much lives in the NE where people can't get more than £150 a night and yet regularly goes out for £1000+ weddings.

The NE is poor according to some on here, so who is paying that sort of money?

I think it's a shame when people have been in the business for a really long time and are still saying "You can't get that round here".
In fairness though darren, colin does not normally do 'just a disco'. Bowing out now before getting into the regional difference argument.

Ps can anyone get me a 4 bedroom house in london for £150,000

[soundtracker]

Funnily enough I had a conversation with a young lady tonight looking for a DJ for a Young Farmers Ball on Saturday, sadly the DJ she had booked for £150.00 had let them down. I explained that I would be able to put her in touch with a good professional DJ who I knew was free, but that the fee would be a minimum of £300.00, her retort was the ubiquitous "You'll never get that around here!" the first time I had ever heard this quoted by a punter! I explained to her that not only do I manage to sell my services at a higher level than this, but I do so on a regular basis, now I won't go into the vagaries of local pricing but this is a regular comment that I get from DJs in this area, the problem of course being that they are completely right, because they don't believe that they are worth any more than their bog standard £200 they find it impossible to convince anyone else that they are. As Dan said above "I have enough other interests to not have to bother about the people who aren't interested in spending a decent amount for a DJ." I don't have other interests, but also don't bother about the people who aren't interested in spending a decent amount on a DJ, and target my business at those that are!

[Vectis]

In fairness though darren, colin does not normally do 'just a disco'. Bowing out now before getting into the regional difference argument.

Ps can anyone get me a 4 bedroom house in london for £150,000

Take your pick :cool:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/find.html?searchType=SALE&locationIdentifier=REGION%5E87490&insId=1&radius=0.0&displayPropertyType=houses&minBedrooms=4&maxBedrooms=&minPrice=&maxPrice=150000&retirement=&partBuyPartRent=&maxDaysSinceAdded=&_includeSSTC=on&x=37&y=13&sortByPriceDescending=&primaryDisplayPropertyType=&secondaryDisplayPropertyType=&oldDisplayPropertyType=&oldPrimaryDisplayPropertyType=&newHome=&auction=false

[rob1963]

Your Website suggests I can book you for a Quiz Night for £90.....But if I wanted you for a Wedding (unlikely...for a number of reasons) you would charge me £300 + (depending on how many Pinspots I wanted....which would actually be none).:eek: :eek:

You are giving up your evening equally for both.....and there doesn't seem to be any synergy between the prices???:confused: :confused:

No I'm not...and that's why there's a big difference in the price of a quiz night and the price of a mobile disco.

A wedding disco involves about an hour of preparation (more when they want a meeting), but a quiz night involves no preparation.

It takes about 15 minutes to load the van for a disco, but only 2-3 minutes for a quiz night.

A disco takes about an hour to set up, but a quiz night takes less than 10 minutes.

The running time of a disco is usually 5 hours or more, whereas a quiz night only runs for a couple of hours.

Finally, weddings are very formal occasions, but pub quiz nights are very INFORMAL.

These are the main reasons why a quiz night is less than £100 but a wedding disco is around £400.

:)

[StarZSoundS]

No I'm not...and that's why there's a big difference in the price of a quiz night and the price of a mobile disco.

A wedding disco involves about an hour of preparation (more when they want a meeting), but a quiz night involves no preparation.

It takes about 15 minutes to load the van for a disco, but only 2-3 minutes for a quiz night.

A disco takes about an hour to set up, but a quiz night takes less than 10 minutes.

The running time of a disco is usually 5 hours or more, whereas a quiz night only runs for a couple of hours.

Finally, weddings are very formal occasions, but pub quiz nights are very INFORMAL.

These are the main reasons why a quiz night is less than £100 but a wedding disco is around £400.

:)

Got it now......someone else writes the quiz for you.You just throw a Mic and a Kiddies Karaoke Machine in your van as Equipment.You only work from 8-10.00 pm....and you charge £300 less cos you don't have to don your best bib and tucker...it all makes sense now.....:) :) :)

[NKR]

I like reading these discussions.

Apparantly I am a muppet with no faith in my ability and no business sense!

Thanks chaps

[robbiedj]

Got it now......someone else writes the quiz for you.You just throw a Mic and a Kiddies Karaoke Machine in your van as Equipment.You only work from 8-10.00 pm....and you charge £300 less cos you don't have to don your best bib and tucker...it all makes sense now.....:) :) :)

Yes, mic, amp (don't like the pubs one), cables and questions.

Scoreboard already there, speakers available (not good enough for a show, but OK for quiz) and 5min pack-up time, 15min from home (one is 5min if I walked). Prizes from pub (cash 1st prize + silly prizes for some others eg toilet rolls for coming last).

No need to charge £300+. Why be greedy?

[pwes]

I've always thought that pricing was down to confidence in your own ability and worth.

I've never considered myself to be a good DJ, or that it's a high end skill getting bodies on a dancefloor. There is a knack to it that you pick up, a reasonable music knowledge is needed, as well as investment in decent kit and knowing how it works.

Having got those things sorted, you then look at the market, price yourself in the middle and wait for the phone to ring. I am (I think) nearer the top end of the charging scale for my area (I do think area has a relevance, but not by THAT much), at 445, with optional extras available.

But I am confident that my customer service will be spot on, I will be smart (dinner suit mainly), my vehicle and gear will be smart clean and tidy, and I will play their choice of music balanced with my experience. For that I charge an appropriate fee, and any negotiation will be down to how much kit I install, my personal service has a price and that doesn't change

Have confidence in what you offer the client, they will pay a quality fee for a quality service

[robbiedj]

Have confidence in what you offer the client, they will pay a quality fee for a quality service

Yes, I had a birthday party about 18 months ago, when my prices were £200 start. I gave all the details on phone, not the price and asked about venue, number of guests etc.

It was a small sports club but the location was an awkward on to get to with a pig of a drive through London. I didn't particularly want to do it but had already said I was available so I quoted £450. She accepted it straight away.

I don't worry about quotes now. If they want a £60 disco, they are welcome to it. It won't be me. :D

[rob1963]

Got it now......someone else writes the quiz for you.You just throw a Mic and a Kiddies Karaoke Machine in your van as Equipment.You only work from 8-10.00 pm....and you charge £300 less cos you don't have to don your best bib and tucker...it all makes sense now.....:) :) :)

By jove you've got it!

:D

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

And the mails i have received most people agree.


Why try and justify a point of view by saying that?

It must be right 'cos a few people have agreed with me privately doesn't really cut it....

[weekender45]

I've always thought that pricing was down to confidence in your own ability and worth.
Have confidence in what you offer the client, they will pay a quality fee for a quality service

its all down to a state of mind.......if you "think" the market will only withstand X and you think your only worth X , then that is all youll get.
There are double glazing companies that will willingly charge me £25k to do my house, there are others that will do what I want for less than 5K. The guy doing the 5K installs will do more in a month, but I know who will make more profit.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

The guy doing the 5K installs will do more in a month, but I know who will make more profit.

How do you know?

The guy doing 5K installs may be using cheaper products and have less expenses, whereas Mr 25K may be using the very best money can buy, take longer to do it so maybe he makes less profit?

[Excalibur]

How do you know?

The guy doing 5K installs may be using cheaper products and have less expenses, whereas Mr 25K may be using the very best money can buy, take longer to do it so maybe he makes less profit?

And he might be one of the ones I've come across, in which case I wouldn't allow him within a hundred miles of my house! ;) ;) ;) I could tell some stories about window lads. Make your hair curl.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

And he might be one of the ones I've come across, in which case I wouldn't allow him within a hundred miles of my house! ;) ;) ;) I could tell some stories about window lads. Make your hair curl.

I might be interested if you'd have said "Made your hair grow" :D

[Excalibur]

I might be interested if you'd have said "Made your hair grow" :D

Why do you think I'm still bald? :(

[weekender45]

How do you know?

The guy doing 5K installs may be using cheaper products and have less expenses, whereas Mr 25K may be using the very best money can buy, take longer to do it so maybe he makes less profit?


I used this to illustrate the point of the thread,
Assuming the quality of both was comparable to satisfy me the customer in this case,

there are people that will pay 25k for this job.
I do know something about this business and anyone else who has had the usual "special offer , I will ring the manager, let me see what I can do" etc will know that these companies will get down to a price that they are happy to proceed with sometimes 30% of the original price!

The point being some people would have paid the original asking price of 25k for the same job.

As in this thread - there are potential customers willing to pay top whack - its up to us to find them through the various marketing avenues we choose.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

As in this thread - there are potential customers willing to pay top whack - its up to us to find them through the various marketing avenues we choose.

I understand that, and pick and choose where I market to very carefully, but I thought your analogy was crap and didn't really bear close scrutiny. ;)

[Excalibur]

I understand that, and pick and choose where I market to very carefully, but I thought your analogy was crap and didn't really bear close scrutiny. ;)

So did I. Which now makes for an unnerving number of times I've agreed with Darren this aft. I'm worried. Probably nearly as worried as Darren. :eek:

[djtrev]

It's true that you CAN price yourself out of business.

Late last year I knew I wanted to wind back the number of gigs in 2010 from my average of around 100 to around 50.

So I put up my prices by £100 and trimmed back on some of the included extras. My starting rate for an evening only wedding was therefore £395 for 4 hours. No extras.

That didn't work too well. As in it didn't stop the enquiries or the bookings. I had a few "how much?!!!" discussions - something I was not used to - but to stem the tide I put them up another £100. That worked :)

So your pricing for 2010 was not really about the service you provided (you actually cut back back on some of them) it increased by £100/200 to achieve roughly the same annual income for less work.At least its a different slant on pricing policies.
No offence meant or intended.

[Vectis]

So your pricing for 2010 was not really about the service you provided (you actually cut back back on some of them) it increased by £100/200 to achieve roughly the same annual income for less work.At least its a different slant on pricing policies.
No offence meant or intended.


Hmmm... not really. I reduced the gig count because I was deliberately winding down the disco business to invest time in a new project.

The intent was not to maintain the income for less work; it was to do less work but at the same time milk it for all I could, in safe knowledge it would be my last year. At no point was the service level reduced.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

So did I. Which now makes for an unnerving number of times I've agreed with Darren this aft. I'm worried. Probably nearly as worried as Darren. :eek:

No. It simply means you are beginning to understand and become Darren-ised. :eek: :D

[Shakermaker Promotions]

:eek: :eek: :eek:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

:eek: :eek: :eek:

It will come to all eventually.

You will all be assimilated. :cool:


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v600/ShaunF/dazborg-1.gif

[djtrev]

Hmmm... not really. I reduced the gig count because I was deliberately winding down the disco business to invest time in a new project.

The intent was not to maintain the income for less work; it was to do less work but at the same time milk it for all I could, in safe knowledge it would be my last year. At no point was the service level reduced.

Oh no I'm not falling for that.lol

[Excalibur]

No. It simply means you are beginning to understand and become Darren-ised. :eek: :D

Oh dear. :(

[yourdj]

IIn the end theres always going to be customers which fall into the upper, middle or lower price brandings. Some people rather pay the money for peace of mind, its just a question of finding enough of them :P

Some people think a cake is important, others the honeymoon. My clients - the entertainment :)
Budget discos, DIY discos, no disco or a band has its place and matches to the occasion or the clients requirements.

If someone wants to save £200 to spend on the bar tab in the Bahamas on their honeymoon then thats fine,
but I wont be playing at the wedding. Same goes for private and corporate functions.

I am interested in people who are getting married in good venues who want their guests
to have a great party by booking an experienced reliable entertainer (Thats me by the way :D)

The price should dictate the level of service they receive, but so many DJ's undervalue themselves of do not have the correct marketing skills/infrastructure to command those fees.


I think DJ's like myself are far more of a dj than a businessman and I think there's a few on here that are the other way around.

Good to be in the middle in my opinion. There are allot of DJ's trying to be businessmen but it is a different industry (especially wedding) most and it needs a personal touch IMO.


Very blinkered Tony. There are always people in any area that work in higher price markets.


I believe for 5 years or so and is in the right area of the market and doing a pretty decent job. Fair enough he has to travel but then again we are mobile discos.

I live down the road from tony and am charging £400-500 and got 89 weddings last year.
I have also only been Djing for four years (properly). But have put allot of work, passion and self belief into it which helps.

I can understand if someone is financially secure, does it as a passion and just wants some money to pay the gas bill.
Then they may be happy charging less. i have a morgage and outgoings that need to be paid.


I've always thought that pricing was down to confidence in your own ability and worth.Have confidence in what you offer the client, they will pay a quality fee for a quality service

One of my Dj's goes out with 12 lights, top notch rig, uplighting and early set ups and still charge £250 :eek: He came round for a BBQ yesterday and honestly thinks he is worth that. I then said how much would it cost to hire your equipment (set up by an expirienced technician) from another company without you DJing ;)

Answer - £300-500 (then you add skilled labour at £30-70 and hour)

I would not mind but it makes me look like a muppet promoting a DJ at my prices who goes out for half. He is evaluating his approach :muppet:

[Shakermaker Promotions]

At the end of the day there will always be people looking at the lower end because of their budget and there will always be someone out there that will be able to cater for them. There will also be occasions where even those at the lower end will more than likely go even lower on their price after a bit of bartering because they will want to work and maybe increase their earnings from their day jobs.

I class myself as being in the middle ground. My prices are around the same as Toby's and I personally did 49 weddings last year. I am not the cheapest in my area and no way the most expensive and I will be upping my prices soon.

[yourdj]

At the end of the day there will always be people looking at the lower end because of their budget and there will always be someone out there that will be able to cater for them. There will also be occasions where even those at the lower end will more than likely go even lower on their price after a bit of bartering because they will want to work and maybe increase their earnings from their day jobs.

I class myself as being in the middle ground. My prices are around the same as Toby's and I personally did 49 weddings last year. I am not the cheapest in my area and no way the most expensive and I will be upping my prices soon.

Pretty cut throat in BS from what I gathered too as all the hotels are taken up with residencies from what I understand :) That does not help although the average price should be higher as they are adding commission and VAT which makes organized small operators look better in the eyes of a business.

[weekender45]

I understand that, and pick and choose where I market to very carefully, but I thought your analogy was crap and didn't really bear close scrutiny. ;)

The analagy was chosen specifically to demonstrate the mindset of the customer , who is making a considered irregular purchase.
I thought it would demonstrate the point.
Clearly not;)

[marting]

as a new comer to the industry i would like to add my tuppence worth forget experience and lack of experience for the moment there is no way i can charge £250 plus from the outset, my business plan is to offer the £250-450+ plus service at the price im charging and then over the next couple of years have a structured price increase, im fortunate i have a full time job that is pretty much guaranteed, (unfortunate that it gets in the way of djing).

however getting back on thread even im being under cut by the £60 quiders and tonless

[Shakermaker Promotions]

A lot of the hotels round here are on the "We're happy and we're not going to change" stance and they DO make their commission as you say. My hotel residency at the moment add on £100.00 to my standard 7.30 - Midnight. I don't see any of that despite going to see the customers on behalf of the hotel but it's regular bookings and at the end of the day, they all add up in the end. The only time the price changes is if the duration changes and then the hotel will contact me and negotiate or let the customer deal with me directly or if they want extra services such as Uplighting, Photo Projection, Karaoke etc...

My former residency (where we first met a few years back), are blatant pee-takers! They want the cheapest DJ out there, take their cut and still pay peanuts although when I was there, they didn't pay peanuts. There must have been a big shake up.

This probably has nothing to do with this topic but the other week I was at a venue near Reading. I called Darren as I thought he'd been there and he told me a few things about the venue. This was a private booking and it was a decent payer. The venue has a resident DJ but all of the kit (overkill by the way), is owned by the venue. The DJ just walks in, does the job and that's it. Luckily for him, he's on a good deal. I was speaking to one of the people in charge about the whole deal there and I found it very interesting that this DJ works full time during the week and just turns up with his tunes and gets more or less what some of us get.

Would I do the same thing? Probably not, I like the variety and change of scenery.

[yourdj]

as a new comer to the industry i would like to add my tuppence worth forget experience and lack of experience for the moment there is no way i can charge £250 plus from the outset, my business plan is to offer the £250-450+ plus service at the price im charging and then over the next couple of years have a structured price increase, im fortunate i have a full time job that is pretty much guaranteed, (unfortunate that it gets in the way of djing).

however getting back on thread even im being under cut by the £60 quiders and tonless

£250 is the average especially in Bournemouth as there is allot of competition as its a holiday destination, but also very seasonal.
Having said I am at Langtree manor (central Bournemouth) this Sat for £450.

Even so for a good DJ they should be charging more than £200 or clients (especially venues) will get used to this price. Most private clients have often never booked a DJ and go on their perception of what they want, right or wrong.

Most go on price as they do not know what else to look for or ask on the phone. Allot of people book me as they have been to friends wedding and seen rubbish DJ's charging not allot less than me.

[mikeee]

£250 is the average especially in Bournemouth as there is allot of competition as its a holiday destination, but also very seasonal.
Having said I am at Langtree manor (central Bournemouth) this Sat for £450


I did a wedding at the Durly Chine and got £325 + accommodation, that was in 1989 :D

Last week I did the ball at my daughters school, some uplighting and 15 mins of disco, and a radio mic for Ali G, and I spent a lot of the evening I spent chatting (sorry Networking :D), and one asked if things had stated picking up, and I said not really, so Liz said put your prices up, your too cheap....£650 for a straight disco and around £400 for the uplighting, so go figure. Pictures of the ball https://picasaweb.google.com/MikeMooreDJ/FOFBall30042011?authkey=Gv1sRgCL-doKKg3cyHeQ#