Downsizing

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I did 4 nights on my own last week and really felt it on Sunday, so am really thinking about downsizing the rig.

My mixer case holds the following:

Pioneer DJM3000
Denon HD2500
Denon HC4500
Keyboard
Radio mic receiver
19" rack draw
cables
Mains etc

I reckon it weighs about 35Kg.

Speakers - RCF 325A - weigh about 23Kg each, so not too bad

RCF 705AS - 37Kg each - heavy

Martin EFX500s, both flightcased, and weigh between 25-30Kg each

Cable case - about 15 Kg

When I'm not working on a venue with stairs, then the EFX, cable case and tripods etc all go in the large flightcase on wheels.

I have a 2m piece of truss which is prewired with 2 ADJ RGB panels and which goes into a truss bag, but this is taking time to put away and is unwieldy too, so am thinking about using small bars on winch stands.

The mixer at the moment goes on an Ultimax winch and wheels, which in turn goes behind the S&H booth.

Any ideas to make anything smaller, lighter or easier?

It could be any part of the rig.

[simonp]

Oooo - You don't wanna be asking me about smaller, lighter, easier :lol:

[DynamoTom]

You could mount a EFX 500 on a winch tripod and place them behind the speaker system, you could use your two wash panels for uplighting behind you.

You could always sell your RCF sound system and get a Bose L1 system :P :P

[ppentertainments]

Only thing I can think about would be a 'dolly trolley' for speakers and any larger boxes. I managed to get a couple of heavy duty plastic supermarket flat trolleys which I find great - with the exception of the stand I can get everything into a venue without stairs in 2 trips.

Not much help I know, but when you find the secret please do share.

ps I did resist mentioning age and 'getting on a bit'

[Charlie Brown]

The Bose L1 system might be handy for you Darren.

[ppentertainments]

The Bose L1 system might be handy for you Darren.
Personally, I don't think it is any easier to setup - in fact probably requires more trips.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

The Bose L1 system might be handy for you Darren.

I can't see how that will make things any faster though, when it comes in several sections.

I like the look and am not as yet convinced by the sound though.

[Charlie Brown]

Personally, I don't think it is any easier to setup - in fact probably requires more trips.

True.

It would make the rig smaller but actually help Darren setup.

[Sapphire Disco]

Nexo 12" subs + 10" Nexo tops.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

You could mount a EFX 500 on a winch tripod and place them behind the speaker system, you could use your two wash panels for uplighting behind you.

I have plenty of pars for that and already do what you are suggesting with the EFX. :)

[DynamoTom]

Personally, I don't think it is any easier to setup - in fact probably requires more trips.

If I had a pair of the Bose L1 systems, I would put a full complete system into it's own touring trunk case so I could wheel it into venues without stairs and carry the seperate cases in bulk with venues with stairs. By doing it this way, I would save on less trips to the car/trailer or van and I would keep it all together. I wouldn't need to take in a huge case to just use one system out of it.

This may not be the case for everyone's taste but that is what I would do personally.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Nexo 12" subs + 10" Nexo tops.

Out of my (unmentioned) budget. ;)

[ppentertainments]

If I had a pair of the Bose L1 systems, I would put a full complete system into it's own touring trunk case so I could wheel it into venues without stairs and carry the seperate cases in bulk with venues with stairs. By doing it this way, I would save on less trips to the car/trailer or van and I would keep it all together. I wouldn't need to take in a huge case to just use one system out of it.

This may not be the case for everyone's taste but that is what I would do personally.
Have you seen the system ??

[DynamoTom]

Have you seen the system ??

Yes, I have personally seen the system and I have heard the model 1 system at CRS1 (Clive's).

[Sapphire Disco]

Out of my (unmentioned) budget. ;)

But if you got the Nexo's there's probably a lot of gear you've got now you wouldn't need anymore, so you could sell it to go towards them, you may be lucky and find a secondhand bargain.

[Excalibur]

Oooo - You don't wanna be asking me about smaller, lighter, easier :lol:
Nor me. For a start I have two cases on the stand, not just one!:eek:


ps I did resist mentioning age and 'getting on a bit'
Good, cos some of us get a bit touchy about that sort of thing. :p :D :D



Funnily enough Darren, my train of thought was running along similar lines the other night. I can't see where you can reasonably cut yours down, sorry. :(

As a compare and contrast exercise, let's list what can be taken as my "standard" rig.
Two mixer cases.
1) Numark D2
Denon DN X-500
Active crossover
Keyboard/hard drive.
2) Cortex
Keyboard/hard drive.
Two power amps.
Two speaker cabs.
Radio mic receiver case
Four ADJ Revo Rolls
Three KAM LED panels prewired onto a bar. ( The numbest part of the rig. Very hard to carry and even harder to lift onto the overhead )
Cable box or two. ( I don't like to chance leaving an important cable behind )
Ultimax stand, no wheels, no winch, custom overhead.


Now you understand why I can't see where to trim yours! :o :o :o :o

[DJ James Lake]

iPod :devil:


Seriously though I would lose the overhead truss and just mount the EFX'x on the uprights, everything else not really much worth doing as its already a fairly compact rig.

[Charlie Brown]

DSBP?

So you don't have to use the Ultimax?

I'm guessing you like the wheels though?

No over head...just T Bars?

Do you really need a sub? Can't you make the RCFs kick a bit more out?

[Corabar Entertainment]

Wheels on the subs?

[WWDJ]

Wheels on the subs?

I read somewhere that it adds between 5-10kg when you add the wheel to the 705s ;-(

What about scaling down the setup to suit the number of guests so perhaps a single sub would suffice in some cases or as mentioned no sub. Is this a compromise you would be prepared to make.

The other thing i can think of is slimming down your playout to just core components and siting your backup in another case that is kept locked in the van. I had a backup HD2500 with a 1u mixer just a short run away if the worst happened. I guess it depends how much you trust your laptop playout and how reliable it is.

[Andy Goodtimes]

The Bose that you would need for the average DJ job would be at least 10 seperate parts and the stands are fairly heavy and as for footprint they take up as much room as your present subs...then you would have the B1s to hide under the ultimax or where ever. I never use my Bose without using tripods rather than pods on the Ultimax because by placing the tripod legs round the power stands you make it impossible for drunken girls to pole dance round them. I also think you are right not to be convinced about the Bose system, I use mine less and less for disco but they are good for other things.

RCF902 12 inch bins and 710 tops gives you a 3.5k RMS system that really packs a punch. IMO for weight and size it doesn't get any better.

Dunno what kind of console case you use but some of the plastic ones aren't bad, they look fairly smart and of course a bit lighter than the conventional type.

Lighting might be an area for reduction, the current lasers aren't bad, I just bought a KAM RV250 which is fairly impressive, I understand there is a new LED called a Dominator coming out soon which is meant to be exceptional too.

I also got that picture I have been promising you for ages over the week-end so give me a min to work out how to do it and I'll post it on here for you then you can see how I fix my booth/stand to make it more stable.

[Andy Goodtimes]

http://i56.tinypic.com/21md8p4.jpg
Darren...
I'm using the old style L brackets that come as part of the front curtain kit, the new style aren't the same but I'm sure Andy @ Ultimax will be able to fix you up

[ianforest]

Well ok where do we start?

What do you use the HC4500 for?
What do you use the HD2500 for?
Do you need BOTH of them?

Pioneer DJM3000 - it's a monster, do you need all of it's features?

Consider maybe the lighter Ally frame for the S&H?

[Andy Goodtimes]

The DJM is only a 5u Ian, and it has a 2u...3.5inch drop and the sockets are far enough recesed that you can butt something else right up to the rear of it without needing to use a blank plate, personally I don't know of anything else smaller that's decent and if there were surely it would only be a case of saving 1u wouldn't it?

Problem is with downsizing is that generally with technology you need to spend more money to get high quality in small packages or alternatively you have to make sacrifises.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

The other thing i can think of is slimming down your playout to just core components and siting your backup in another case that is kept locked in the van. I had a backup HD2500 with a 1u mixer just a short run away if the worst happened. I guess it depends how much you trust your laptop playout and how reliable it is.

And therein lies the problem. Read on McDuff...


Well ok where do we start?

What do you use the HC4500 for?
What do you use the HD2500 for?
Do you need BOTH of them?

Pioneer DJM3000 - it's a monster, do you need all of it's features?

Consider maybe the lighter Ally frame for the S&H?

S&H is manageable.

#The HD2500 is my main playout at the moment with the HC4500 and laptop with VDJ as backup. I had a few problems with VDJ crashing hence the reason I use both and I like to be able to control both properly.

I have just bought an MC6000 so am considering my options very carefully. I want to put the HD2500 in a case with it for immediate backup or should I learn to trust VDJ again?

[WWDJ]

should I learn to trust VDJ again?

No, you should just get Traktor :D
As I keep saying if it's good enough for Pete Tong ...

I agree with the comments above about the 902s and 710s and am seriously thinking that route myself this year. Better start saving! :D


I understand there is a new LED called a Dominator coming out soon which is meant to be exceptional too.


Who makes that then ?

[Sapphire Disco]

This would save weight and space and is very reasonably priced for what it does.

http://www.htfr.com/more-info/MR386735

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

This would save weight and space and is very reasonably priced for what it does.

http://www.htfr.com/more-info/MR386735

Only thing is Paul, I stopped using cluster lasers about 6 months ago! :)

[Sapphire Disco]

Only thing is Paul, I stopped using cluster lasers about 6 months ago! :)

Blimey they haven't got light screen syndrome already have they ?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Blimey they haven't got light screen syndrome already have they ?

Nah, it was just that everyone started to use them!

I still quite like them actually. :)

[Charlie Brown]

Nah, it was just that everyone started to use them!

I still quite like them actually. :)

Does that matter? Do you like to be unique?

What did you swap/change it with? - Don't worry, I won't copy. :sj:

[spin mobile disco]

ABS case if you dont already use one. I switched from ply to abs and saved 15 kilos off the weight. Subs, consider db sub 15's if your budget will allow as they are only 30 kilos each.

[funkymook]

ABS case if you dont already use one. I switched from ply to abs and saved 15 kilos off the weight. Subs, consider db sub 15's if your budget will allow as they are only 30 kilos each.

I have a Gator ABS case sitting spare in the attic - I think it's an 8 x 4 (but I'll double check), let me know if you would like to try it to see if it helps.

[kane]

Nah, it was just that everyone started to use them!

I still quite like them actually. :)

They look 10 times better when combined with a qtx plasma laser up on a White ceiling, especially with that blue led on the qtx.

[funkymook]

I have a Gator ABS case sitting spare in the attic - I think it's an 8 x 4 (but I'll double check), let me know if you would like to try it to see if it helps.

Just checked - it's 6U top and 4U Bottom. I used to have a HD2500 and DNX050 on top with the BU4500 CD drawers underneath.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Just checked - it's 6U top and 4U Bottom. I used to have a HD2500 and DNX050 on top with the BU4500 CD drawers underneath.

Thanks chap, but I have ordered one now. :)

[Cowlinn]

Do you reckon your RCF Top's could handle most small - average sized venues without subs? Just a thought i'm sure you've thought about.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Do you reckon your RCF Top's could handle most small - average sized venues without subs? Just a thought i'm sure you've thought about.

I already do use them for most small - medium size venues without subs.

[WWDJ]

Thanks chap, but I have ordered one now. :)

Go on then ... after we spent our time searching ... what is it :D

[Cowlinn]

I already do use them for most small - medium size venues without subs.

Would you ever brave what you consider to be a, large 'ish' venue without subs?
Say for example 150 people without subs?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Go on then ... after we spent our time searching ... what is it :D

I have decided to go for a 8U case from Swan with the flaps at the front. Using my Ipad and DJay software as backup.


Would you ever brave what you consider to be a, large 'ish' venue without subs?
Say for example 150 people without subs?

Probably not, but it really does depend on the size of the venue. It's difficult to say.

[Silver]

The Bose that you would need for the average DJ job would be at least 10 seperate parts and the stands are fairly heavy and as for footprint they take up as much room as your present subs...then you would have the B1s to hide under the ultimax or where ever. I never use my Bose without using tripods rather than pods on the

Sorry where do you get that from?

I use Bose L1 Mk2 for absolutely everything apart from quizzes, children's and smaller parties and I have only five sections.

The base/stand for the L1
Two sections of the L1
Two B1's, base units.

I carry the lot including cables into a venue in just two trips and it can be up and running in literally 5 minutes.

[sweetie]

I have decided to go for a 8U case from Swan with the flaps at the front. Using my Ipad and DJay software as backup.

Probably not, but it really does depend on the size of the venue. It's difficult to say.

Me too! How do you find the Ipad/djay combo? What splitter did you get? I need to buy one soon.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Me too! How do you find the Ipad/djay combo? What splitter did you get? I need to buy one soon.

Splitter? :confused:

[sweetie]

Splitter? :confused:

As far as I know, one needs a mono splitter to attach to the Ipad headphone socket to allow headphones to be connected for queueing and also a lineout to the mixer.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

As far as I know, one needs a mono splitter to attach to the Ipad headphone socket to allow headphones to be connected for queueing and also a lineout to the mixer.

You don't need to do it like that. You can use the headphone sockets for headphones and get one of these (http://www.ipadhut.co.uk/products/ipad-composite-av-cable) to connect to your mixer.

[Andy Goodtimes]

There you go DH...my local lstore say it will be £199 and any day now...

Set to take the lights show in one box to a new level is the Equinox Domin8R. Featuring 8 mirrors and 120 Ultra Bright 5mm LEDs (R: 40, G: 40, B: 40), this innovative effect will shoot penetrating, coloured, beams of light over long distances and is great for producing aerial effects over crowds.

Ideal for mobile DJs, clubs and small venues, the Domin8R LED offers a cost-effective alternative to laser effects. DJs and clubs will also appreciate the many features and operational versatility of the fixture.

The Domin8R can be operated in DMX mode or for those who prefer an easy plug-and-play light show it can also be run as a Sound Active effect to its own internal programmes without requiring a controller.

To accommodate larger venues and light shows, multiple units can be linked together via the fixtures built-in XLR connections and run Master/Slave configuration.

[Andy Goodtimes]

Silver...I have owned the Bose PAS for 4 years now, I used to have 3 of what I would call full sets but sold 1 to Clive at CRS a couple of years ago before he became a dealer and now I have 2 sets consisting of 2 PS1s, 2 L1s and 4 B1s in each set I also have 2 packlight amps and an extra 4B1s...All the original mark 1 models.

So what I call a full set is 10 parts as I said. I do not feel comfortable with using them for an average crowd. To me an average crowd is about 130 people of varying ages wanting varying types of music. Even with dynamic coupling I do not feel that 4 B1s are enough, most of my younger party goers agree with me too. As for the mid/top ranges I am relatively happy with that but I am not that happy with the dispurtion as it can be extremely loud behind the system which is essentially my workplace. In all fairness to the system you can't expect 8 little speakers of that size to produce everything below 180hz and you can't expect a system with a total output of 1.5k RMS to cope with medium and above sized jobs.

Don't misunderstand because I am still a big fan of the Bose for their intended uses. Last week-end I used them twice. Once for a brilliant girl singer with one of those fantastic Yamaha Grand Pianos that is strung but has a pick up on every string, I put the piano and her mic through a complete PAS and that was for over 500 people whilst they were eating and it sounded awsum. The other time was for a guitarist, electric keyboard and mic in a church, they played whilst guests were arriving and during the signing of the register and they remarked what an amazing system it was and far better than the old system they are used to.

I suppose it is a matter of opinion with no right answer, there are vastly different views on this subject, I know lots of folk that use nothing but Bose for their work and are happy with them and others that have bought them and sold them. I was merely telling Daren that I feel he is right to have reservations, after using those bins and big RCFs with the 2 inch horns I think he would be disappointed with the Bose.

[Corabar Steve]

There you go DH...my local lstore say it will be £199 and any day now...



Set to take the lights show in one box to a new level is the Equinox Domin8R. Featuring 8 mirrors and 120 Ultra Bright 5mm LEDs (R: 40, G: 40, B: 40), this innovative effect will shoot penetrating, coloured, beams of light over long distances and is great for producing aerial effects over crowds.



Ideal for mobile DJs, clubs and small venues, the Domin8R LED offers a cost-effective alternative to laser effects. DJs and clubs will also appreciate the many features and operational versatility of the fixture.



The Domin8R can be operated in DMX mode or for those who prefer an easy plug-and-play light show it can also be run as a Sound Active effect to its own internal programmes without requiring a controller.



To accommodate larger venues and light shows, multiple units can be linked together via the fixtures built-in XLR connections and run Master/Slave configuration.

Have you actually seen one in the flesh Andy?

They are naff beyond belief. All the movement is up down, there is no sideways movement at all.

I thought it would be good, until I saw it switched on.

[Andy Goodtimes]

No Steve...not seen one. I was just looking at some LED stuff in the local store and wasn't too impressed with any of it and the lads in there told me to hang on till this came in stock.

[Corabar Steve]

http://prolight.co.uk/item/eqled53/?PHPSESSID=6183a91187a8326b7c4133956c058c46

There's a video of one in action in the link above.

[Silver]

Have you actually seen one in the flesh Andy?

They are naff beyond belief. All the movement is up down, there is no sideways movement at all.

I thought it would be good, until I saw it switched on.

And just for a change ............. DOTS!!! (Sorry, this to be read in a sarcy tone!) It's yet another boring LED light.

[Charlie Brown]

And just for a change ............. DOTS!!! (Sorry, this to be read in a sarcy tone!) It's yet another boring LED light.

I like it. I would be tempted to buy that...used with smoke, it looks awesome!

[Andy Goodtimes]

Not amazing...mind you I think the LED effects side of things have a way to go yet, I thought the big 6 head one was ok...forget the name but then I thought transportation would be an issue.

Sorry Daren, just trying to be helpful as it sounded like a lot of effect in a lightweight package.

Personally I would go back to clusters and alike as they're pretty cool regardless of what others are using, I have a few different ones and ring the changes from time to time. I have a 3d cluster, Aquarius, Nebular, VR250 and some of those with the blue wash built in. Also got a couple of really cheap 60 green ones but they're Chinese and I'm sure the Chinese put the wrong bits in them as they are unbelievably bright, never just 60s, knocking on 6 or so years old now and never a murmer from them.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

So new gear arriving in dribs and drabs.

Case comes tomorrow as do new speakers. Wizards Friday.

Everything should be lighter and easier hopefully.

[Mark Wild]

So new gear arriving in dribs and drabs.

Case comes tomorrow as do new speakers. Wizards Friday.

Everything should be lighter and easier hopefully.

Wizards are 15kg's in weight aren't they Daz, plus flightcase, is that easier for you?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Wizards are 15kg's in weight aren't they Daz, plus flightcase, is that easier for you?

They are about the same as the EFXs and are in a wheeled trunk so doesn't matter too much.

[ppentertainments]

Wizards are 15kg's in weight aren't they Daz, plus flightcase, is that easier for you?
No but you have to go 'for the name' :p :D :D :D
Gear snobs :sofa:

[Charlie Brown]

How you setting it out Darren? (Don't worry - I won't copy you like I have in the past. :sj:)

Will you be using two wizards?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

How you setting it out Darren? (Don't worry - I won't copy you like I have in the past. :sj:)

Will you be using two wizards?

2 Wizards on winch stands, positions TBC!

I really want some kind of wash, but am not sure where to put either pars, bars or panels.

Any ideas anyone?

Actually, a quick thanks to Ian Forest for sending me piccys of how his are set up and going through stuff on the phone and to Andy Goodtimes for bothering to type some instructions out and to ring me to go through a few bits and pieces. Thank you both!

[Charlie Brown]

It will look pretty sick then by the sounds of it...

(Charlie goes off to buy some winch stands.....)

:sofa:

[Danno13]

I usually put a LED par under each speaker stand within the legs, if that makes sense? You don't blind people that way and they're pretty hard for people to knock into.

Like this - http://www.revolution-djs.co.uk/photo-gallery-122-Wedding%20DJ%20%20Birtsmorton%20Court.php

[Excalibur]

I really want some kind of wash, but am not sure where to put either pars, bars or panels.

Any ideas anyone?



Perhaps an area not normally illuminated by sunlight? :whistle: :D :D :D :D :D :D