Abused by local Dj

[musicologydisco]

Last month, some of you may recall, I received a hoax call out which I suspected came from a local Dj.
My suspicions have just been confirmed as I have just received a call for a last minute gig tonight but I recognised the voice. When he realised I'd sussed him he just started swearing at me telling me to stop effing it up for everyone else with my prices. He's going to report me to effing Tax man blah blah blah.
Actually very unpleasant. I didn't listen to much of it I Just hung up. He rung back immediately but I rejected the call. (Phone number was hidden as "unknown").
Don't know why this bloke has got the hump with me because I know there are guys quoting even cheaper for a Saturday locally than I am.
Anybody else in Norfolk area had this clown threatening them?

[Charlie Brown]

He's going to report me to effing Tax man blah blah blah.

Are you paying tax?

[funkymook]

Last month, some of you may recall, I received a hoax call out which I suspected came from a local Dj.
My suspicions have just been confirmed as I have just received a call for a last minute gig tonight but I recognised the voice. When he realised I'd sussed him he just started swearing at me telling me to stop effing it up for everyone else with my prices. He's going to report me to effing Tax man blah blah blah.
Actually very unpleasant. I didn't listen to much of it I Just hung up. He rung back immediately but I rejected the call. (Phone number was hidden as "unknown").
Don't know why this bloke has got the hump with me because I know there are guys quoting even cheaper for a Saturday locally than I am.
Anybody else in Norfolk area had this clown threatening them?

If you know who it is then I'd report him to the police as harassment - best to have it on record in case it escalates.

Chances are though, now he knows he's been sussed he won't call again.

[DazzyD]

Are you paying tax?

That's not really a question that should be asked on a public forum, Charlie.


If you know who it is then I'd report him to the police as harassment - best to have it on record in case it escalates.

Chances are though, now he knows he's been sussed he won't call again.

Totally agree. When things start getting threatening, you need to be letting the police know just in case.

[DB Entertainments]

yer Charlie - none of anyone else's business either asking personal questions like that.

discolology - there is a clown around here also - he is tryng to make things hard for me (boils down to jealousy) but other DJs and venues are seeing straigt through him!

[DeckstarDeluxe]

Make a note of these calls at what time and whats been said. It will come in useful if he carries on doing things like this.

[gaza]

Are you paying tax?


That's not really a question that should be asked on a public forum, Charlie.



Totally agree. When things start getting threatening, you need to be letting the police know just in case.


yer Charlie - none of anyone else's business either asking personal questions like that.

discolology - there is a clown around here also - he is tryng to make things hard for me (boils down to jealousy) but other DJs and venues are seeing straigt through him!



If you are paying tax and are legit then what you charge is up to you, if however the reason that the angry Dj rang up is because he knows that you are not legit (i suspect not to be the case) then fair play to him.
He could of course just be a headcase.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Whether the other person knows if someone is legit or not does not give them the right to abuse someone.

Not fair play to him at all...

[DazzyD]

If you are paying tax and are legit then what you charge is up to you, if however the reason that the angry Dj rang up is because he knows that you are not legit (i suspect not to be the case) then fair play to him.
He could of course just be a headcase.

If any local DJs are not paying tax then, as far as I'm concerned, that's up to them and it's a risk that they're taking. Personally, I wouldn't go around making threats to them like is the case here. Whether or not a competitor is legit has absolutely no bearing on how I run my business. I can only do what I can do (and no doubt keep hearing the "How MUCH???" comments when I give someone a quote!). Until this industry is properly regulated then the dodgy operators will continue to operate. They've always been around and they'll be around for some time to come regardless of what I do.

[gaza]

Whether the other person knows if someone is legit or not does not give them the right to abuse someone.

Not fair play to him at all...


maybe not a abusive phone call, just a call to the tax man.

[DB Entertainments]

we have been through this before......there was a HUGE thread on it!

(started by Martin I think)

[gaza]

we have been through this before......there was a HUGE thread on it!

(started by Martin I think)

what was the thread title

[yourdj]

Make a note of these calls at what time and whats been said. It will come in useful if he carries on doing things like this.

i would get a digital recorder and record all enquries as a matter of habit especially if your quoting. If he calls back you have proof.

This is the main reason I do not use my phone and mainly use emails. you then have a written record. :)

[Shakermaker Promotions]

It's no'ones business whether the OP is paying tax or not.
I wish I didn't have to otherwise I'd have a lot more money left in the bank this month but I've just paid mine.

There's a bloke round my way who is doing multiple gigs per week (providing P.A. stuff for live gigs) and I know for a fact he isn't paying tax. It does my head in big time but he'll get caught eventually.

As for this bloke in the OP's area....well, no way would I take lightly to threats like that. I would find out who it is and deal with it properly via the police.

[Corabar Entertainment]

i would get a digital recorder and record all enquries as a matter of habit especially if your quoting. If he calls back you have proof. ...bearing in mind that you can't do that legally unless people agree - you need to tell them beforehand

[gaza]

...bearing in mind that you can't do that legally unless people agree - you need to tell them beforehand


so that's why we are told " this call may be recorded for training " then

[Shakermaker Promotions]

If you're getting dodgy calls regularly then the police will want proof. There's nothing better than actually getting the person themselves so in order to do that you'd need to record them. I can record calls on my phone although I have never tried it.

Can you imagine it?

"Excuse me Mr Abuser...just hold on a second whilst I press record".

[Corabar Entertainment]

so that's why we are told " this call may be recorded for training " thenYep



Can you imagine it?

"Excuse me Mr Abuser...just hold on a second whilst I press record".No argument with that, but it still doesn't change the fact that you're not legally allowed to record telephone conversations unless people consent - albeit tacitly.

[NKR]

You could have had some fun with that and just repeated everything back to him

'why are you ruining everything for everyone?'
'I'm telling the tax man over you!'

Very frustrating for the bloke on the other end. He may actually have imploded or spontaneously combusted.

Would have been a giggle anyway.

[funkymook]

You could have had some fun with that and just repeated everything back to him

'why are you ruining everything for everyone?'
'I'm telling the tax man over you!'

Very frustrating for the bloke on the other end. He may actually have imploded or spontaneously combusted.

Would have been a giggle anyway.

I'd say best not to get into that sort of thing, no point in aggravating someone like this, you don't know how far they'll go if they see it as a challenge.

[Shaun]

I'd say best not to get into that sort of thing, no point in aggravating someone like this, you don't know how far they'll go if they see it as a challenge.

Good advice.

[NKR]

I'd say best not to get into that sort of thing, no point in aggravating someone like this, you don't know how far they'll go if they see it as a challenge.

Ahh why not. They are just some disgruntled DJ who clearly can't cut it. Screw him calling people up getting threatening. If he wanted to get proper larey he would do so anyway so you may as well show you couldn't give a stuff rather than show weakness and let him bully you.

If he is going to get full on he is more likely to if he thinks you are weak. You never learned how to deal with bullies?

[Shaun]

Ahh why not. They are just some disgruntled DJ who clearly can't cut it. Screw him calling people up getting threatening. If he wanted to get proper larey he would do so anyway so you may as well show you couldn't give a stuff rather than show weakness and let him bully you.

If he is going to get full on he is more likely to if he thinks you are weak. You never learned how to deal with bullies?

Why waste energy on cretins like that though. I'd rather hang up the phone and carry on with my life, and leave them to their "issues".

[NKR]

Why waste energy on cretins like that though. I'd rather hang up the phone and carry on with my life, and leave them to their "issues".

Some times its just fun to be five again. How many other opportunities to you get to play copy cat :D :D :D :D :D :D :D and have someone proper steaming mad from it. Worth a giggle!

[Shaun]

Some times its just fun to be five again. How many other opportunities to you get to play copy cat :D :D :D :D :D :D :D and have someone proper steaming mad from it. Worth a giggle!

:lol: I worry about you at times. :d

[NKR]

:lol: I worry about you at times. :d

'I worry about you at times'

[Daryll]

Well today I have had a violence and abuse training at work , so while it is fresh in my mind.

The bottom line was , don't put yourself in a position where you could become the victim..

report this person , you have the weight of law on your side.

Daryll

[DB Entertainments]

'I worry about you at times'

lol

[NKR]

Well today I have had a violence and abuse training at work , so while it is fresh in my mind.

The bottom line was , don't put yourself in a position where you could become the victim..

report this person , you have the weight of law on your side.
Daryll

As long as you can wait 4 hours for them to turn up!

[funkymook]

Ahh why not. They are just some disgruntled DJ who clearly can't cut it. Screw him calling people up getting threatening. If he wanted to get proper larey he would do so anyway so you may as well show you couldn't give a stuff rather than show weakness and let him bully you.

If he is going to get full on he is more likely to if he thinks you are weak. You never learned how to deal with bullies?

Each to their own of course - some people will deal with it the way you would, others would calmly end the call.

But do not mistake someone dealing with things differently to you as weakness.

[STEVE HANLEY]

Being an ex Para I would deal with it slightly differently to most,

A bit like peperamies. We're a bit of an animal;)

Utrinique Paratus:) :)

[NKR]

Being an ex Para I would deal with it slightly different to most,

A bit like peperamies. We're a bit of an animal;)

Utrinique Paratus:) :)

You can't go round wacking people with telegraph poles. I mean if you do that some poor bugger will end up with no phone for a week and we can't have that.

[Charlie Brown]

That's not really a question that should be asked on a public forum, Charlie.


I thought this forum was all about promoting good practice? Surely it's good practice to declare your earnings? :confused:


yer Charlie - none of anyone else's business either asking personal questions like that.


Same point as above.


Some times its just fun to be five again. How many other opportunities to you get to play copy cat :D :D :D :D :D :D :D and have someone proper steaming mad from it. Worth a giggle!

Exactly what I would like to do but would be too scared. :sj:



The bottom line was , don't put yourself in a position where you could become the victim..


I couldn't agree more.

I had the same problem with a venue. Constant harassment, FB emails, texts etc but that was a venue not a DJ.

I would stay clear. It could end up nasty and have a detrimental effect on your business.

If you're charging more than him, surely he isn't a 'threat', 'problem' or 'issue'. Shouldn't you forget about it and concentrate on what you're doing and not what joe blogs is?

I know you weren't suggesting anything from your original post but don't get strayed. Been there, done that, got the stamp. - It wasn't pleasant. :sj:

[Vectis]

You can't go round wacking people with telegraph poles. I mean if you do that some poor bugger will end up with no phone for a week and we can't have that.

Neil ... not sure if you noticed the OP is in Norfolk?

They don't have telegraph poles... for one very good reason :D

[Glenski]

...bearing in mind that you can't do that legally unless people agree - you need to tell them beforehand

It is not illegal to record a telephone conversation for the record, if it is for your own personal use - but if you intend to introduce a third party like a claim in court etc, you then need to inform the caller you are recording the call !!

There are companies out there that can record all your phone calls for a fee, and they will deal with the legal stuff if you have something to raise.

Thank you

Glenn

[Corabar Entertainment]

Thanks for clarifying, Glenn :D

[woody2]

...bearing in mind that you can't do that legally unless people agree - you need to tell them beforehand

untrue, if you play a active part in the call then you can record, i am using recordings in a civil matter at court at the moment;)

[Silver]

I thought this forum was all about promoting good practice? Surely it's good practice to declare your earnings? :confused:


Declaring your earnings and paying tax are not the same thing. Somebody declaring all their earnings may not earn enough to pay tax after deductable expenses.

Anyway back to the point in question. Without being too nosey, in percentage terms how much lower are your prices than his? I'm just wondering why it is he is getting so stressed?

[musicologydisco]

Anyway back to the point in question. Without being too nosey, in percentage terms how much lower are your prices than his? I'm just wondering why it is he is getting so stressed?

Have absolutely no idea. Mr Angry's identity is a complete mystery. I think that because I put my booked gigs on my website, he can see those he quoted for then subsequently lost to me and it's clearly winding him up!
He rang me again at 10am whilst out on my delivery run. Gave me more verbal and hung up.
It's not really practical to record my phone calls on a mobile, especially when I'm at work.
I think I will try and engage him in conversation next time and get him to understand that I get undercut too. I will also point him to this forum where he can get advice on marketing and how to get the price HE wants!

If this continues the way it is I shall contact police but at the moment they have nothing to go on as the calls are "number withheld".

Stay tuned.........!

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I will also point him to this forum where he can get advice on marketing and how to get the price HE wants!



I'm not sure that I really want someone like that on this forum.

[Charlie Brown]

By the sounds of it - he is very annoyed you're undercutting him and taking his work.

If everyone in your area charged £250+ then people would HAVE to pay more for DJ's etc as they would have no choice. :)

[musicologydisco]

By the sounds of it - he is very annoyed you're undercutting him and taking his work.

Not a lot gets past you does it Charlie! ;)
The point is I get undercut too but don't go around abusing other Dj's.
Every business in the world has this issue. That's what it's all about!

[StarZSoundS]

If everyone in your area charged £250+ then people would HAVE to pay more for DJ's etc as they would have no choice. :)


Sadly ....that is no longer true Buddy .....Technology has moved the Goalposts!!!;) ;)


You can now get a decent collection of tunes in a couple of hours(for a pittance)and hire or buy adequate equipment very cheaply.:eek: :eek: :eek:

[Charlie Brown]

Not a lot gets past you does it Charlie! ;)


I mean you're undercutting them quite substantially. ;)

However, that doesn't give them an excuse to do what they're doing now. :)

[funkymook]

I mean you're undercutting them quite substantially. ;)



How do you know that?

[musicologydisco]

I mean you're undercutting them quite substantially

Who knows? I haven't a clue who he is or his prices. Some are undercutting him by even more than me. Maybe he needs to look at his pricing or market himself more "high end".

[Mark Wild]

This is surely about some nutter giving the guy grief over the phone, not a pricing issue.

[funkymook]

This is surely about some nutter giving the guy grief over the phone, not a pricing issue.

Totally - don't need another pricing thread!

I think you are probably right that he can see gigs he quoted for on your site.

Bit of detective work (and luck) could find him. Look at gigs you've had booked just before the calls started. If the venues still have the quotes, and they are willing to help you, discard those who quoted less than you, then you'll be left with some likely suspects.

Probably unlikely the venues would release that information to you - but you could explain and ask them to keep any emails or letters they received quoting for the same function just in case police need to investigate later (hopefully not necessary of course).

[Silver]

Have absolutely no idea. Mr Angry's identity is a complete mystery. I think that because I put my booked gigs on my website, he can see those he quoted for then subsequently lost to me and it's clearly winding him up!
He rang me again at 10am whilst out on my delivery run. Gave me more verbal and hung up.
It's not really practical to record my phone calls on a mobile, especially when I'm at work.
I think I will try and engage him in conversation next time and get him to understand that I get undercut too. I will also point him to this forum where he can get advice on marketing and how to get the price HE wants!

If this continues the way it is I shall contact police but at the moment they have nothing to go on as the calls are "number withheld".

Stay tuned.........!

I seriously do think you should contact the police NOW! The phone calls may be just the start of something that could turn quite unsavoury.

A log of events needs to be started. This individual could take things one step further, if he knows where you are working then he could well turn up one night and damage your vehicle whilst you are working inside.

The problem is, you have no idea as to the lengths this individual will go to. Not trying to scare you unnecessarily but he his an unknown quantity.

Take steps now to build up a case.

Good luck mate.

[yourdj]

I think there may be more to this than meets the eye. Whether he knows it or not? IE he took a valuable residency or something?

You do not just ring someone up and have a go at them when pretending to be a prospective client unless you have a proper gripe.



I'm not sure that I really want someone like that on this forum.

he may be a lurker and taken offense to something this guy has said. possibly an existing member.

[chrisj]

Who knows? I haven't a clue who he is or his prices. Some are undercutting him by even more than me. Maybe he needs to look at his pricing or market himself more "high end".

Hiya Mark, I've just been reading this and it's not the sort of thing another dj should do. Although I look at your website occasionally and see that you have gigs that I have quoted for it doesn't bother me as those clients want a lower price, smaller disco and I am glad you can help them. I have passed your name a few times when people say they can't afford my fee.

I hope whoever is calling you sees this thread and stops the calls.

[Vectis]

Dibble take harassment very seriously. I'd have absolutely no hesitation in reporting this. Two strikes and he'd be out.

"Number withheld" can be traced by the appropriate agencies.

[Corabar Entertainment]

untrue, if you play a active part in the call then you can record, i am using recordings in a civil matter at court at the moment;)I've had a look at the details, and there are different rules for personal telephone calls and business telephone calls.

For the definitive summary of what is and isn't' allowed, Oftel have a good little article here (http://www.ofcom.org.uk/static/archive/oftel/consumer/advice/faqs/prvfaq3.htm)


Recording and monitoring telephone calls or e-mails

A general overview of interception, recording and monitoring of communications

The interception, recording and monitoring of telephone calls is governed by a number of different pieces of UK legislation. The requirements of all relevant legislation must be complied with. The main ones are:

* Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000 ("RIPA")
* Telecommunications (Lawful Business Practice)(Interception of Communications) Regulations 2000 ("LBP Regulations")
* Data Protection Act 1998
* Telecommunications (Data Protection and Privacy) Regulations 1999
* Human Rights Act 1998

It is not possible to provide comprehensive detail of that legislation here. Any person considering interception, recording or monitoring of telephone calls or e-mails is strongly advised to seek his/her own independent legal advice and should not seek to rely on the general information provided below. It should be borne in mind that criminal offences and civil actions may occur when the relevant legislation is not complied with. Accordingly, Oftel accepts no liability for reliance by any person on the following information.

Can I record telephone conversations on my home phone?

Yes. The relevant law, RIPA, does not prohibit individuals from recording their own communications provided that the recording is for their own use. Recording or monitoring are only prohibited where some of the contents of the communication - which can be a phone conversation or an e-mail - are made available to a third party, ie someone who was neither the caller or sender nor the intended recipient of the original communication. For further information see the Home Office website where RIPA is posted.

Do I have to let people know that I intend to record their telephone conversations with me?

No, provided you are not intending to make the contents of the communication available to a third party. If you are you will need the consent of the person you are recording.

Can a business or other organisation record or monitor my phone calls or e-mail correspondence with them?

Yes they can, but only in a limited set of circumstances relevant for that business which have been defined by the LBP Regulations. The main ones are:

* to provide evidence of a business transaction
* to ensure that a business complies with regulatory procedures
* to see that quality standards or targets are being met in the interests of national security
* to prevent or detect crime to investigate the unauthorised use of a telecom system
* to secure the effective operation of the telecom system.

In addition, businesses can monitor, but not record, phone calls or e-mails that have been received to see whether they are relevant to the business (ie open an employee's voicemail or mailbox systems while they are away to see if there are any business communications stored there). For further information see the DTI website where the LBP Regulations are posted.

However any interception of employees' communications must be proportionate and in accordance with Data Protection principles. The Information Commissioner has published a Data Protection Code on "Monitoring at Work" available on its website here. The Code is designed to help employers comply with the legal requirements of Data Protection Act 1988. Any enforcement action would be based on a failure to meet the requirements of the act - however relevant parts of the Code are likely to be cited in connection with any enforcement action relating to the processing of personal information in the employment context. Accordingly this Code of Practice and the Data Protection Act must also be considered by any business before it intercepts employees' communications.

Do businesses have to tell me if they are going to record or monitor my phone calls or e-mails?

No. as long as the recording or monitoring is done for one of the above purposes the only obligation on businesses is to inform their own employees. If businesses want to record for any other purpose, such as market research, they will have to obtain your consent.

What do I do if my calls have been recorded unlawfully?

Under RIPA it is a tort to record or monitor a communication unlawfully. This means that if you think you have suffered from unlawful interception of your phone calls or e-mails you have the right to seek redress by taking civil action against the offender in the courts.As this would be a business call, I suppose you can certainly argue that the recordings were made for one of the legitimate reasons listed, but how that would translate to being made available to third parties for another reason, I'm not sure. (I find the wording of the 4th legitimate reason on the business section a little ambiguous and could be taken two ways, but it is possible that this situation may fall within that category and therefore be OK)

Given that the person being recorded has legal redress if it is deemed to be outside of the scope of the legislation, I would strongly suggest that anyone going down this route should take legal advice first.

[woody2]

I suppose you can certainly argue that the recordings were made for one of the legitimate reasons listed, but how that would translate to being made available to third parties for another reason, I'm not sure.

case law, at first you inform the judge, it is up to him if he accepts it. then provide a transcript and a cd copy. this is only in civil matters, i have no idea on criminal cases.

[musicologydisco]

I think there may be more to this than meets the eye. Whether he knows it or not? IE he took a valuable residency or something?

You do not just ring someone up and have a go at them when pretending to be a prospective client unless you have a proper gripe.




he may be a lurker and taken offense to something this guy has said. possibly an existing member.

Nothing unusual has happened. No residency or anything like that.
In fact i'm quieter early part of this year than last year because (I guess) I put my Sat rate up. I've got nothing in April at all. This bloke is just weird!

[Corabar Entertainment]

case law, at first you inform the judge, it is up to him if he accepts it. then provide a transcript and a cd copy. this is only in civil matters, i have no idea on criminal cases.:approve:

Not wishing to pry, so feel free not to answer, but is your case involving a personal call or a business call?

[woody2]

:approve:

Not wishing to pry, so feel free not to answer, but is your case involving a personal call or a business call?

i volunteer as a McKenzie friend so have been involved in lots of different cases

[Corabar Entertainment]

i volunteer as a McKenzie friend so have been involved in lots of different casesTa. From my understanding, they would be cases involving private individuals, wouldn't they? (I've never heard of a McKenzie Friend to a commercial entity, although I could be wrong)

[woody2]

Ta. From my understanding, they would be cases involving private individuals, wouldn't they? (I've never heard of a McKenzie Friend to a commercial entity, although I could be wrong)


in the past i have done private individual Vs company and small start-up business Vs large company as well as family matters.

[Corabar Entertainment]

Very interesting!

Anyway, I'd love to pick your brains more on this, but I fear I am hijacking the thread somewhat... so, another time maybe :)

Thanks for clarifying it further. :)

[woody2]

Very interesting!

Anyway, I'd love to pick your brains more on this, but I fear I am hijacking the thread somewhat... so, another time maybe :)

Thanks for clarifying it further. :)

:beer1:

to get it back on track, i would report to police and go and get a mp3 dictaphone from maplin etc..

if you cannot as you say record at work, have a word with your boss, tell them whats happening. i would not mention that it is to do with your outside business;) report it to your phone company, but it can take months to get written proof off them.

cheers

[musicologydisco]

:beer1:

to get it back on track, i would report to police and go and get a mp3 dictaphone from maplin etc..

if you cannot as you say record at work, have a word with your boss, tell them whats happening. i would not mention that it is to do with your outside business;) report it to your phone company, but it can take months to get written proof off them.

cheers

I'm usually driving that's the prob so it's just not practical to record. I'm now just rejecting any "unknown" calls which sends the caller to voicemail. With luck he'll get so frustrated he just won't be able to resist leaving a message. Then I'll have him recorded on my voicemail for the police to deal with!

[musicologydisco]

y ... I've got nothing in April at all. This bloke is just weird!

Just taken one for April. (A genuine one) Spooooooooky

[chrispeacock]

definately a bloke around db entertainments way doing it. i have met the guy and what a plonker he is.

[Shaun]

I've had to delete a post. Be very careful about naming names and posting things that could be potentially libellous.