"Format Shifting" to be legalised? [Archive] - Mobile Disco Directory Forum

mattydinx

03-08-2011, 08:21 AM

Announcement due today.

Vince Cable states:

Bringing the laws more up-to-date to have a proper balance which allows consumers and businesses to operate more freely, but at the same time protect genuinely creative artists and penalise pirates

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-14372698

Good news?

Vectis

03-08-2011, 08:30 AM

Given that it's consumer law, no, not really.

djdave01

03-08-2011, 08:39 AM

Just seen it on the news, will finally be legal to rip your own cd's onto your computer or ipod/phone for personal use.

Just like everyones been doing for years then lol

katman

03-08-2011, 08:44 AM

I was thinking it would make it even more difficult to persuade people why their DJ should have a Produb licence.

The fact that any copying/format shifting was illegal made it easier to explain, now that consumers CAN copy stuff they probably wont see why WE need the licence.

Not that anyone really cared about the law before, everyone I know has already copied their music collection and far too many people, particularly the younger generation see nothing wrong with getting music and movies for free :(

Corabar Steve

03-08-2011, 08:45 AM

Personal, not commercial.

There is really no point to this thread as it doesn't affect us in the slightest.

Now, if they were to introduce a full "fair use" policy.......

chrisj

03-08-2011, 11:37 AM

I will always stick with my cd's so it doesn't interest me anyway.
I celebrate 43 years of disco today and see no reason to change.

MikeW

03-08-2011, 11:52 AM

I will always stick with my cd's so it doesn't interest me anyway.
I celebrate 43 years of disco today and see no reason to change.

Congratulations. :)

DeckstarDeluxe

03-08-2011, 12:01 PM

I will always stick with my cd's so it doesn't interest me anyway.
I celebrate 43 years of disco today and see no reason to change.

So you have used cd's for the last 43 years? Have you even tried a digital playout?

Jiggles

03-08-2011, 12:32 PM

It's for businesses as well if people read the quote! I see it as good news. In this day in age piracy can never be stopped. The Internet was desired to be lawless. Just see it as a step forward. :)

Vectis

03-08-2011, 12:42 PM

It's for businesses as well if people read the quote!

Eh :confused:

What part of "personal use" and "non-commercial copying" means that the new policy applies to businesses?

Dynamic Entertainment

03-08-2011, 12:45 PM

Reading the op quote

allows consumers and businesses to operate more freely

BossmanKaraokeDisco

03-08-2011, 04:01 PM

It's for businesses as well if people read the quote! I see it as good news. In this day in age piracy can never be stopped. The Internet was desired to be lawless. Just see it as a step forward. :)

Just read the proposals and it purely means that if you buy a CD and want to change it to mp3 or another format for Personal use then it will no longer be illegal. As far as ripping for commercial use, you will still need a Produb license.
Appears a lot of people are unaware that if they have a hard drive based system at home or in their car and they transfer a brought CD on to it, at the moment it is illegal, this is purely to deal with that.

Megamix

03-08-2011, 08:52 PM

So you have used cd's for the last 43 years?

Did he secretly invent them before they were commercially available ??!!:D :D :D

DJ_Wulfman

03-08-2011, 10:31 PM

Personally can't wait to se the end of produb. IMO when you pay for a track that should be the end of it....period.

It *should* become your property to do with as you will, either privately or commercially.

When any of us buy a new amp, laptop or set of CDJ's from our local DJ store or online, are any of us required to pay for an extra licence in order to enable us to use our new equipment in public?

No?

Corabar Steve

03-08-2011, 11:00 PM

It's for businesses as well if people read the quote! I see it as good news. In this day in age piracy can never be stopped. The Internet was desired to be lawless. Just see it as a step forward. :)
Or you could try (like I did before I posted) looking into the whole thing, rather than relying on an out of context quote.

Personally can't wait to se the end of produb.
You'll be waiting a while then

funkymook

03-08-2011, 11:07 PM

DJ_Wulfman

03-08-2011, 11:42 PM

Actually Yes!

Someone is paying for a PPL if you're playing in public.

That is not the DJ's responsibility though is it?

PPL is the responsibility of the venue. They ALL have to pay it if they wish to host entertainment. Same as VPL.

YOU are being taxed TWICE for privilege of playing that venue ;).

funkymook

04-08-2011, 12:04 AM

When any of us buy a new amp, laptop or set of CDJ's from our local DJ store or online, are any of us required to pay for an extra licence in order to enable us to use our new equipment in public?

No?

Actually Yes!

Someone is paying for a PPL if you're playing in public.

That is not the DJ's responsibility though is it?

PPL is the responsibility of the venue. They ALL have to pay it if they wish to host entertainment. Same as VPL.

YOU are being taxed TWICE for privilege of playing that venue ;).

Depends if the DJ is also the venue owner or event organiser of course - but the point is there is an extra license to use that equipment in public, whoever ends up paying it.

(I'm enjoying this game of ping pong :D - private joke)

Dynamic Entertainment

04-08-2011, 12:09 AM

I can understand your point Wulfman...and if or when we get a Fair Usage Policy in this country (which I doubt) then that will probably mark the end of ProDub...until then, either pay the fee...dont format shift...or work round it legally (as I do) :D

funkymook

04-08-2011, 12:15 AM

Creature

04-08-2011, 04:49 AM

its easy Funkymook - just buy the mp3 from a legal website - no Produb required :)

mattydinx

04-08-2011, 06:37 AM

Or you could try (like I did before I posted) looking into the whole thing, rather than relying on an out of context quote.

Actually the quote wasn't out of context when the BBC article was first published yesterday morning. The article has been majorly changed since I posted the link and less of a point has now been made about 'legal CD ripping'

funkymook

04-08-2011, 09:01 AM

either pay the fee...dont format shift...or work round it legally (as I do) :D

A legal work around? Intriguing. Something you care to share with us?

its easy Funkymook - just buy the mp3 from a legal website - no Produb required :)

That comes under 'don't format shift' it's not a work around.

Corabar Steve

04-08-2011, 09:13 AM

Actually the quote wasn't out of context when the BBC article was first published yesterday morning. The article has been majorly changed since I posted the link and less of a point has now been made about 'legal CD ripping'
I beg to differ. The quote was on it's on with no relation to anything else in the whole article (or the proposal), ergo it was out of context.

Solitaire Events Ltd

04-08-2011, 09:30 AM

Personally can't wait to se the end of produb. IMO when you pay for a track that should be the end of it....period.

It is unless you make a copy.

BossmanKaraokeDisco

04-08-2011, 11:19 AM

its easy Funkymook - just buy the mp3 from a legal website - no Produb required :)

So you download from the legal website straight to your playout hard drive then cos if you dont you still need Produb.
Also assuming you dont make a copy either, what happens if your hard drive crashes???

Dynamic Entertainment

04-08-2011, 11:24 AM

A legal work around? Intriguing. Something you care to share with us?

Not really a secret, ive mentioned it loads of times. i download direct to my extrenal hard driveand plug that into my laptop running serato. Im running on a mixture of MP3 and cd, and slowly rebuying the most popular stuff i play on cd as MP3 with a view to only carrying cds for stuff thats not available on MP3.

I have a seperate extrenal hard drive for back up, which is downloaded directly only that has a very small selection of top tracks, so if the main harddrive or laptop dies then i have backup (aswell as CDs). I only have a bery small collection of floorfillers on that drive becuse the backup lappy isnt overly powerful or capable of processing a huge library. Yes, it means buying some tracks twice, but as long as im still on cds too, i dont mind.

Excalibur

04-08-2011, 11:28 AM

So you download from the legal website straight to your playout hard drive then cos if you dont you still need Produb.
Also assuming you dont make a copy either, what happens if your hard drive crashes???

Well, this is where it gets greyer than a battleship on a foggy day, but:
As I understand it, you're allowed to make a backup of your downloads. No question, as long as it's not used for performance.

Logic suggests that you put a new HD in your playout machine, and reinstate the tunes without penalty, or alternatively get the IT magicians to recover the original HD contents, and transfer it to a newly installed one. This is of course merely my supposition, but I feel it doesn't breach the spirit of the licence.

BossmanKaraokeDisco

04-08-2011, 11:33 AM

Well, this is where it gets greyer than a battleship on a foggy day, but:
As I understand it, you're allowed to make a backup of your downloads. No question, as long as it's not used for performance.

Logic suggests that you put a new HD in your playout machine, and reinstate the tunes without penalty, or alternatively get the IT magicians to recover the original HD contents, and transfer it to a newly installed one. This is of course merely my supposition, but I feel it doesn't breach the spirit of the licence.

Dont know about foggy day, thats a real pea-souper, IMO I think that you still need Produb for doing that, but I could be wrong and I am sure someone will point out if I am :cool:

DJ_Wulfman

06-08-2011, 01:44 AM

So you download from the legal website straight to your playout hard drive then cos if you dont you still need Produb.
Also assuming you dont make a copy either, what happens if your hard drive crashes???

I would presume that using your "back-up" copy to restore the original is acceptable practice (being the whole point of making back-up copies) and therefore bypasses produb legislation.

But then again, I'm not the person making up and trying to justify stupid unenforceable laws to try and fleece an extra few quid from you.