Forty Quid Fred?

[leelive]

My wee boy's school had a hallowe'en disco last night.

I got my first experience of a sixty quid sid... though he had given them a discount making him a forty quid fred(?).
It was dreadful. Really dreadful.

The music was so loud my ears were piercing. Couldn't talk until outside the room. Cables ready to be tripped over. Warnings to kids not to touch the skin-melting lights - which were flashing all over the place. Speakers on the floor! Chap sitting down at a table with a laptop and an array of clutter!!
No mixing. No cutting. No beat-matching. No consideration of harmonies.... I suspect he was using Atomix MP3. Just one track over-lapped the last without care for continuity or anything. The music must have been illegal copies as the quality of the tracks was dire. The Cha Cha Slide was not even the chart version... was a slow one!! Lots of muffled shouts to the crowd to get on the floor-dancing.... He even had a tacky board adverting himself in the middle of the set-up... but it was higher than the table... Had a full list of where he could work including Weddings!

I had seen the chaps van on the way home from a gig last week. It really looked very smart. Colourful logo and branding. Even had a personalised number plate to match the name of the business. Last night he was even wearing an embroidered jacket with the same logo on. All looked very smart. But the kit was all the most basic from maplin.

What really worries me is that people will book him based on branding. He has no website so they wouldn't see the mess until the day of the event. He was told to turn the music down twice by the organisers but kept on cranking it back up. No consideration for babies or the small children present.

At first I was happy that this was my competition!! Which is no competition. Then I realised that this effort is bringing down the perception of the industry.

I have offered to do it for them for free for next year. They didn't know I dj'd so hadn't asked.

Astonished

Lee

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

So you are complaining about someone charging £40 and then offer to do it for free?

Tacky board advertising themselves....hmmm. I thought that's what you used! :sj:

And just because the quality of the music was dire doesn't mean they were illegal copies.

Honestly, talk about making assumptions!

To me, most of what you have posted are H&S issues. I can't believe you think that DJs should be considering harmonies and beat mixing for a kids Halloween party.

To me it just sounds like he is doing a cheap kids disco, needs to sort his cables out, learn where the volume is and learn how to use the mic.

I'm not sure why you are astonished really? He charged £40.00.

[Ryu]

:agree:

I doubt the children would be heading off thinking "Jeez, the DJ didn't harmonise his Cha Cha slide mix very well"....

You could also argue that, despite his H and S issues, Having the speakers on the floor is arguably safer than tripoded ones, especially with youngsters barrelling around.

[JAMdisco]

I have offered to do it for them for free for next year. They didn't know I dj'd so hadn't asked.
Lee

So they are going from 40 Quid Fred to Free Lee

You say that he was giving a bad perception of DJ's but doing it for free could do mare harm than good IMO... What about next year and the year after that etc... Will you do it for free every year as that's what they'll come to expect.

Not very good business tactics to me!

And I have to agree with Ryu, speakers on the floor aren't necessarily a bad thing for kids disco's for the reason he said.

You also need to bear in mind, he may have just started out - I know my rig wasn't up to much in the early days but this forum helped me understand the importance of... well... everything really - including a nice tidy set up. I think this forum has definitely helped me to be able to increase my prices and get more bookings. Why not point him in the direction of this forum? Or maybe you really don't want the competition?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

So they are going from 40 Quid Fred to Free Lee



:lol:

[NKR]

I am doing my sons school Halloween Party for free on Sunday too.

I am on the PTA and the ticket sales go to the school funds. If I can help out I will. Lee is doing the same.

Honestly folks I know charity starts at home, but anything that can put extra funds into your childs school has to be good. I know we pay tax, etc, but I am still willing to offer my services for free whilst my son is at the school and I am available.

[DiscoMagic]

I do several school disco / kids parties and nearly alway put the speakers on the floor - because of the trip hazard, and with kids you have to extra careful.

Cables of course need to be safe and out the way, and whilst their problably wont be the need for immaculate cable tidying like one would with a Wedding, there is no excuse for shoddy presentation.

Music selection aside, what lights / speakers / equipment did he use? was it really all Craplins or was there any decent stuff amongst his set up.

Regarding the music though, I agree with Darren in terms that kids are not bothered in terms of harmonies and beat matching, but I do think a little effort can be made especially when you consider childeren have very little attention span and can't usually cope with a full three minute length song before they get bored... and effective beat mixing (or even fade mixing) at the right point would keep the kids on the floor for longer.

I do understand why Lee offered to do the next one free though - I imagine it is simply a case of "Let me show you what a real and proper DJ can do!" I would do the same - especially if my children attended the school. :)

[JAMdisco]

I am doing my sons school Halloween Party for free on Sunday too.

I am on the PTA and the ticket sales go to the school funds. If I can help out I will. Lee is doing the same.

Honestly folks I know charity starts at home, but anything that can put extra funds into your childs school has to be good. I know we pay tax, etc, but I am still willing to offer my services for free whilst my son is at the school and I am available.

I've done my fair share of freebies - the charity shop that my mum was manageress of have done some cat-walk type fashion shows for the public, I've done music & lights for free on a few occasions. I also did my step-daughters 21st birthday and my daughter's 14th birthday for free but if my daughters school wanted a disco I would charge them a fee (maybe a little reduced but definitely not fro free).

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I am doing my sons school Halloween Party for free on Sunday too.

I am on the PTA and the ticket sales go to the school funds. If I can help out I will. Lee is doing the same.



Really?

In the context of the thread it came over to me that he wanted to show the school what a 'proper' disco should be like.

If it was the case, why didn't he just say that he wanted to help them out and would be doing it for free.

[yourdj]

For £40 what would you expect. He is cheap because he knows he is crap.
The answer is were the kids dancing and having fun?? If yes then thats a cheap disco and fits the bill as far as the school are concerned.

Maybe in a couple of years he will be much better with better kit and give you a run for your money :D

Looks like he is very due diligent in the marketing department.

[DeckstarDeluxe]

Question comes down to what the kids were doing. Granted with loud music that is going to annoy most as their hearing will be more sensitive to ours.

[NKR]

I've done my fair share of freebies - the charity shop that my mum was manageress of have done some cat-walk type fashion shows for the public, I've done music & lights for free on a few occasions. I also did my step-daughters 21st birthday and my daughter's 14th birthday for free but if my daughters school wanted a disco I would charge them a fee (maybe a little reduced but definitely not fro free).

Maybe I just believe in the old community spirit and make use of my skills to help with the fund raising. I do a few freebies a year these days and all are kids or youn adults based parties.

Maybe I am just soft in the head, but I believe if I can keep the cost down for these events it means more kids can go (particularly where they are charity funded) and regardless of economic conditions, etc, etc, kids deserve the best childhood they can get.

No I am not going to save the world, but if i can add something to some kids lives then that is reward enough for me. These are community based things and I like my place in the community.

[WWDJ]

For £40 what would you expect. He is cheap because he knows he is crap.
The answer is were the kids dancing and having fun?? If yes then thats a cheap disco and fits the bill as far as the school are concerned.

Maybe in a couple of years he will be much better with better kit and give you a run for your money :D

Looks like he is very due diligent in the marketing department.

... or perhaps he is doing it at cost so the school can maximise their funds. I look after local charities in the same way at my own discretion.


Maybe I just believe in the old community spirit and make use of my skills to help with the fund raising. I do a few freebies a year these days and all are kids or youn adults based parties.

Maybe I am just soft in the head, but I believe if I can keep the cost down for these events it means more kids can go (particularly where they are charity funded) and regardless of economic conditions, etc, etc, kids deserve the best childhood they can get.

No I am not going to save the world, but if i can add something to some kids lives then that is reward enough for me. These are community based things and I like my place in the community.

Completely agree. I'm 41, I've worked hard to get what I've got, but by the same token, not as hard as some work for a lot less. Time to give something back ... at my own discretion.


Question comes down to what the kids were doing. Granted with loud music that is going to annoy most as their hearing will be more sensitive to ours.

It is for sure, so no need to have it too loud. Any distorted sound is bad for all ages though.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Maybe I just believe in the old community spirit and make use of my skills to help with the fund raising. I do a few freebies a year these days and all are kids or youn adults based parties.

Maybe I am just soft in the head, but I believe if I can keep the cost down for these events it means more kids can go (particularly where they are charity funded) and regardless of economic conditions, etc, etc, kids deserve the best childhood they can get.

No I am not going to save the world, but if i can add something to some kids lives then that is reward enough for me. These are community based things and I like my place in the community.

Here's the thing. I don't do freebies for schools - I do them cheaper, almost at cost, so I don't lose money. I couldn't afford to do that as a full time business.

However, before you start waving the 'putting stuff back in the community' flag, other people maybe doing their bit, but in other ways.

I was a trustee on a kids charity for 4 years, was a parent governor for 5 years and ran 3 footy teams for 5 years for example. I'm guessing that equates to more than a free disco? ;)

[NKR]

Here's the thing. I don't do freebies for schools - I do them cheaper, almost at cost, so I don't lose money. I couldn't afford to do that as a full time business.

However, before you start waving the 'putting stuff back in the community' flag, other people maybe doing their bit, but in other ways.

I was a trustee on a kids charity for 4 years, was a parent governor for 5 years and ran 3 footy teams for 5 years for example. I'm guessing that equates to more than a free disco? ;)

Darren my original note of Freebies was in reponse to post 4, although quoting it would have cleared that up so my bad.

Who incidentally after telling us all how business bad it was in post 4, then says in post 8 how they do it too :confused:

Its my random posting that seems to get me into cross purposes with people I guess and should make clear which post I am responding to.

Darren I do plenty more than free disco's too, but as I don't live off it I can do it.

No beef with you on this Darren, it was other posts I was picking up on and then I appeared to get onto cross purposes with you again.

[DeckstarDeluxe]

I think if I had my child at a certain school I would be very keen to do it myself (as long as it didn't interfere with "proper" paid gigs). If my fee would take money more or less directly out of the schools fund I'm not sure I would charge.

Of course I don't have kids so not concrete in my ideas on that.

[Ryu]

I DO do Childrens Disco's at my own Daughters school, at an agreed favourable rate, My Wife is part of the Parents association and it works well alround...we get additional work through referral, the school have a DJ they can trust and the party nights are almost always Thursdays, which suits me just fine!

[Shaun]

I did a School disco (approx 8 times a year) for next to nothing for years. NEVER AGAIN. I won't go into to it to much on the open forum but when I did eventually raise prices a little (it was still less than my normal fee). I got a very nice thank you from the Parent Council. Well, the thank you was non existant, but they did mention in the School Newsletter to parents that they may have to cancel the upcoming discos as the DJ was rasing their prices. They were even nice enough to mention my business name in the newsletter. :mad: :mad: :mad:


I'll never offer a discount again.

[JAMdisco]

Darren my original note of Freebies was in reponse to post 4, although quoting it would have cleared that up so my bad.

Who incidentally after telling us all how business bad it was in post 4, then says in post 8 how they do it too :confused:

I wasn't contradicting myself, I did the free one for my mum because (a) it was for my mum and (b) because it was for charity.

I did my daughter's disco's for free because it was their birthday present...

I also said that if it was for the school I would reduce the fee slightly but not do it for free!

Clear now?

Incidentally, if the charity one was for another charity I'd charge to cover expenses (as i did a few months ago) so long as it didn't interfere with normal paid gigs (i.e. if was free on that night)

[NKR]

I wasn't contradicting myself, I did the free one for my mum because (a) it was for my mum and (b) because it was for charity.

I did my daughter's disco's for free because it was their birthday present...

I also said that if it was for the school I would reduce the fee slightly but not do it for free!

Clear now?

Lee is doing his sons school disco for free - you said it was bad business sense.
I am doing my sons school disco for free - I would assume same applies.

you do free ones for your familly and charity. So why is the school bad business sense when it involves a family member and its for school funds (ie charitable donation). Its in post 4.

No clearer to me. Well it is slightly but I am being obtuse for obtuse sake.

Oh by the way any expenses are still tax deductable through our accounts.

Also I would need to check with an accountant on this one, but when doing free or reduced charity work it may be that the fee you would normally have charged is effectively a charitable donation and may be eligible to tax relief (Can anyone shed any light on that one). I would assume the party receiving the benefit would need to be a registered charity.

[Excalibur]

Whatever the fee, whatever the recipient, let's not forget that a bad disco is a bad disco. Being free doesn't make it good value. And also a slightly reduced, vastly reduced, or zero fee is no excuse to put out a second rate show.

Wow, that was a bit serious, I'd better wander off and be silly somewhere else, to balance it up. :D :D

[NKR]

Whatever the fee, whatever the recipient, let's not forget that a bad disco is a bad disco. Being free doesn't make it good value. And also a slightly reduced, vastly reduced, or zero fee is no excuse to put out a second rate show.

Wow, that was a bit serious, I'd better wander off and be silly somewhere else, to balance it up. :D :D

I've callled NHS direct and directed them to this post. They are very concerned and may have to conduct some research on you.

[DJ Paulie]

I've callled NHS direct and directed them to this post. They are very concerned and may have to conduct some research on you.

:daft: :clap:

[ppentertainments]

They didn't know I dj'd so hadn't asked.

So instead of worrying about other people (who charge £40 more than you at present ;) ) you will be spending the day working out which areas of your marketing strategy is failing, when even your own son's school are unaware of your talents. :)

[Shakermaker Promotions]

Toby, you really have a way with words mate.
"£40.00 because he knows he's crap..."
What's that all about?

There's a guy who lives down the road from me that used to DJ quite regularly. He gave it up many moons ago due to ill health and he doesn't work anymore either. He does the School Discos for the school that my nephew attends and he does them for petrol money. He doesn't have any kids either.
I went to one a while back to pick up my nephew and got talking to the guy. I didn't actually see him perform as I went at the end. I saw his gear and it was a bit messy but every single one of the kids that were coming out to meet their parents were smiling and talking about it.

I take it that he must have been crap though eh because he charged them petrol money?

I don't have kids as yet but if my nephew's school approached me, I would do it cheap...not that cheap but as Darren says, cost price.

[Ryu]

How long was the gig anyways? If it was just the hour it might not be so cheap!!

[leelive]

Ok I'll try and give the guy some slack.

He did it for peanuts. He is new. He used basic gear from maplins. I suppose we all have to start somewhere. The ad-board was Tacky not classy.

He need to learn how to EQ a room or turn down the high-frequencies when belting out music at high levels. Not nice. It would have helped if the speakers were not at the ear level of the kids! My 2 year old couldn't stand it. And she has been to several "Baby Loves Disco" parties.

I now just want to help my kids school. He is only in nursery class for a few hours each morning. Not yet at the main Primary. No involvement with PTA etc. I don't advertise for School discos or kids parties and wouldn't do them .. besides I would be too expensive for them to hire... (starting prices £300) so they would not have known about me in that market. It's my kids school so it comes under the charitable work I do each year. Not going to do them for everyone.

May be I will ask him to join this forum. Knowing the competition will make him healthy!!

Lee

[soundtracker]

I did a School disco (approx 8 times a year) for next to nothing for years. NEVER AGAIN. I won't go into to it to much on the open forum but when I did eventually raise prices a little (it was still less than my normal fee). I got a very nice thank you from the Parent Council. Well, the thank you was non existant, but they did mention in the School Newsletter to parents that they may have to cancel the upcoming discos as the DJ was rasing their prices. They were even nice enough to mention my business name in the newsletter. :mad: :mad: :mad:


I'll never offer a discount again.

Funnily enough I had a similar experience, my neighbour was Chairman of the PTA, so I did him a really good deal, it was only an hour and a half on a Wednesday. Then his kids left for big school, the new chairman kept booking me for a while, then just stopped making contact. I phoned him to find out details of the halloween gig as it was only a week away, but got no response, So I phoned the school, and was told that they had booked someone else much cheaper! This was a bit of a surprise as I was giving it away nearly! At the end of the summer term did a leavers party organised by the parents at the local village hall, (the day before the school one!) as the kids don't like the new guy! Anyway during the summer, had a call from the NEW chairwoman, looking for a disco,so quoted double my old rate, they didn't pursue it, but on the grapevine I hear that numbers have dropped right off - serves em right!

[Mark Wild]

I can't believe any DJ doing a nursery disco for 2 year olds wouldn't bother to take the harmonics of each track into consideration, I mean, seriously, what a cowboy. He ought to be strung up by the goolies.

[NKR]

I can't believe any DJ doing a nursery disco for 2 year olds wouldn't bother to take the harmonics of each track into consideration, I mean, seriously, what a cowboy. He ought to be strung up by the goolies.

Probably difficult for 2 year olds. However they tried running under his legs and the same effect was had. :D

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I can't believe any DJ doing a nursery disco for 2 year olds wouldn't bother to take the harmonics of each track into consideration, I mean, seriously, what a cowboy. He ought to be strung up by the goolies.

<Makes note to use the word 'goolies' more often>

:D

[leelive]

I can't believe any DJ doing a nursery disco for 2 year olds wouldn't bother to take the harmonics of each track into consideration, I mean, seriously, what a cowboy. He ought to be strung up by the goolies.

Yes, and balls to that.
Lee

[Megamix]

a friend of mine is an excellent DJ and works for fairly low rates at the moment - if he charged more, it wouldn't make him any better - and I guess that's the same for this guy.

[Pink Elephant]

No it wouldn't make him better - but it would earn him more money?!

Now he could use some of that extra money to enhance his skill level with training, networking and dare I say maybe even buy more/other equipment.

This WOULD make him better.

[chrisj]

a friend of mine is an excellent DJ and works for fairly low rates at the moment - if he charged more, it wouldn't make him any better - and I guess that's the same for this guy.

If your friend charged more he may not get so much work therefore he may earn the same amount of money. I have turned down so many Friday gigs that wouldn't pay £200 or even £180 but if I had been £160 or maybe a bit less I would have been working.

As for local schools, I have sent mail shots to over 100 first and primary schools and received one reply asking if I could beat their local disco that was £60 for 2 hrs. It would cost me £10 for travel so I said NO.
School discos are usually run by the PTA and I do not know the members though I do ask for my letters to be forwarded to them.

[StarZSoundS]

I think there is a huge untapped market for Discos at Schools.....


I'm not sure how to tap into it....and i'm not sure if I want to!!Too busy elsewhere....

[Jonathan Ford]

I did a local primary school for a few years, but binned it off last autumn as it just didn't pay enough. As a part-timer, I find these gigs to be a pain because they're very often a really early start, say 1730, and are a nightmare to get to after work (especially as I work 40 miles from home).

[DJ Paulie]

I was looking on Dublin Gumtree last night and saw a lot of 'DJs' offering gigs for €80 to €150 for 4hr gigs, less than what I charge. Now I'm not saying they're less experienced, have worse gear or collection of songs, but if you were looking at those prices, then called me and I said 4230 for 4hrs including travel, set up and break down, who would you choose if you were going purely on price ?

These guys are probably doing it so low because they have tried getting higher rates but undercut, so maybe a case of 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em' I was actually thinking would I rather have one gig a month at €230 or 8 (fri & sat) at €130 ?

[MikeW]

I think there is a huge untapped market for Discos at Schools.....


I'm not sure how to tap into it....and i'm not sure if I want to!!Too busy elsewhere....

I did a local school disco last night (really good night, 2 x 150 kids over 2 hours). I really only did it on a Friday because of a cancelation elswhere.

One of the parent commitee mothers came along before I started and asked where she could buy cheap disco lighting, as they were thinking of buying some to allow them to do the kids discos themselves (with the help of some of the older pupils):eek: (everyone is at it!)

[Dynamic Entertainment]

I was looking on Dublin Gumtree last night and saw a lot of 'DJs' offering gigs for €80 to €150 for 4hr gigs, less than what I charge. Now I'm not saying they're less experienced, have worse gear or collection of songs, but if you were looking at those prices, then called me and I said 4230 for 4hrs including travel, set up and break down, who would you choose if you were going purely on price ?

These guys are probably doing it so low because they have tried getting higher rates but undercut, so maybe a case of 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em' I was actually thinking would I rather have one gig a month at €230 or 8 (fri & sat) at €130 ?

4230...:eek:....with them prices, no wonder you aint getting the work ;) :D

[katman]

One of the parent commitee mothers came along before I started and asked where she could buy cheap disco lighting, as they were thinking of buying some to allow them to do the kids discos themselves (with the help of some of the older pupils):eek: (everyone is at it!)

When my son was at first school they used to have two or three discos per year and a mate of mine did them. He does quite a lot of schools and last year when I recommended hime to someone for a kids Christmas party he was unable to do it because he was fully booked.

My son has moved up to middle school this term and last week was their Halloween disco. When I went to collect him I was expecting to see Kev and have a chat with him but it was not to be. The teachers had got a couple of Craplin disco lights and did the disco themselves.

I asked my son if they had played Monster Mash or Ghostbusters and he said NO. :(

[DJ Paulie]

4230...:eek:....with them prices, no wonder you aint getting the work ;) :D

Damn ! Forgot to press AltGr ! I meant €230 obviously - mind you that fee would be nice :)

[DJ Paulie]

I asked my son if they had played Monster Mash or Ghostbusters and he said NO. :(

Shocking ! :omg: