QSC K12.

[Matty12]

Hi there

Hope your all ok!

Yes its another question about speakers! :D

Ok I'm thinking about going the active route and I was thinking about qsc k12. One question If I didn't use subs with them, is there enough bass in the k12 in deep mode for parties? if so, what size room / people? :beer1:

Thanks, ;)

Matt. :p

[MikeW]

Hi there

Hope your all ok!

Yes its another question about speakers! :D

Ok I'm thinking about going the active route and I was thinking about qsc k12. One question If I didn't use subs with them, is there enough bass in the k12 in deep mode for parties? if so, what size room / people? :beer1:

Thanks, ;)

Matt. :p
Hi Matt

I bought a pair of K12s about six months ago. I am very impressed with them.
I have used them for functions up to approx 150 people, and I think they would be ok for another 20 or so, although it depends on the size of the function room.
I moved from Mackie 450s to the K12s and IMO they have loads more bass.

For the size and weight, they are brilliant.

Mike

[Matty12]

Hi Matt

I bought a pair of K12s about six months ago. I am very impressed with them.
I have used them for functions up to approx 150 people, and I think they would be ok for another 20 or so, although it depends on the size of the function room.
I moved from Mackie 450s to the K12s and IMO they have loads more bass.

For the size and weight, they are brilliant.

Mike

Without bass?

COOOL!!!! :)

[sweetie]

yeah, plenty for 150 in a small to medium size venue

[Matty12]

yeah, plenty for 150 in a small to medium size venue

What about a school disco with 100 children?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

zzzzzzzzz

Are you actually going to buy speakers or just talk about them for the next 2 years? :sj:

[Matty12]

zzzzzzzzz

Are you actually going to buy speakers or just talk about them for the next 2 years? :sj:

Yes! in 2 years time! :D

No very soon. :)

[sweetie]

What about a school disco with 100 children?

well, 100 < 150 so definitely! lol at darren....

[Corabar Entertainment]

well, 100 < 150 so definitely! He didn't say how big the hall was though.....


...100 in a hall that holds a thousand? :whistle:

[Supreme Soundz]

hell yeah ive the k10 plenty of boom

[Corabar Steve]

Here's an idea, see if it works.

Why not pop to your local disco equipment emporium & have a listen to what's on offer.


THEN MAKE YOUR OWN MIND UP & STOP WASTING OUR TIME!

[SC Events]

Is your lack of caffein getting to you Steve lol? :D

[Excalibur]

Here's an idea, see if it works.

Why not pop to your local disco equipment emporium & have a listen to what's on offer.


THEN MAKE YOUR OWN MIND UP & STOP WASTING OUR TIME!

Loath as I am to pour cold water on such a stunningly and beautifully simple and logical idea, if the few remaining brain cells serve me correctly, I believe we've had that before. Post #24 seems to ring bells. :D :D

http://www.forum.mobilediscodirectory.co.uk/showthread.php?t=32160&highlight=electromusic

According to post #1, we may also have had somewhat of a volte face.



PS: I DO NOT WANT ACTIVE.

[Corabar Steve]

Regardless, with sound being such a subjective thing, using his own ears is preferable to trying to sift through our many & varied opinions.




Plus it wouldn't cutter up the forum with what is essentially the same thread again & again :sj:

[Matty12]

Can't a man change his mind? Like all other men! :D

[Excalibur]

Regardless, with sound being such a subjective thing, using his own ears is preferable to trying to sift through our many & varied opinions.
A point made, often with colour and underlining, in posts 13, 16, 21,23,33 and 36 in the thread linked to.

While our suggestions may provide pointers as to what someone might place on the shortlist, the only sensible option is to make your choice with your ears, not your eyes.

[funkymook]

If you apply a few criteria then a short list naturally creates itself.
Matthew please fill in the following and leave blank any you where you have no preference and feel free to add to the list as well if you have further criteria.

Budget
Type of event
Number of guests
Type of music
Powered or non-powered
Wood or plastic
Who is setting them up
What transport do you have
When do you need them by

The more you can answer the more you'll narrow down your options.
I'd guess in reality, and keeping to known, quality makes and spending all or near your budget you actually only have 3 or 4 likely options - any of which would do the job extremely well Then it's just a matter of concentrating your efforts in getting to hear them.

[Excalibur]

Aw come on Martin, now you're applying logic to the process. :D

Everything that Martin has posted is absolutely spot on there.

While I haven't heard the QSC K series, I see that they have a lot of onboard signal processing, and thus may be able to achieve the characteristics of larger cabs by this method, ( thus making the following rule irrelevant ) as a general rule, I would follow this rule if possible:

If you intend to use only one pair of cabs at most if not all of your gigs, then I'd recommend 15" cabs. If you intend to use subs regularly, then I'd go for 12" tops.

Of course, if you can't lift the 15" ones, or get them in the vehicle, then you ignore it, and return to Martin's excellent list.

[Matty12]

Budget
Type of event
Number of guests
Type of music
Powered or non-powered
Wood or plastic
Who is setting them up
What transport do you have
When do you need them by



Budget: £1800 for just the tops and more money if a got bass bins
Type of event: All rounder, wedding birthday parties, 21s, 18s, 40s so on
Number of guests: Up to 150 just tops and about 300 with bass bins
Type of music: Disco chart rock hip hop all really.
Powered or non-powered: Active
Wood or plastic: Don't mind
Who is setting them up: me
What transport do you have: Transit van
When do you need them by: Soon

I would like to use just the tops for up to 120 people and then add in bass bins. ;) :)

[funkymook]

Budget: £1800 for just the tops and more money if a got bass bins
Type of event: All rounder, wedding birthday parties, 21s, 18s, 40s so on
Number of guests: Up to 150 just tops and about 300 with bass bins
Type of music: Disco chart rock hip hop all really.
Powered or non-powered: Active
Wood or plastic: Don't mind
Who is setting them up: me
What transport do you have: Transit van
When do you need them by: Soon

I would like to use just the tops for up to 120 people and then add in bass bins. ;) :)

OK Matthew - we've got some good info to work on now.

First thing I pick up on is the setting up - you say 'me'. Can you elaborate please. Are you going to be loading, unloading, putting speakers on and off stands totally by yourself?

[Matty12]

OK Matthew - we've got some good info to work on now.

First thing I pick up on is the setting up - you say 'me'. Can you elaborate please. Are you going to be loading, unloading, putting speakers on and off stands totally by yourself?

Most of the time yes.

[funkymook]

Most of the time yes.

OK - and just to gauge what you can comfortably handle - what speakers have you done this with on a regular basis in the past? Any speakers you've struggled with and thought were a bit too heavy?

[Matty12]

OK - and just to gauge what you can comfortably handle - what speakers have you done this with on a regular basis in the past? Any speakers you've struggled with and thought were a bit too heavy?

Well all I've done is lift 33kg 15inch speaker but not on stand.

[funkymook]

Well all I've done is lift 33kg 15inch speaker but not on stand.

I'm talking about gig situations Matthew, I can lift a 60kg bass bin, I can't walk with it though! And at 2am in the morning when you've got outside venue steps to go down and it's raining believe me weight becomes very important if you're on your own.

So have you ever put any speakers on speaker stands by yourself?
If so, which ones? (If not that's not an issue :) )

[Matty12]

I'm talking about gig situations Matthew, I can lift a 60kg bass bin, I can't walk with it though! And at 2am in the morning when you've got outside venue steps to go down and it's raining believe me weight becomes very important if you're on your own.

So have you ever put any speakers on speaker stands by yourself?
If so, which ones? (If not that's not an issue :) )

No I have never put speakers on a stand. ;)

[sweetie]

The QSC k10 might be better than the K12 as they're lighter. supposed to be a better sound too.

[funkymook]

No I have never put speakers on a stand. ;)

OK - and you're definitely going to be setting up on your own most of the time? No one helping you load/unload the vehicle, carry in/out, getting lighting on overheads etc?

I'm not the strongest person around, but I bet I'm stronger than you! And I find even a fairly small rig can be an effort sometimes with awkward access, stairs etc.

I'm sure we could work out a really good lightweight option if that's what's really needed, but I'm not going to go down that track if you actually have someone helping you do the heavy work at every gig.

I take it your not driving yourself there - so who else is going to be with you?

[Matty12]

OK - and you're definitely going to be setting up on your own most of the time? No one helping you load/unload the vehicle, carry in/out, getting lighting on overheads etc?

I'm not the strongest person around, but I bet I'm stronger than you! And I find even a fairly small rig can be an effort sometimes with awkward access, stairs etc.

I'm sure we could work out a really good lightweight option if that's what's really needed, but I'm not going to go down that track if you actually have someone helping you do the heavy work at every gig.

I take it your not driving yourself there - so who else is going to be with you?

My mum drives me to the gigs and she helps me unload however I do all the sound and my mum does the lighting as it is easier for her so really no more the 23kg for the tops.

PS: I'm stronger then my mum but we need a lightweight system because when I'm older I'll be driving.

[funkymook]

My mum drives me to the gigs and she helps me unload however I do all the sound and my mum does the lighting as it is easier for her so really no more the 23kg for the tops.

PS: I'm stronger then my mum but we need a lightweight system because when I'm older I'll be driving.

Seriously Matthew - 23kg is a real lump to get on stands. It's not just the weight but the ease of lift you have to think about (some speakers can weigh exactly the same but be much more awkward to to handle position and weight distribution).

I'd make life easy and go for the lightest, decent speakers you can.

Have a look at the DB Technologies 605D's - 15" (so won't need a bass bin for 99.9% of gigs) and only 12.5kg.

I'd also seriously look at the Bose systems - sounds like you have the budget for them, and a lot of very good DJ's use them for big parties. I know there are people who don't like them as well but I think you should have a listen and make your own mind up about them.

[Charlie Brown]

I'd also seriously look at the Bose systems - sounds like you have the budget for them, and a lot of very good DJ's use them for big parties.

:agree:

Something like that would be perfect for you! :beer1:

Are you sure you want to spend £1800+ on some speakers? I thought your website was priority? What speakers are you using at the moment?

[Excalibur]

Have a look at the DB Technologies 605D's - 15" (so won't need a bass bin for 99.9% of gigs) and only 12.5kg.
.

According to those figures, ( which I have just read on the website ) they've got to be on your shortlist. I've just checked what Electromusic have in stock, and according to their website, it might be worth a phone call, and a ride out, as I remember from last time, they're about as near as anyone to you.

[Matty12]

According to those figures, ( which I have just read on the website ) they've got to be on your shortlist. I've just checked what Electromusic have in stock, and according to their website, it might be worth a phone call, and a ride out, as I remember from last time, they're about as near as anyone to you.

I am next Monday just wanted some opines. :)





Are you sure you want to spend £1800+ on some speakers? I thought your website was priority? What speakers are you using at the moment?

The website is a priority but also speakers need to be a priority too. :)

PS: website up in February. ;)


Seriously Matthew - 23kg is a real lump to get on stands. It's not just the weight but the ease of lift you have to think about (some speakers can weigh exactly the same but be much more awkward to to handle position and weight distribution).

I'd make life easy and go for the lightest, decent speakers you can.

Have a look at the DB Technologies 605D's - 15" (so won't need a bass bin for 99.9% of gigs) and only 12.5kg.

I'd also seriously look at the Bose systems - sounds like you have the budget for them, and a lot of very good DJ's use them for big parties. I know there are people who don't like them as well but I think you should have a listen and make your own mind up about them.

Thanks that good to know,

I'll have a look at DB and bose as well. ;) :)

[funkymook]

I am next Monday just wanted some opines. :)


When you're there ask to carry any speakers you're interested in from one end of the shop to the other and put them up onto stands and back down again. Just feeling the weight for a couple of seconds while standing still is absolutely no indication you can set them up safely - even 12.5kg can do your back damage if they're an awkward lift.

[Matty12]

Thanks will


When you're there ask to carry any speakers you're interested in from one end of the shop to the other and put them up onto stands and back down again. Just feeling the weight for a couple of seconds while standing still is absolutely no indication you can set them up safely - even 12.5kg can do your back damage if they're an awkward lift.

Been looking at some reviews and they say that the qsc k12s get distorted at high volumes, is this true?

Ps: and mainly with live band / microphone?

[funkymook]

Thanks will



Been looking at some reviews and they say that the qsc k12s get distorted at high volumes, is this true?

Ps: and mainly with live band / microphone?

Mine never have - and I've given them a lot of bass heavy stuff.

I think I've seen the limiter light go on once or twice and they weren't sounding distorted - in fact you'd have real problems getting them to distort because of the limiter kicking in anyway.

At the price level you're looking at Matthew, any quality brand of speaker will do what you want. You can endlessly read reviews but to be honest for your needs there's very little in it.

I'd short-list lightweight (less than 17kg) powered speakers from the likes of RCF, EV, FBT, QSC etc. And then go and listen to them, carry them around, put them on stand etc.

There's only so much you can ask on a forum before you have to go and find out for yourself.

[Matty12]

Hi just want to ask a question because we could not have them that loud in the shop does a ksub give you a thump in the chest or not? (one / two subs.) :)

[sweetie]

Hi just want to ask a question because we could not have them that loud in the shop does a ksub give you a thump in the chest or not? (one / two subs.) :)

no. general consensus is that they are a bit lacking. Stick with rcf/dbtech for active subs

[Matty12]

no. general consensus is that they are a bit lacking. Stick with rcf/dbtech for active subs

Have you listen too them? and what about EV ELX 118? :)

[funkymook]

Hi just want to ask a question because we could not have them that loud in the shop does a ksub give you a thump in the chest or not? (one / two subs.) :)

Matthew - have you ever been in a club or an event where you get a 'thump in the chest' from the bass? Or is it something you've read about and think you need? A lot of people would actually find that level of bass uncomfortable, especially at family functions.

Although it's great having subs in your system in all honesty I think you'd be fine with the K12's for your gigs.

I've done plenty of gigs with just my K12's and no one ever complained about the sound not being loud or bassy enough.

Personally I'd advise you to go with the K12's without a sub, see how you get on with them and after a few gigs decide if you really need the extra bass and want the extra loading in and out you also get with them.

If you did I'd say pretty much the only choice for you are the RCF902's for the weight and being able to hold their own against the K12's - you certainly don't want to be lugging anything heavier around.

[Matty12]

Matthew - have you ever been in a club or an event where you get a 'thump in the chest' from the bass? Or is it something you've read about and think you need? A lot of people would actually find that level of bass uncomfortable, especially at family functions.

Although it's great having subs in your system in all honesty I think you'd be fine with the K12's for your gigs.

I've done plenty of gigs with just my K12's and no one ever complained about the sound not being loud or bassy enough.

Personally I'd advise you to go with the K12's without a sub, see how you get on with them and after a few gigs decide if you really need the extra bass and want the extra loading in and out you also get with them.

If you did I'd say pretty much the only choice for you are the RCF902's for the weight and being able to hold their own against the K12's - you certainly don't want to be lugging anything heavier around.

At bpm yes :), I don't want a really big thumb but maybe just a little feeling somehow. When they were testing them they said that they where at 0db so can they go louder then that?

[funkymook]

At bpm yes :), I don't want a really big thumb but maybe just a little feeling somehow. When they were testing them they said that they where at 0db so can they go louder then that?

Go for the 902's then. A few people on here use them, do a search and I'm sure you'll find a few posts about them.

No idea if they'll go any louder as I wasn't there to hear them - but mine have been loud enough for every gig I've ever done. Any difference in maximum volume between them and similar cabs is going to be irrelevant to you for all intents and purposes.

Any preference for other speakers should be on personal preference rather than their written specifications. Don't get bogged down with reading about them - go and listen (and pick up) a few more and go with what you like the best. I can guarantee whatever you choose at this price level will be a good choice and do what you need.

[Supreme Soundz]

the k sub does add a bit of boom to the qsc's I use 2 k10's I much prefer the sound same frequency response same amp module but smaller and have a wider dispersion, filled the floor better and still good throw they won me over the 12's

[MikeW]

Matthew - have you ever been in a club or an event where you get a 'thump in the chest' from the bass? Or is it something you've read about and think you need? A lot of people would actually find that level of bass uncomfortable, especially at family functions.

Although it's great having subs in your system in all honesty I think you'd be fine with the K12's for your gigs.

I've done plenty of gigs with just my K12's and no one ever complained about the sound not being loud or bassy enough.

Personally I'd advise you to go with the K12's without a sub, see how you get on with them and after a few gigs decide if you really need the extra bass and want the extra loading in and out you also get with them.

If you did I'd say pretty much the only choice for you are the RCF902's for the weight and being able to hold their own against the K12's - you certainly don't want to be lugging anything heavier around.

Mathew, I would agree with all of the above, although I use the RCF905 sub.
But as has been said, IMO start with the K12s.

[funkymook]

Mathew, I would agree with all of the above, although I use the RCF905 sub.
But as has been said, IMO start with the K12s.

I was looking at saving as much weight as possible for Matthew - but on checking there's only a couple of kg between the 902 and 905 so either would be a good choice (again get in a shop and lift and carry one - and get a decent trolley!)

[MikeW]

I was looking at saving as much weight as possible for Matthew - but on checking there's only a couple of kg between the 902 and 905 so either would be a good choice (again get in a shop and lift and carry one - and get a decent trolley!)

For the minimal extra weight, I decided on the 905 which has a 15 inch driver rather than 12 inch. But I am sure the 12 inch is very good as well.

[CRAZY K]

Thanks will



Been looking at some reviews and they say that the qsc k12s get distorted at high volumes, is this true?

Ps: and mainly with live band / microphone?


If you overdrive beyond the capacity of the amp/speaker it will distort.

Simple.

High volume thats meaningless.

Distortion with Bands--Thats because most Bands are sound freaks and play way too loud.

At least as a DJ you can listen, detect hear and see overdriving--pretty dancing red lights etc.

I listened to a Disco last week at a big Club in Oxford with a massive system 5k plus system--that was distorting.:confused:

Stupid DJ over driving it.

All very simple really;)

Use your hearing to decide, ideally you want to have a test at a real venue with a crowd ---which sounds different to a Disco showroom;)

[WWDJ]

If you overdrive beyond the capacity of the amp/speaker it will distort.

Simple.

High volume thats meaningless.

Distortion with Bands--Thats because most Bands are sound freaks and play way too loud.

At least as a DJ you can listen, detect hear and see overdriving--pretty dancing red lights etc.

I listened to a Disco last week at a big Club in Oxford with a massive system 5k plus system--that was distorting.:confused:

Stupid DJ over driving it.

All very simple really;)

Use your hearing to decide, ideally you want to have a test at a real venue with a crowd ---which sounds different to a Disco showroom;)

Lol, which club? Pm me if you don't want to say.

[CRAZY K]

Lol, which club? Pm me if you don't want to say.

02 in Cowley, im sure you know it.;)

Excellent atmosphere, lighting, sound etc music very loud and distorting at times---it wasnt until I heard Billie Jean distorting that I realised the problem.

Considering the huge Sound System seemed a shame.

I dont think the students noticed--:rolleyes:

DJ did a good job working the crowd but obviously took his eyes off the warning lights:daft:

Talk about ears ringing :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

[Matty12]

Thanks guys, :)

Just want to ask another question but don't want to open a new thread,

Do they do a speaker stand where you can fit two 12inch tops on one stand, a bit like the LD system pole where they have a t bar and two pointy bits but with a tripod at the bottom? do they do them? ;)

Like this pole but with three legs at the bottom,

[Charlie Brown]

http://www.forum.mobilediscodirectory.co.uk/showthread.php?t=37022 ?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Just buy one of these (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/35mm-Dual-Double-Speaker-Tripod-Pole-Mount-T-bar-Bracket-Adapter-Attachment-1M-/120786694883?pt=UK_ConsumerElectronics_EquipmentSt ands_SM&hash=item1c1f72b2e3) and put it on top of a tripod, making sure you have the correct diameter of stand with the correct weight limit.

[Matty12]

A bit like this but stronger, ;)

http://www.voltelectronics.co.nz/audio-video/speakers-and-accessories/speaker-accessories/2-way-speaker-stand-adaptor.html

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Just buy one of these (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/35mm-Dual-Double-Speaker-Tripod-Pole-Mount-T-bar-Bracket-Adapter-Attachment-1M-/120786694883?pt=UK_ConsumerElectronics_EquipmentSt ands_SM&hash=item1c1f72b2e3) and put it on top of a tripod, making sure you have the correct diameter of stand with the correct weight limit.

And that only takes 2 x 10Kg, so make sure you get something with the right weight limit.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

This is better but stronger, ;)

http://www.voltelectronics.co.nz/audio-video/speakers-and-accessories/speaker-accessories/2-way-speaker-stand-adaptor.html

How do you know it's stronger? There aren't any weight ratings on there unless I missed them?

[Matty12]

How do you know it's stronger? There aren't any weight ratings on there unless I missed them?

Sorry edited it.

Thanks.;)

[sweetie]

surely speakers arent supposed to be so close together. this is one corner I wouldnt cut.

[Matty12]

surely speakers arent supposed to be so close together. this is one corner I wouldnt cut.

No I might get four ev 12 speaker's so just would like to know. :)

[WWDJ]

No I might get four ev 12 speaker's so just would like to know. :)

Overkill .... :eek:

[DAVESOUNDS SERVICES]

Last Saturday i did the Disco backing a PINK tribute at a local club. I was set up and on background music when she arrived so i gave her a hand in with her new PA.She took ages to set up her QSC Active tops n bass bins and when she did her sound check i must say it didnt sound half bad

( thought she might give my RCF ART 300s and HZ powered Bass bin a good run for the money)

She did her first spot and i must say it sounded ok...not brilliant but ok
Then....After a bottle of vodka and 20 cigs in the dressing room she did the second set....IT WAS RUBBISH! she took the system well up to the limiters and it sounded utterly pants! (This was 2 12 inch tops and 2 huge BASS BINS all by QSC ) so as a listener the system gets my vote for being Not up to purpose.
It was heavily distorted gargley and poppy at high levels
Mike was Sennhieser wireless desk unknown.
THe pa was only reproducing Mike and Laptop.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/DAVESOUNDS/DSC08420.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v201/DAVESOUNDS/DSC08419.jpg

Club was 250 Seater Big Dance floor Lots of Drapes and soft furnishings.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v201/DAVESOUNDS/DSC08418.jpg

[funkymook]

Last Saturday i did the Disco backing a PINK tribute at a local club. I was set up and on background music when she arrived so i gave her a hand in with her new PA.She took ages to set up her QSC Active tops n bass bins and when she did her sound check i must say it didnt sound half bad

( thought she might give my RCF ART 300s and HZ powered Bass bin a good run for the money)

She did her first spot and i must say it sounded ok...not brilliant but ok
Then....After a bottle of vodka and 20 cigs in the dressing room she did the second set....IT WAS RUBBISH! she took the system well up to the limiters and it sounded utterly pants! (This was 2 12 inch tops and 2 huge BASS BINS all by QSC ) so as a listener the system gets my vote for being Not up to purpose.
It was heavily distorted gargley and poppy at high levels
Mike was Sennhieser wireless desk unknown.
THe pa was only reproducing Mike and Laptop.


To be honest it sounds like what was going into the system, not the system itself. If you say it was her new system then that points to her not knowing how to set it up properly to get the best out of it.

My K12's have handled some very big events on their own. Particularly one emergency when a venue's house system broke down - I played Ska to an audience of over 250 and they didn't embarrass me, not a hint of distortion and limiter light only blinking occasionally. Just a pair of 12" wasn't ideal obviously (it was all we had to hand though), but people were dancing and we had no complaints.