Why...

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

is it that I keep reading on forums and Facebook that "The client didn't complain, so it was fine"

Examples are using a cheap mixer, using sign written frontage, having cables everywhere, using shabby equipment generally..

Do you really think that a client would physically come over and complain about something, or would they just be thinking about it and not book you again next time, or do these things really not matter at all in your opinion?

[Corabar Entertainment]

is it that I keep reading on forums and Facebook that "The client didn't complain, so it was fine"

Examples are using a cheap mixer, using sign written frontage, having cables everywhere, using shabby equipment generally..

Do you really think that a client would physically come over and complain about something, or would they just be thinking about it and not book you again next time, or do these things really not matter at all in your opinion?

:like:

My thoughts exactly

[Ryu]

By that reckoning, those who don't care or didn't get complained about wouldnt get return or referral work from the gig...if they do, then the detail evidently didn't matter, if they don't get follow on work then eventually they'll get found out...well, that would be the hope.

[funkymook]

It's an easy defence - why listen to the opinions of fellow professionals when your clients don't say anything?

And even if the clients and guests don't notice these things it's very easy to let standards slip because no one is giving any feedback, and that's a slippery slope!

[mikeee]

Um, "I didn't turn up for my gig last night, cos I went out with the lads drinking, probably ruined the wedding, the client didn't complain, so it was fine"

[Shakermaker Promotions]

Those people probably don't look at every gig as another opportunity to gain additional work. They may get booked and do the gig with what they have and not really care about presentation etc and it's likely that the people that they are playing too don't really worry about the presentation side of things?
I know of one person in my area that has the mentality of "If I get through it, job done". It does make me cringe because the presentation is bad. He goes out cheapily and doesn't really care.

In my opinion, every gig has the potential to gain follow on bookings so I always do my best. If the customer wasn't happy then I'd want to know why and if it's something I could improve upon, then I would. Just because someone "didn't complain" doesn't mean that they were happy with the service does it.

[TonyB]

If we are talking about a group that is a "forum in a box" I would agree that it does seem to highlight the worse in DJs sometimes. I've removed myself from the group because it is an open group and anyone logged into facebook can read the comments.
A couple of people that are not DJs that have browsed the page have made comments to me about the unprofessional attitude and comments made by other DJs. I'd rather not be associated with something that creates an adverse impression of the industry.
I wonder how many potential clients have seen the group and have had second thoughts about booking a DJ or is that not a problem because no one has complained?
(I have mentioned it to the admins of the group this morning.)

[Shaun]

is it that I keep reading on forums and Facebook that "The client didn't complain, so it was fine"

Examples are using a cheap mixer, using sign written frontage, having cables everywhere, using shabby equipment generally..

Do you really think that a client would physically come over and complain about something, or would they just be thinking about it and not book you again next time, or do these things really not matter at all in your opinion?

:like:

My thoughts exactly too.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

And this isn't a pop at budget operators either. I have noticed some DJs in the premium end of the market have said it too.

[Javlingames]

There are dj's that have been making a very good living for years using cheaper branded equipment, sign written frontage. No excuse for messy cables though. It clearly works for them. Besides , the majority of b&g's only book a Dj once in their life! They didn't complain AND you got paid, that's the most important thing, yes there will be the odd thing we all do that b&g's don't like during the night, ie play a song they don't like or not have a song etc.

[discomobiledj]

If we are talking about a group that is a "forum in a box" I would agree that it does seem to highlight the worse in DJs sometimes. I've removed myself from the group because it is an open group and anyone logged into facebook can read the comments.
A couple of people that are not DJs that have browsed the page have made comments to me about the unprofessional attitude and comments made by other DJs. I'd rather not be associated with something that creates an adverse impression of the industry.
I wonder how many potential clients have seen the group and have had second thoughts about booking a DJ or is that not a problem because no one has complained?
(I have mentioned it to the admins of the group this morning.)

:like:

[yourdj]

Examples are using a cheap mixer, using sign written frontage, having cables everywhere, using shabby equipment generally..

I would agree with everything although I do not see why a sign written frontage is necessary a bad thing? I seem to remember every "roadshow" used to have it. At most events I go to the photographer puts out business cards as do many DJ's. Surely that is more invassive to the client when they are strewn all over the tables.

Cant see why a subtle frontage is a problem tbh. I have not done this for years but now think its not such a bad thing. And if you were refering to me I have asked every client before and in advance (with pics) if its OK and they have all agreed. each venue manager has also said how nice everything looks. :)

If it was such a prolific issue then someone would mention something when I ask them if its OK.

Using crappy gear is another issue. No one mention the speaker on the right as I dropped my RCF the other day :D
its actually not bad sounding :D


-

[Corabar Steve]

I seem to remember every "roadshow" used to have it.
& we used to watch Love Thy Neighbour, Mind Your Language & Not On Your Nellie on TV, but it doesn't make them good.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

There are dj's that have been making a very good living for years using cheaper branded equipment, sign written frontage. No excuse for messy cables though. It clearly works for them. Besides , the majority of b&g's only book a Dj once in their life! They didn't complain AND you got paid, that's the most important thing, yes there will be the odd thing we all do that b&g's don't like during the night, ie play a song they don't like or not have a song etc.

Well done for completely missing the point.

[DazzyD]

& we used to watch Love Thy Neighbour, Mind Your Language & Not On Your Nellie on TV, but it doesn't make them good.

Mind Your Language was one of the first multi-cultural concept programmes on British tv - even before Different Strokes crossed the pond from the US!! Love Thy Neighbour was British comedy genius (imo and, as per all the awards it won, lots of other people's opinions, too!) and is still held with high regard by Rudolph Walker OBE who played the black neighbour Bill Reynolds (although he's probably more better known as Patrick Truman in Eastenders nowadays!). Rudolph, in a tv interview a couple of years ago, said that he can understand why some people frown upon the script content but, he said that the people who are really harsh about the programme, either haven't watched it or just don't get it. The show was not about racism or oppression of the blacks. In fact, his character always gave as good as he got and, more often than not, Bill came out on top over Eddie (played by Jack Smethurst). As for TV history, it is also widely acknowledged that it was Rudolph's fine acting skills in this programme that paved the way for more black actors on TV and this could never be described as a bad thing.

Just thought I'd offer some insight in to the programme for the younger generation who have never seen the programme but, because of the all modern-day negative comments about it's content, think it must have been pure evil!! ;)

As for Not On Your Nellie - well, it was a run-of-the-mill 70s comedy. You'd be better off watching Some Mother's Do 'Ave 'Em or even Fawlty Towers (providing your turn a blind eye to Basil's anti-German rantings!!).

[yourdj]

& we used to watch Love Thy Neighbour, Mind Your Language & Not On Your Nellie on TV, but it doesn't make them good.

Need to watch some of them as I have pretty much watched every porridge episode this month. :)
Carry on films were last month. Frank Spencer was good too - something I remember as a kid.

They do not make comedy as clever/simple (not sure of the word) as that anymore do they :confused:

On topic:

I have just been chatting with my tenant who is a manager of a local four star hotel and is a trained (Brian Wroe) wedding MC and she does not think branding is a problem as long as it does not take the focus away from the bride a grooms photos or is too garish for the venue surroundings.

She did say the above picture was not great (it was shot by a guest) and a white banner would be better in a marquee type surrounding.

I agree and will get one printed :)

[Javlingames]

Well done for completely missing the point.

In that case then I'm not really sure what you are rattling on about.

I'm guessing the people that have issues with a sign written frontage don't use one. A little bit like dj's who don't use the mic very well 'let their music do the talking' and say 'brides don't want that anymore'

I've never had a bride mention sign written frontage in the 15 years I've been booking dj's!

As for cheap mixers, Darren don't you use a pioneer? Now to me the sound quality on a pioneer is about the same as a behringer.

Fair enough on shabby equipment and cables, that's bad.

One more thing re displaying your Dj name, do you also cover up apple logo ? The wizard extreme logo? Remove the badges from your speakers? If the bride doesn't want any branding??

And that's the thing Toby, signage can be done tastefully.

[DJ Jules]

In that case then I'm not really sure what you are rattling on about.

I think that's the problem Darren is talking about...

Two points from your statement which stick out like a sort thumb:


There are dj's that have been making a very good living for years using cheaper branded equipment, sign written frontage. No excuse for messy cables though. It clearly works for them.

It might APPEAR to work for them, but in reality they might be missing out on a ton of business because of very minor things which are putting off customers (like sign written frontage - which is not to every customers taste or very poor music quality) but customers are unlikely to complain about, and potential customers are even less likely to tell you about.



Besides , the majority of b&g's only book a Dj once in their life! They didn't complain AND you got paid, that's the most important thing, yes there will be the odd thing we all do that b&g's don't like during the night, ie play a song they don't like or not have a song etc.

Is "they didn't complain" really the best measure of your service that you can come up with? I would have thought "but the B&G came over to me at the end of the night and couldn't thank me enough" was a better way of determining if you've done a good job? :D Or possibly even "...and I took four bookings for other functions on the night..." etc, etc.

I think the point Darren was trying to make is that if you're ever offered constructive criticism about specific aspects of your show by an experienced person who is making a good living - then it's worth listening to it, and saying "I don't think it matters, my clients have never complained" is missing the point as it's not just about today's client. Every single time you perform you're advertising yourself to tomorrows potential clients, and they are not going to come up and tell you what they think, they'll just book someone else!

Julian

P.S. I've never used Pioneer, but I've used Behringer mixers and they don't sound great and have a tendency to overheat and fall apart on the road. I take my own Mackie Mixer to a walk in gig I do on a regular basis because even with the Behringer amp and JBL/Peavy speakers you can hear a clear difference between the two mixers (plus the Berry mixer has a total of five faulty faders and has actually shut down completely a couple of times and had to be powered cycled mid-show!)

[Javlingames]

Jules I hear you and agree on the points made.

I don't think dazza can generalise like that though.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Spot on Julian.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

In that case then I'm not really sure what you are rattling on about.



I am not 'rattling' on about anything. I am discussing valid points.

Why bother taking part in the thread if you don't understand. As usual you are just on the troll with comments like "Behringer sound as good as Pioneer" . Yes of course they do.

And no I don't use Pioneer.

[Javlingames]

I am not 'rattling' on about anything. I am discussing valid points.

Why bother taking part in the thread if you don't understand. As usual you are just on the troll with comments like "Behringer sound as good as Pioneer" . Yes of course they do.

And no I don't use Pioneer.

Having an opinion on a pioneer mixer is hardly trolling daz. Soundwise I really dont rate pioneer mixers.

[paulg]

is it that I keep reading on forums and Facebook that "The client didn't complain, so it was fine"

Examples are using a cheap mixer, using sign written frontage, having cables everywhere, using shabby equipment generally..

Do you really think that a client would physically come over and complain about something, or would they just be thinking about it and not book you again next time, or do these things really not matter at all in your opinion?

Agree. Appearance and performance matter. I encourage client feedback on me directly and on DJ's recommended or supplied through our website. Clients seldom do complain voluntarily but ask them a direct question and it's a whole different story. They'll have formed an opinion of a DJ almost immediately.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Having an opinion on a pioneer mixer is hardly trolling daz.

It is when you thought that I had one...

[Javlingames]

It is when you thought that I had one...

I thought you had a pioneer DJM3000 , im sure i read somewhere you did.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

I thought you had a pioneer DJM3000 , im sure i read somewhere you did.

I did, but I don't any more.

[Javlingames]

I did, but I don't any more.

Thank you