sound limiter GRRRRRRRRR

[djdave01]

Ive worked in the same venue twice in the last 7 days, Saturday 1st sept, and last night, Friday 7th. Ive worked in the same place dozens of times before so i know the manager well.

On arriving on the 1st sept, i noticed a new sound limiter, it had just been fitted and wasnt setup yet. It was set to 'monitor only'. Its not a large room and has a low roof, so the volume is never loud anyway but the monitor kept indicading that it would have turned the power off. The manager was trying to adjust it now and then during the night.

When i arrived last night, the monitor was set to 'active'. I spoke to the manager about it, he said it had now been setup properly and it shouldnt be a problem. While waiting on guests to arrive i had background music on, which didnt even register on the monitor. Started the first song at a volume barely above background level, 20 seconds in, power off :mad: it takes 10 seconds to come back on. I told the crowd on the mic that the venue had a new sound limiter, and this may be a problem.

The manager came over and tried to adjust it again, restarted the first song, 30 seconds in, it cut off again. Being a bit annoyed, i told him to either set it back to 'monitor only' or i wouldnt continue. He did, so i got going properly and had a good night.

On speaking too the manager later, he agreed that i wasnt playing the music loud but claimed the council had forced him to install the limiter, and if he was caught with it set to 'monitor only' he could be fined.

Im back in the same venue twice next month, not looking forward to it.

[katman]

The manager came over and tried to adjust it again, restarted the first song, 30 seconds in, it cut off again.

On speaking too the manager later, he agreed that i wasnt playing the music loud but claimed the council had forced him to install the limiter, and if he was caught with it set to 'monitor only' he could be fined.

That seems strange. I have installed over a dozen limiters in various venues when the council have insisted on one becuase of noise complaints. In ALL cases I have been the one who has to set it up with the Environmental Health Officer in attendance. Never heard of a venue being allowed to adjust their own.

Also in all but one venue, the limiters I installed were set to what I would consider to be a perfectly acceptable level, coming from someone who sits on bith sides of the divide as DJ and installer. The one venue where it was set way too low was a former cinema which basically only had a sheet of plasterboard and sheet of corrigated asbestos roofing between the dance floor and the outside world. Might as well have been an open air auditorium.

Despite my advice that they needed to install a huge amount of sound deadening material in the roof space they ignored me and insisted on holding Drum and Bass nights with people bringing in HUGE sound systems. Their final night before before being closed down was a play off between two different sound systems.

[Corabar Entertainment]

That seems strange. I have installed over a dozen limiters in various venues when the council have insisted on one becuase of noise complaints. In ALL cases I have been the one who has to set it up with the Environmental Health Officer in attendance. Never heard of a venue being allowed to adjust their own. Well it seems to be becoming de rigeur. The licence stipulates the dB - how the venue gets there is up to them.

EH does 'spot checks', but that's it.

The last one I mentioned on here a few weeks ago, the venue had the dB in their licence for the best part of a year, but had just been 'winging it'. After a nudge from EH, they had bought a limiter off-the-shelf so to speak, and a member of their staff was busy reading the manual to try and work out how to install it and set it up!

[katman]

That could well be why so many people are suffering noise problems and why so many DJs are having problems with badly set up limiters. The smoking ban doesnt halp things either because many venues have doors opening for the major part of the evening and that allows the sound out of the room. Where I live in the middle of town, we can hear a couple of pubs in the evening which we never used to be able to hear.

If venues would take proper precautions to prevent the leakage of sound then the limiters wouldnt be needed and everyone would be happy.

[Corabar Entertainment]

You're preaching to the converted here!

[djdave01]

That could well be why so many people are suffering noise problems and why so many DJs are having problems with badly set up limiters. The smoking ban doesnt halp things either because many venues have doors opening for the major part of the evening and that allows the sound out of the room. Where I live in the middle of town, we can hear a couple of pubs in the evening which we never used to be able to hear.

If venues would take proper precautions to prevent the leakage of sound then the limiters wouldnt be needed and everyone would be happy.

The manager told me the limiter was installed to 'protect his staffs hearing'. I'm back there in a few weeks, wonder if it'll be set properly by then.

[soundmaster mobile disco]

Hi Dave sorry to hear of your problems with the dreaded sound limiter.

What venue is that Dave?

[chrisj]

I admit I do not like limiters and when thinking about them I remember the ex-serviceman's club (was cinema) in Wymondham where the limiter goes off with a round of applause or singing, for example YMCA.
Rather than activate it I just keep the music low and especially the bass. When guests ask me to turn it up I tell them the limiter will switch power off so I cannot do so. All said and done IMO until a guy came to the mixer when I had to go to the gents and he turned it up. I arrived back and he said 'You speakers are :Censored:ed." After the power came on again I told everyone over the mic that someone had increased the volume when I was not there and it had activated the sound limiter. I asked if anyone knew who did it. They guys face went red.

[Excalibur]

Members are reminded that substituting dots, dashes, spaces and asterisks for words banned by the censor is against the rules. See this litle fella? :Censored: When you want to use a word proscribed by the censor, ( which results in Forum Censor Activated appearing in red all over your post ) give him a call. He'll be only too :Censored: pleased to help. Ta.

[chrisj]

Sorry Peter, it will not happen again.

[djeddie]

On speaking too the manager later, he agreed that i wasnt playing the music loud but claimed the council had forced him to install the limiter, and if he was caught with it set to 'monitor only' he could be fined.

Im back in the same venue twice next month, not looking forward to it.
'
Sounds to me like the manager is trying to do things as cheaply as possible, i.e. not paying a professional to do the job. 'Turning it up a bit' or 'turning it down a bit' are not really gonna get the sound level set by the council. Also, what was the original reason why the council told him to fit a limiter? Bass noise, general music noise or something else? The set up of the limiter needs to be done according to what kind of noise problem exists - bass noise, general noise or whatever.

The other worrying part of that set up, in my mind anyway, is that if it's been done on the cheap then the microphone (that the limiter uses) will also be a cheap one, meaning it's frequency response will be shockingly bad with, more than likely, a huge hump in the MF range, so crowd noise will set it off.
If he's installed a limiter that's not set up correctly the council will still fine him if he breaches.

[yourdj]

The manager told me the limiter was installed to 'protect his staffs hearing'.


'
Sounds to me like the manager is trying to do things as cheaply as possible

There is a cheaper way to protect staff hearing. :)

14783

[CRAZY K]

There is a cheaper way to protect staff hearing. :)

14783

A good point Toby, I thought staff were supposed to be provided with ear defenders of some sort automatically now?

I do know we did a Rodeo Bull Booking at a SU night in Oxford in February and the Disco was ear bleeding loud--my son and I had to stuff rolled up tissue in our ears--the bar staff had no protection at all and they do this x times a week.:daft:

[soundmaster events]

Ive worked in the same venue twice in the last 7 days, Saturday 1st sept, and last night, Friday 7th. Ive worked in the same place dozens of times before so i know the manager well.

On arriving on the 1st sept, i noticed a new sound limiter, it had just been fitted and wasnt setup yet. It was set to 'monitor only'. Its not a large room and has a low roof, so the volume is never loud anyway but the monitor kept indicading that it would have turned the power off. The manager was trying to adjust it now and then during the night.

When i arrived last night, the monitor was set to 'active'. I spoke to the manager about it, he said it had now been setup properly and it shouldnt be a problem. While waiting on guests to arrive i had background music on, which didnt even register on the monitor. Started the first song at a volume barely above background level, 20 seconds in, power off :mad: it takes 10 seconds to come back on. I told the crowd on the mic that the venue had a new sound limiter, and this may be a problem.

The manager came over and tried to adjust it again, restarted the first song, 30 seconds in, it cut off again. Being a bit annoyed, i told him to either set it back to 'monitor only' or i wouldnt continue. He did, so i got going properly and had a good night.

On speaking too the manager later, he agreed that i wasnt playing the music loud but claimed the council had forced him to install the limiter, and if he was caught with it set to 'monitor only' he could be fined.

Im back in the same venue twice next month, not looking forward to it.

I feel your pain on that, theres a venue not far from my local area that ive worked in on several times now, they have a limiter installed. unfortunetly for the entertainment that go into this venue they can not see the limiter from where they have to set up and plug into. Its hidden up high on a beem pointing away from the entertainments sight. i similarly done something like your self, i referenced to my background music level at the start of the night i then once i had started turned the music up very slighty and then power cut off. I was running around like a total idiot trying to figure out how to re-set this limiter. when i eventually figured it out it had to be re-set manually. made me look like a right pleb. once i re-set the limiter it kept cutting of the whole fecking night as i couldnt see it, i had people complaining left right and centre at the volume level as it was basically just background music. who puts a limiter where it cant be seen!!! i just stated over the microphone that it wasnt myself it was the council who had installed the limiter to the venue.

[Shaun]

I feel your pain on that, theres a venue not far from my local area that ive worked in on several times now, they have a limiter installed. unfortunetly for the entertainment that go into this venue they can not see the limiter from where they have to set up and plug into. Its hidden up high on a beem pointing away from the entertainments sight. i similarly done something like your self, i referenced to my background music level at the start of the night i then once i had started turned the music up very slighty and then power cut off. I was running around like a total idiot trying to figure out how to re-set this limiter. when i eventually figured it out it had to be re-set manually. made me look like a right pleb. once i re-set the limiter it kept cutting of the whole fecking night as i couldnt see it, i had people complaining left right and centre at the volume level as it was basically just background music. who puts a limiter where it cant be seen!!! i just stated over the microphone that it wasnt myself it was the council who had installed the limiter to the venue.

Which venue is that Alan?

I'm trying to build up a database of all the Scottish venues that have sound limiters installed.


I've started a separate thread. See below. :)

http://www.forum.mobilediscodirectory.co.uk/showthread.php?39357-Scottish-Venues-with-Sound-Limiters&p=615527#post615527