Looking for the impossible?

[Imagine]

I'm either looking for something which doesn't exist...or looking for the wrong thing! (not unusual)

What do I need?

Simples....wireless microphones....BUT....I require something that's got a PAIR of wireless handsets (one for speeches, one for myself, and also a pair is handy so that one's in backup mode if needed), and a pair of lavalieres with the associated pocket transmitter. The lav's also need to be responsive (i.e. actually pick up the speech)

At the moment I use the KAM Quad setup which suits my booming voice perfectly. However, I've got several "grand entrances" to perform this year and being a lone-ranger and controlling the sound from a fruity flavoured tablet, ideally need a lav to be handsfree in that respect.

I also have a couple of ceremonies coming up, so a lav on the groom and another on the registrar's book thingy that they hold in front of them to pic up bridey will be ideal.

Budget-wise - hmmm....I've never spent a fortune on mics but on this occasion anything up to around half a bag of sand will suffice for the right kit (although the cheaper the better obviously ;) )


Any ideas?

[yourdj]

I'm either looking for something which doesn't exist...or looking for the wrong thing! (not unusual)

What do I need?

Simples....wireless microphones....BUT....I require something that's got a PAIR of wireless handsets (one for speeches, one for myself, and also a pair is handy so that one's in backup mode if needed), and a pair of lavalieres with the associated pocket transmitter. The lav's also need to be responsive (i.e. actually pick up the speech)

At the moment I use the KAM Quad setup which suits my booming voice perfectly. However, I've got several "grand entrances" to perform this year and being a lone-ranger and controlling the sound from a fruity flavoured tablet, ideally need a lav to be handsfree in that respect.

I also have a couple of ceremonies coming up, so a lav on the groom and another on the registrar's book thingy that they hold in front of them to pic up bridey will be ideal.

Budget-wise - hmmm....I've never spent a fortune on mics but on this occasion anything up to around half a bag of sand will suffice for the right kit (although the cheaper the better obviously ;) )


Any ideas?

I have thought that a set of four lapels would work well and be miles easier for the speaker & feels a lot more important as if you are doing your own Ted Talk. but when i introduce them i need to be at a control desk as they usually start straight away (as you can't turn it on before). Having some form of remote kill switch would be ideal, 4 buttons wither on or off, done!!

Having said that a unit that is normal size that have four channels rather than 2 would be handy as they all seem to only have one mic these days (especially with digital), which is a pain in the bum as you need 4 boxes.

I have tried the book, but found the jacket is better as they can get it muddled up and not point it in the right direction making it inconsistent. You might benefit from getting a condenser set up rather than micing up the groom (or a combination of all three mics). Having 4 you can also use a handheld for readings).

I have 2 of these at present and am going to mount them both in a box with a 4 channel mixer.

In terms of your quad system, can you not get a lapel with a selectable frequency within the range of your set? The chinese ones are usually open full a preset range so worth a try and you can get senniser type ones for £50 each, probably made in the same factory.

18568

This looks very much like the other set I have. it was Kam now rebranded to Q Audio? I have a set or lapels on this system, so perhaps you could also add the handhelds? Always handy having 4 of each, you never know, you might join a singing waiter group. I only use the lapels (as they are fab) am not that keen on the handhelds (big, heavy, handling noise and no mute button) actually and prefer the smaller ones above. :)

18569

[DazzyD]

For multiple wireless system that is flexible and expandable, I'd opt for a Trantec S3.xx or S4.xx "Racked N Ready" system. Then you just add on whatever transmitters you want to use. However, the price tag might not be the faint-hearted!

https://www.studiospares.com/Accessories/Cases-Rack/Trantec-S410L-G3-RACK-6W-6xS410-Racked-n-Ready-System-CH38_444430.htm?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIyO7zv5TD2gIVwTob Ch0ZHwO7EAkYCSABEgIkvfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

[DJ Jules]

Probably worth checking out the JTS range - very good mic's and available in a range of different combinations. Full range here (http://www.jts.com.tw/english/products/detail.php?fid=1&subid=6&pid=539). Just to warn you, you probably want to go to a dealer to work out what you need, rather than navigate their website as a lot of their product ranges are very modular (i.e. you buy a 4 channel receiver, 2 beltpacks, 2 headsets/lavier mics and two handhelds - all individually, rather than buying a box with everything in it in one go!)

Q-Audio is probably more in your budget though if you're looking for something cheaper in a set. You're probably looking at two sets:

https://www.q-audio.co.uk/product/qwm-1940-hh/ - Handheld
https://www.q-audio.co.uk/product/qwm-1960-bp/ - Lavier/headset

AKG do something similar - but you'd need to check this out before buying. From memory the mini systems can't change frequencies, so if you bought two systems you'd probably find that both are operating on the same frequencies so you could only use one system at a time!

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/AKG-WMS40-Mini-Dual-Wireless-Vocal-Microphone-System/TK1
https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/AKG-WMS40-Mini-Dual-Wireless-Instrument-System/TK0

This is AKG's Digital 4 channel kit (https://www.akg.com/dmstetrad-system.html?cgid=Wireless%20Microphone%20Systems&dwvar_DMSTetrad_color=Black-GLOBAL-Current#start=1). They have equivalents in their analogue kit, but you've got the same challenge as the JTS stuff in working out what you need :D

Shure and Sennheiser are also worth a look - Shure do some low end kits that might fit your budget.

Julian

[Imagine]

Probably worth checking out the JTS range - very good mic's and available in a range of different combinations. Full range here (http://www.jts.com.tw/english/products/detail.php?fid=1&subid=6&pid=539). Just to warn you, you probably want to go to a dealer to work out what you need, rather than navigate their website as a lot of their product ranges are very modular (i.e. you buy a 4 channel receiver, 2 beltpacks, 2 headsets/lavier mics and two handhelds - all individually, rather than buying a box with everything in it in one go!)

Q-Audio is probably more in your budget though if you're looking for something cheaper in a set. You're probably looking at two sets:

https://www.q-audio.co.uk/product/qwm-1940-hh/ - Handheld
https://www.q-audio.co.uk/product/qwm-1960-bp/ - Lavier/headset

AKG do something similar - but you'd need to check this out before buying. From memory the mini systems can't change frequencies, so if you bought two systems you'd probably find that both are operating on the same frequencies so you could only use one system at a time!

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/AKG-WMS40-Mini-Dual-Wireless-Vocal-Microphone-System/TK1
https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/AKG-WMS40-Mini-Dual-Wireless-Instrument-System/TK0

This is AKG's Digital 4 channel kit (https://www.akg.com/dmstetrad-system.html?cgid=Wireless%20Microphone%20Systems&dwvar_DMSTetrad_color=Black-GLOBAL-Current#start=1). They have equivalents in their analogue kit, but you've got the same challenge as the JTS stuff in working out what you need :D

Shure and Sennheiser are also worth a look - Shure do some low end kits that might fit your budget.

Julian

Yes, I looked at the JTS range, especially after hearing / seeing them being used at ProMobile over the weekend.
Thanks for the advice on the 4 channel receiver and then add bits to it though.....the fog is suddenly clearing :)

[rth_discos]

I wouldn't be looking at an off the shelf solution.

This is moving in to pro av. But well worth the investment.

I'd suggest getting 4 x base stations, each with their own output. And running that in to a mixer.

You can then buy 4 x handheld mics and 4 x lavalier mics. Each handheld and lavalier will share a base station. Meaning at any one time you can use a mix of any 4 handheld / lavaliers.

I have used lavaliers for speeches and they are far superior to handheld mics, but do require good setup to get enough gain without feedback.

It's a pro setup so you'd need to charge accordingly - it'll be about £1.5k investment roughly.

[yourdj]

Yes, I looked at the JTS range, especially after hearing / seeing them being used at ProMobile over the weekend.
Thanks for the advice on the 4 channel receiver and then add bits to it though.....the fog is suddenly clearing :)

I was very impressed with the solidity of those Lapels as they looked like plastic but were Senniser quality build!

I think I will work with what i have and use my 2 Kam boxes with my Mackie mixer in the box I have at present. I want to spin the units round to the side and put an opening or perhaps an acrylic window so I can see the frequencies. Should work and i get 3 band eq on all of the mics, which was crucial on saturday as the FOB had a quiet high pitched voice. :)

18571

18572

[DJ Jules]

I'd suggest getting 4 x base stations, each with their own output. And running that in to a mixer.

All of the pro manufacturers support multi-unit base stations (e.g. the JTS four channel unit I linked to originally) and if you buy the better pro kit you'll get the ability to stack the units to add channels and pass antenna signals and power up the stack, removing the need for some cabling and antennas.

Basically, I don't see the need to buy multiple base stations these days. I totally advocate buying modular systems (like the JTS again) where you can chop/change handsets/beltpacks/base stations with ease.

Julian

[Excalibur]

Basically, I don't see the need to buy multiple base stations these days. I totally advocate buying modular systems (like the JTS again) where you can chop/change handsets/beltpacks/base stations with ease.

Julian

Makes sense to me.

I've recently got a W Audio DTM twin handheld kit, which will allow me to add the headset/lavalier option in place of a handheld unit. I accept it's not a quad system, but if you must have four channels, well two twin kits would come in around £350, plus a case.

[yourdj]

I want to have EQ and XLR on all channels, would this mixer allow me to also play background music through it even though its mono?
I love the fact that is so simple and has all the features that I use on my Mackie. Basically volume, XLR and EQ.

https://www.thomann.de/gb/kustom_pa4ex.htm

18573

[DJ Jules]

I want to have EQ and XLR on all channels, would this mixer allow me to also play background music through it even though its mono?
I love the fact that is so simple and has all the features that I use on my Mackie. Basically volume, XLR and EQ.
https://www.thomann.de/gb/kustom_pa4ex.htm


The short answer is yes, but ONLY through the Sync input (and that's assuming that the Sync input/output is there for daisy chaining across the master bus, and not something else).

I ended up buying the Mackie Mix8 (https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00Q8TGLEQ/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1) for this job. EQ on all channels, 2 Mic inputs, 2 stereo line inputs, very compact and good sound. There's lots of equivalents of this in even smaller packages if you google.

Julian

[yourdj]

The short answer is yes, but ONLY through the Sync input (and that's assuming that the Sync input/output is there for daisy chaining across the master bus, and not something else).

I ended up buying the Mackie Mix8 (https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00Q8TGLEQ/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1) for this job. EQ on all channels, 2 Mic inputs, 2 stereo line inputs, very compact and good sound. There's lots of equivalents of this in even smaller packages if you google.

Julian

Thanks for that. I lied that as it looked super simple, but the price and mono only option is not great.

Yes I have the Mackie 802-VLZ3 (and 4 for my main playout) for this (I like the older mackie mixers) but have now bought this because, its simpler and a bit smaller.
I loose an XLR, but have bought 2 neutric 0.5m Female XLR To Mono 6.35mm cables.

I only just sold this mixer as the Mackie ones are better, but for ceremonies and speeches its fine. I am trying to work out a work around for having all the channels open on the mixer during speeches, I would rather leave the user to not worry about it at all and find a solution where I can have a remote kill switch of some sort for each of the four channels?? The only other option is to ask the speech people to turn up their body pack just before they start. I have very sensible clients, so this is doable.

18574

[DJ Jules]

I am trying to work out a work around for having all the channels open on the mixer during speeches, I would rather leave the user to not worry about it at all and find a solution where I can have a remote kill switch of some sort for each of the four channels??

Wireless digital mixers - not expensive these days:

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/Mackie-ProDX4-4-Channel-Wireless-Mixer/1GVG#full-des

Full Bluetooth control and audio streaming from an App on your phone or iPad :)

Julian

[rth_discos]

Basically, I don't see the need to buy multiple base stations these days. I totally advocate buying modular systems (like the JTS again) where you can chop/change handsets/beltpacks/base stations with ease.

Julian

On the basis Wayne wanted 2 x backup microphones, I'd be nervous relying on one receiving station. I'd much rather have more than 1 receiving station, so that you're not stuffed should the unit or its power supply stop working.

[yourdj]

Wireless digital mixers - not expensive these days:

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/Mackie-ProDX4-4-Channel-Wireless-Mixer/1GVG#full-des

Full Bluetooth control and audio streaming from an App on your phone or iPad :)

Julian

Thats great. Does that mean I don't need a mixer at all then? Or does/can this work in tandem with what I have. I have ben doing an awards tonight so will investigate it further, but it ticks the boxes as I can have an iPad on a lecturn in the middle of the room if needs be!!

I did try an edit, but was 3 seconds too late! Mod note: Have one on me, Toby. :)

isn't it amazing what you don't ever come across until you look! I may well sell my two other mixers and get the 8 version of that as its dead cheap.


Having said that I prefer to use an analogue for ceremonies especially when outside! I will see how I get on with the behringer and asking the users to turn it up themselves. I can kill each person that has talked and turn up the next person just before they start, but its the person just finished that may forget all about it. Handhelds are so much easier but present a different array of issues compared to lapels (e.g. different distance from the mouth, people clapping with it and even forgetting its there). :)

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/mackie-prodx8

[Excalibur]

On the basis Wayne wanted 2 x backup microphones, I'd be nervous relying on one receiving station. I'd much rather have more than 1 receiving station, so that you're not stuffed should the unit or its power supply stop working.

A valid point. I'm sure some white haired Old Git addressed it indirectly earlier, when he suggested two twin receivers. :whistle::D

[DJ Jules]

Thats great. Does that mean I don't need a mixer at all then? Or does/can this work in tandem with what I have. I have ben doing an awards tonight so will investigate it further, but it ticks the boxes as I can have an iPad on a lecturn in the middle of the room if needs be!!

It is a mixer, but it's a mixer where the knobs are replaced by the controls on an app on an iPad or iPhone. The top end gear (check out the A&H QU-16) went digital some time ago, combining analogue controls with a digital processing engine, touch screen on the device itself and remote control via app, this is a mini version of the same kind of concept without the controls.

There are bigger versions of these with lots more channels (https://www.thomann.de/gb/rcf_m_18.htm?sid=13cbf233449e5bf3d2cc118441de1307) for the more ambitious who don't have deep enough pockets for an A&H :D

Julian