Warning! Price thread alert.

[Excalibur]

OK, in a big way. so we now know that a return to some sort of public, paid work is likely this year. Now seems to be the time to canvas opinion on something that's been on my mind for a while, and to be fair, I don't really know what I will do. It's likely to be a case by case basis.

What worries me, is that many high class DJs ( especially those who have fallen through the various support nets) may have decided to give the game up, or cut back in a big way. Now there's one person we know, who's likely to have been impacted less than most, and that's our good friend, Sid. I reckon he's gonna come out of hibernation raring to go, for little more than a few cans of pop. :beer1::beer1::beer1:
Added to the fact that many venues will be reopening at limited capacity, and with depleted coffers, and I reckon it's a perfect storm for prices going through the floor.

The contrary view is that if you're looking at Weddings and the like, there's likely to be a release of pent up demand, a shortage of high quality suppliers, and the opportunity of a price hike, or two. I've seen some people voicing the thought that it isn't fair for a wedding from April 2020 postponed until eventually July 2022 to cost the same price.

Personally, I do feel that there are going to be pleas from clients for a reduction in fees, some valid, some not. I'm always prepared to consider discounts, as I'd rather do a Disco for less than £200 than earn the same money in the day job. It's been :Censored:ing hard work just lately. :(

Your thoughts on any or all of the above welcome, as always. The floor is yours.

[Jim - Scotland's Party DJ]

Personally, I do feel that there are going to be pleas from clients for a reduction in fees, some valid, some not. I'm always prepared to consider discounts, as I'd rather do a Disco for less than £200 than earn the same money in the day job. It's been :Censored:ing hard work just lately. :(

Your thoughts on any or all of the above welcome, as always. The floor is yours.

I put my prices up considerably last January :rolleyes: I'm now charging a similar price for evening's than I previously was for all day shots and I'm now one of if not the most expensive wedding DJ of all the ones around here I know.

I made the decision during COVID that I wasn't going to revert to my old prices and I certainly wasn't going to go cheaper. I know guys who have done this and I'm not judging them - we all need to make £££ and if that's what they choose to do then it's their business, not mine.

The uptake since January this year in particular has been really positive - I'm converting a very healthy amount of enquiries. I've never been one for going mad with data so I can't discern for sure and I can't be bothered trawling through DJEP to work it out but I don't feel my conversion % has been affected much, if at all.

I've not had anyone ask for a straight reduction in fees but a few have asked if there's a lower price if I don't do my video montage - no skin off my back and I knock £50 quid off. The cut in £ compared to the less work involved still makes sense.

It also means I'm less inclined to bother about 1am finishes, long travels or even moving the date (within reason) - I'm earning more in a night than I do in a week of my teaching job which has a significantly higher barrier to entry so I'm not going to gripe or grumble about little things when the pay off is so good.

Will I discount for people who ask? No, I already discount for the armed forces and I extended that to NHS staff but I'm not dropping my price just because someone asks - they're entitled to ask, I'm also entitled to decline.

I've not put much thought into Sid at all. We operate in 2 totally different spheres and have done for many years but I can see how people operating lower down the industry or working in pubs and clubs will be concerned. With that being said, it'll be the venues that drive this. I've no idea what a pub paid pre-COVID but I wouldn't be surprised if that DJ they'd pay £120 for on a Friday night say, they now want to pay £80 and someone will take it, same as it ever was...

[Retrodisco]

I put my prices up for this 'comeback'

Yes I dont get the low end cheap hotel stuff, but the decent clients are still booking at the higher price.

[Imagine]

No reductions here, although I'm seeing a LOT of people on the book of faces advertising discounts :mad:

Enquiries aren't back just yet (it's still too early to be sure exactly when we'll be back), but the ones that are asking are converting into bookings - my conversion rate is well up this year :)

As for Sidney - not my competition I'm afraid. Sorry if that sounds snooty but I'm not one for working in pubs, bars and too many village halls I'm afraid.
There will always be those that hire a DJ on price alone, and they're really not my customer.

[rth_discos]

So 3 things:

1st thing

There will be an abundance of SID. An absolute abundance.

But that's OK.

How many SIDs will have been bedroom DJs during lockdown? I don't think we're going to see a new crop of wedding djs coming through who have been spinning the dancefloor fillers and classics during lockdown. Very different to live streaming a funky house mix on Facebook...

2nd thing

The new SID can play music. The new SID can't host the day, make announcements, provide wireless microphones, etc.

3rd thing

The middle classes have saved a LOT of money during lockdown. So whilst budget weddings will see budgets squeezed, expect to see people want to splash out.

This was from a client who decided a few weeks ago to postpone for a further year "It is but I guess that gives us another year to save up for some extras. "

So there's already the attitude of spend, spend, spend...

I think if we unlock in the way that has been planned, there's positivity for those who can do weddings properly, and can hold themselves in a 4* venue.

Now is the time to be confident, put your prices up, and put some clear distance between you and SID. The difference will have never been starker.

[Benny Smyth]

If one boxed clever in the first place, they would realise that DJ Entertainment is a luxury service and would have priced themselves accordingly anyway, which in turn would have attracted a more recession-proof level of clientele. Saying that, in amongst all of the doom and gloom that you read all the time, people have been saving money - they've not been going out and a good chunk of them haven't even needed to pay for travel costs to get to work.

My planned 2021 price increase was kicked back until 2022 as I wanted to try and help those who had to postpone as much as possible, but it's not something that I can realistically do again, so 2022 has had a price increase. Since 1st January, I've had 62 enquiries, I was able to quote for 49 of those and I converted 18. No discounts offered.

DJs wanting to race to the bottom is not going to affect anyone but them. As long as you can demonstrate your value and you can market yourself to the right folk, you'll be golden.

[Excalibur]

Jim, well done, and I agree totally with your post.

Mark, Wayne, can't fault the logic.

Benny, your post aligns with a lot of things I've heard. Again, I can't disagree with anything you've said, and not surprisingly, everyone I've mentioned has referred to " The Great Divide", which separates them from Sid's clutches.

Which leaves Gavin.


So 3 things:

1st thing

There will be an abundance of SID. An absolute abundance.

But that's OK.

How many SIDs will have been bedroom DJs during lockdown? I don't think we're going to see a new crop of wedding djs coming through who have been spinning the dancefloor fillers and classics during lockdown. Very different to live streaming a funky house mix on Facebook...
Absolutely agreed about the abundance. I'd also agree that there won't be a huge new crop of the " Wedding DJ's" you describe, but I do think that the :muppet:s are prepared to quote for weddings, cos " How difficult can it be to play Abba and Macarena? Money for old rope".



2nd thing

The new SID can play music. The new SID can't host the day, make announcements, provide wireless microphones, etc.

See above. He can't, never in a million years. Still won't stop him quoting though. :(



3rd thing

The middle classes have saved a LOT of money during lockdown. So whilst budget weddings will see budgets squeezed, expect to see people want to splash out.

This was from a client who decided a few weeks ago to postpone for a further year "It is but I guess that gives us another year to save up for some extras. "

So there's already the attitude of spend, spend, spend...
Again, totally agreed. It's the word " squeezed" that worries me, though, as I don't class myself as " High End". :(




I think if we unlock in the way that has been planned, there's positivity for those who can do weddings properly, and can hold themselves in a 4* venue.
However.................



Now is the time to be confident, put your prices up, and put some clear distance between you and SID. The difference will have never been starker.

I have a cunning plan............... ;):whistle:

[Imagine]

I have a cunning plan............... ;):whistle:

And it's taken how many inebriated conversations in Broad St over the years to get you to execute the plan? :whistle:

[Jim - Scotland's Party DJ]

Again, totally agreed. It's the word " squeezed" that worries me, though, as I don't class myself as " High End". :(


:

Maybe an opportunity? The more air there is between yourself and otgers, the easier it is to convert imo.

I've no clue what you charge but I'd argue the margins of say a £100-250 difference in fees are harder for a client to discern and you to quantify than a much bigger difference so mid-range fees are harder to justify against sid than higher rates.

If that conversation ever crops up my go to response is "I'd never tell anyone else how to run their business or what to charge but there's a reason I cost # times what they are charging "

You don't even have to explain any further, those that were never going to be swayed don't care and those that are will understand that you're a premium service but more importantly,the other dude isn't...

[Excalibur]

And it's taken how many inebriated conversations in Broad St over the years to get you to execute the plan? :whistle:
" In vino, veritas"

Mod Note! Watch it, that's another breach of Rule 23, and you're now on a final warning! :Naughty::Naughty::Naughty:


Maybe an opportunity? The more air there is between yourself and others, the easier it is to convert imo.

..

The prospect of " clear blue water" between me and Sid is simultaneously appealing and frightening. It's a big leap of faith, and I'm an old bloke, set in his ways. People have been urging me to raise my prices for years, and it's taken a global pandemic to kickstart the idea!

[Benny Smyth]

The prospect of " clear blue water" between me and Sid is simultaneously appealing and frightening. It's a big leap of faith, and I'm an old bloke, set in his ways. People have been urging me to raise my prices for years, and it's taken a global pandemic to kickstart the idea!

What have you got to lose?

[rth_discos]

What have you got to lose?

Exactly.

Double your prices and you can LOSE 50% of your work, and still be in the same position as before! In fact, you're better off, because you have less costs overall.

And then you have greater capacity to take on more work.

Peter, I think you've got a niche that you don't even know you have...

I'd be interested to understand who your 'ideal' client is - ie, the type of person you love working for week in, week out, and what music they want at their wedding, and what background (job), they typically have...

[Excalibur]

What have you got to lose?


Exactly.

Double your prices and you can LOSE 50% of your work, and still be in the same position as before! In fact, you're better off, because you have less costs overall.

And then you have greater capacity to take on more work.

Peter, I think you've got a niche that you don't even know you have...

I'd be interested to understand who your 'ideal' client is - ie, the type of person you love working for week in, week out, and what music they want at their wedding, and what background (job), they typically have...

Thanks for those words, chaps, I've already had a long overdue chat with Benny, which revealed a few issues I hadn't considered, and a glaring failing on my website which needs addressing. Thanks Benny, much appreciated.

Gavin, I fear you may be next in line for a concerted information gathering missive from me. I suggest you leave the country, and move somewhere with no internet immediately! :D:D

[DeckstarDeluxe]

You're going to have pretty much three years of weddings in just a two year period, if anything you should be putting your prices up!.

Sids will always be around, but they can take care of Sid customers the way I see it.

C19 has hit some folks harder than others. I bet theres a fair few families who are better off financially than they were 12 months ago.

[ppentertainments]

After quite a number of months working for not much more than minimum wage, one thing for certain - I will appreciate what I am earning DJing.

Going forward I have frozen my prices till the end of 2022 - I am almost fully booked this year and next so maybe need to increase a bit. However, moving forward my business will be changing, this DJ has aged a lot this past year and no longer feels he can work 3/4 nights a week. Also I have one other business now, and have just bought a third so not sure where priorities will lie.

[rth_discos]

I am almost fully booked this year and next so maybe need to increase a bit. .

Now is the perfect time to increase your fee. Whack it up for anyone who enquires about any remaining date you have this year or next year.

One of the most important aspects of getting the fee is being confident in the fee. When you are fully booked and don't 'need' the work, it's much easier to ask for a higher fee.

Try doing it when staring at an empty diary and it's much easier to be nervous and quote a lower price 'just to get the work'.

[ppentertainments]

Now is the perfect time to increase your fee. Whack it up for anyone who enquires about any remaining date you have this year or next year.

One of the most important aspects of getting the fee is being confident in the fee. When you are fully booked and don't 'need' the work, it's much easier to ask for a higher fee.

Try doing it when staring at an empty diary and it's much easier to be nervous and quote a lower price 'just to get the work'.
A few years ago I would have totally agreed with you and acted immediately.

Now though, not so sure. Those who are charging higher than me have a lot more work involved which I don't want. Hopefully discos will eventually (soon) be a passive income for me moving forward, so like the simplicity.

If things don't go to plan, then yeah will definitely have to rethink.

[ppentertainments]

I bet theres a fair few families who are better off financially than they were 12 months ago.
I bet there are a lot more better off than we realise.
Even on 80% furlough many will be a lot better off

[rth_discos]

?
Those who are charging higher than me have a lot more work involved which I don't want.

Why do they have 'more work involved'?

It's a fallacy to think you have to work 'harder' to be paid what you are worth.

[ppentertainments]

?

Why do they have 'more work involved'?

It's a fallacy to think you have to work 'harder' to be paid what you are worth.
Client meetings is the big one.
But no, you are correct actually.

[Jim - Scotland's Party DJ]

The prospect of " clear blue water" between me and Sid is simultaneously appealing and frightening. It's a big leap of faith, and I'm an old bloke, set in his ways. People have been urging me to raise my prices for years, and it's taken a global pandemic to kickstart the idea!

I'd written a pretty long response last night but it's disappeared into the ether when I hit post for some reason!

Anyways. Someone who is seriously considering booking me at my fees isn't all of a sudden going to be swayed and end up booking the guy who is a fraction of my price so that's never a consideration. If my prices were much closer to Sid's then it can become a consideration because the perceived value is much closer.

i.e.:

Remember holidays?!?!? If we were booking a wee weekend away, I was more likely to try and save money here and there looking at different flights, cities and hotels, cost of beer etc... compared to the big holidays where we went - 2 weeks in Vegas, :Censored::Censored::Censored::Censored: it, let's get it booked. No messing about looking for cheaper ways to get there via 17 changeovers or hiring an AirBnB a 20 minute taxi journey from the strip.

I've just purchased a silver tip badger shaving brush. It cost nearly £100 but knowing that it's going to be better quality and produce a better end result than cheaper brushes, I wasn't scouring through synthetic brushes or anything under £70. When I first start using these brushes, the cheaper ones, it was simply a case of which one is on the shelf or which will be delivered quicker. [sidenote: I get spending money on something like that is a bit off brand during a pandemic where people are struggling but for something I'll use every day or 2 for years to come, it's not a totally shameless spunking of money against the wall]

Our services are the same.

What I would say is if you're going to differentiate yourself on price and get away from the Sid zone of influence, you need to look professional and come across as unique.

I've no idea what you charge Peter but having had a quick look over your website - does it look professional, to an extent yes but it doesn't scream high end to me. More importantly, I don't see anything on it that would convince me as a consumer that you're any different or worth any more money than the dozens / hundreds of other DJs out there with OK looking websites. If you are going to go for it, this is the first thing I'd address.

[DeckstarDeluxe]

Client meetings is the big one.
But no, you are correct actually.

Work smarter, not harder and all that.

I'm one of the most expensive in my area and I do a surprisingly low amount of client meetings. Few skype calls here and there but certainly not loads more work.

You do have a few guys who touch on the all day service/MC stuff which yes is more work, but means they can work less days for the same turnover.

[rth_discos]

You do have a few guys who touch on the all day service/MC stuff which yes is more work, but means they can work less days for the same turnover.

Even that doesn't need masses of work - certainly not for my clients.

I thought it did originally, but my clients don't want too much - the value I provide is in someone being there to keep the day on track and provide some structure and support.

Where the justification for long client meetings came from was tied up with the American 'love story' and other interactive moments that required a lot of prep - not only from the DJ, but also I was seeing long documents the clients had to fill in. Now I'm not saying that is 'wrong' - but that wasn't what I offered because my clients didn't want that.

My clients are time poor - often working both working stressful, long hours jobs. They hire me so that I can 'get on with it'. A few emails or a chat on the phone with them at the time of booking, and a chat on the phone a few weeks before the wedding, and a relatively short online planner for them to complete in between.

On the day, I'm always one step ahead of them, I guide them through the day, and let them know what is about to happen. They value my experience of having attended so many weddings that I know what is the best way to execute things to make everything smooth.

I give them a stress free day.

That is what they are paying for.

In my eyes, the all day bit is my upsell from the evening entertainment. They hire me for that initially, but see the value in me being there all day.

So yes, on the day it's a longer day, but it doesn't actually require much more additional work in advance of the day.

For the all day part, essentially, they're paying for my experience and knowledge more than anything.

[ppentertainments]

?

Why do they have 'more work involved'?

It's a fallacy to think you have to work 'harder' to be paid what you are worth.

Well, can't thank you enough.

Thought about what you said, to be honest my heart isn't in it anymore so what do I have to lose ??

50% increase on fees yesterday, 2 bookings this morning. Same service, nowt fancy, just providing a disco.

Release a new 'Grand Package' (Yes it costs £1000) and had a bit interest with people wanting to upgrade.

Suppose every other business out there will have to recoup losses, why don't we ??

[Imagine]

Well, can't thank you enough.

Thought about what you said, to be honest my heart isn't in it anymore so what do I have to lose ??

50% increase on fees yesterday, 2 bookings this morning. Same service, nowt fancy, just providing a disco.

Release a new 'Grand Package' (Yes it costs £1000) and had a bit interest with people wanting to upgrade.

Suppose every other business out there will have to recoup losses, why don't we ??

My prices traditionally go up on 1st March.
I was planning to hold with what I was charging last year, because....well I didn't actually charge anything last year :(

However....I'm now in the position where I have a job which "sort of" pays the bills so not in a desperate hurry to rush into a Covid infested environment again any time soon.....I can wait.
I've just increased my prices by quite a bit...nothing gambled, nothing lost. There's now an entire OCEAN between me and the local Sidney. We shall see what happens :)

Chris - what are you doing for the Grand package? Is it just the evening or all-day?

[Excalibur]

Now is the perfect time to increase your fee. Whack it up for anyone who enquires about any remaining date you have this year or next year.

One of the most important aspects of getting the fee is being confident in the fee. When you are fully booked and don't 'need' the work, it's much easier to ask for a higher fee.

Try doing it when staring at an empty diary and it's much easier to be nervous and quote a lower price 'just to get the work'.

It is indeed.

[rth_discos]

Well, can't thank you enough.

Thought about what you said, to be honest my heart isn't in it anymore so what do I have to lose ??

50% increase on fees yesterday, 2 bookings this morning. Same service, nowt fancy, just providing a disco.

Release a new 'Grand Package' (Yes it costs £1000) and had a bit interest with people wanting to upgrade.

Suppose every other business out there will have to recoup losses, why don't we ??

Excellent news, I'm pleased to hear it worked for you.

[ppentertainments]

My prices traditionally go up on 1st March.
I was planning to hold with what I was charging last year, because....well I didn't actually charge anything last year :(

However....I'm now in the position where I have a job which "sort of" pays the bills so not in a desperate hurry to rush into a Covid infested environment again any time soon.....I can wait.
I've just increased my prices by quite a bit...nothing gambled, nothing lost. There's now an entire OCEAN between me and the local Sidney. We shall see what happens :)

Chris - what are you doing for the Grand package? Is it just the evening or all-day?
I increased mine as have decided I want a job too, so less DJ work - thinking about pensions etc, so increased prices to try and have less work, same money. If things stay the same may be looking at 2 price increases in a week haha

My Grand package is an all day package - well, for a grand £1000. The play on words actually seems to be more appealing than I first thought lol.

The pricing thing really is baffling me if honest though. For example making £1000 for a days work (more for a lot of people) which lets be honest isn't exactly challenging, whereas this would currently be almost 3 WEEKS work during my covid employment.

[rth_discos]

The pricing thing really is baffling me if honest though. For example making £1000 for a days work (more for a lot of people) which lets be honest isn't exactly challenging, whereas this would currently be almost 3 WEEKS work during my covid employment.

Remember there's a difference between turnover (what you charge for a wedding) and profit (what you actually take home after costs).

Assuming you are currently employed, your take home is after tax.

Once you take into account the costs of marketing, running the business, depreciation of equipment and other associated costs, including the account, etc, the take home is much lower. But should definitely be higher to account for the risk you take of running your own business.

Your tax return from 2019/20 will reveal all - look at the difference between your turnover and what you are actually left with after expenses and tax are taken off...

[Jim - Scotland's Party DJ]

Secured another booking yesterday within 30 minutes of my quote being sent out.

I've decided to crunch the numbers for next year (2021 still looking like a bust up here unless Sturgeon gets her finger out) and to be honest, if I can book another 5 gigs (taking me up to a whopping total of 20) I'd be happy with the turnover, anything over and above that would be a bonus. Makes a big difference to doing 40 weddings a year which is what I was averaging pre-COVID.

[Centre Stage Discos]

After spending the last year buying many bits and pieces, building up the light show to a standard I've never previously been able to, I am definitely not about to offer any reduced fees. As it is, I will be increasing them. I will also be including an option for the customer to book a larger light show for a higher price. A DJ friend who has returned to DJing very recently has not reduced his prices either.

One of the golden rules of business is NEVER to undercut your competitors and I think some people forget that. It's always tempting to think that you are suddenly going to get lots more work just because you've taken 10% or 20% off your prices, but it doesn't work like that. Here's a quick story, going back hundreds of years to a time when I first started spinning my Garrard turntables (Or was it BSR?) How sweet and innocent I was back then. My prices started off way too low. I was beginning to learn about this industry and I made a good few mistakes. I think I had one booking enquiry after a month of advertising - and no actual bookings. After being advised that I would never get any work unless I increased my prices, I doubled them. That's funny .. the bookings started flooding in! Most people are clued up enough to know that a cheaply priced disco will never deliver the entertainment they require.

As for people being better off after the year we've just had, I have no doubt that there are those people who have benefited. It's been the reverse in my case. Since a good part of my work involves providing services to the entertainment industry, my work has all but dried up and I have seen one of the most difficult years, financially, that I have ever known. I'm actually looking forward to bringing in a decent whack again, so my prices are UP!

[rth_discos]

After spending the last year buying many bits and pieces, building up the light show to a standard I've never previously been able to, I am definitely not about to offer any reduced fees. As it is, I will be increasing them. I will also be including an option for the customer to book a larger light show for a higher price.

I don't know what market you're targeting, but I have never sold based on my light show - nor has any client ever asked about it other than "does it include lights".

Just highlighting that I'm not sure how many people are that interested in paying more for a 'larger light show'?

My 4 lights commands a good price lol.

[Centre Stage Discos]

I don't know what market you're targeting, but I have never sold based on my light show - nor has any client ever asked about it other than "does it include lights".

Just highlighting that I'm not sure how many people are that interested in paying more for a 'larger light show'?

My 4 lights commands a good price lol.

I'm glad to hear it. ;)

This is a point I have read in several threads. I have known a few discos who charge differently for different sizes of light shows and can point you in the direction of a well-established and hugely successful one. It's a matter of preference of course. Having done a lot of gigs at Nottingham Uni in the past I can state that many of the halls of residence used to pay a lot more for a more substantial rig. Perhaps it's just the clientele I have been used to providing for, but I would often be asked about the general number of lighting effects I carried. I think it was more a concern of customers that their disco would have nothing more than a flashing lamp and a ropelight.

I hope this isn't taking things too OT, but we all know that the overall entertainment is the most important factor, however, I just cannot go out with a couple of simple effects. I've seen it so many times and I know what people say. It doesn't have to be OTT, as long as it's appropriate for the function.

[ppentertainments]

I'm glad to hear it. ;)

This is a point I have read in several threads. I have known a few discos who charge differently for different sizes of light shows and can point you in the direction of a well-established and hugely successful one. It's a matter of preference of course. Having done a lot of gigs at Nottingham Uni in the past I can state that many of the halls of residence used to pay a lot more for a more substantial rig. Perhaps it's just the clientele I have been used to providing for, but I would often be asked about the general number of lighting effects I carried. I think it was more a concern of customers that their disco would have nothing more than a flashing lamp and a ropelight.

I hope this isn't taking things too OT, but we all know that the overall entertainment is the most important factor, however, I just cannot go out with a couple of simple effects. I've seen it so many times and I know what people say. It doesn't have to be OTT, as long as it's appropriate for the function.
What market do you target ?

[Centre Stage Discos]

The same as everybody else I suspect. Weddings, birthdays, corporate parties, military bases, pubs and clubs, bar/bat mitzvahs. I've done all sorts over the years.

[Benny Smyth]

The same as everybody else I suspect. Weddings, birthdays, corporate parties, military bases, pubs and clubs, bar/bat mitzvahs. I've done all sorts over the years.

That's the events you're going for, but what is your target market? Who is your client?

[Centre Stage Discos]

You've lost me. I'm not much up on business speak. I advertise, I get work. I work, that generates enquiries, I get repeat bookings, recommendations, etc. My 'client'? Sorry.

[Excalibur]

That's the events you're going for, but what is your target market? Who is your client?

In my case, anybody with £60, a venue and electricity. :D

Sorry Benny, I'll go off and take my tablets. :o:o

I think when Benny says " Client " he means your ideal customer. Stockbroker belt, as opposed to Jeremy Kyle's guests. You'll have to forgive Benny, he's only a child, and very fond of jargon that confuses us old folk. ;)

[Imagine]

You've lost me. I'm not much up on business speak. I advertise, I get work. I work, that generates enquiries, I get repeat bookings, recommendations, etc. My 'client'? Sorry.

We're going down the road of "Avatars" now John ;)

Who is your ideal/target client? Maybe if I share mine, you'll get the idea what Benny's on about (he has an ideal client as well but from memory he gives them names).

I have three very distinct parties I do. Weddings, older birthdays and kids parties (from age 6 to 10 only).

For weddings I have two distinct clients I aim everything at:

The first ideal wedding couple are both professionals (nurses, IT, teachers etc.) in their 30s with a modest to good income (probably in the region of £30k pa each), have already got a mortgage, like a cold beer on a hot day, like fun, drive a decent but not overstated car and have both feet well and truly on the ground. 99% of my couples fit this "avatar"

The second (and I do a fair few of these too) are second-timers (I've done third and fourth timers as well), slightly older than the first example, still in professional careers, the kids have grown up (and are normally in the role of best man, chief bridesmaid), they've already done everything in life and just want to relax and have fun....there are no airs and graces at these ones because they've already done that.

For general parties, the avatars are actually very similar to the second wedding couple (so in the "older" generation of 40+), but still in a reasonable career and earning good money. Again, the kids are off-hand, the mortgage is paid or nearly there and they're just starting to live life to the full (sort of where I am in life so it's easier to put myself in this avatar's shoes)

Believe it or not, even for the kids parties I'm targeting a certain type of parent!

Why all the waffle about Avatars?

Simple - I'm not the best fit for everyone that approaches me and I can't be bothered with the tyre kickers (I got fed up of being sworn at over the phone when I told them my prices). I don't do social clubs, 18th's, 21st's, Christenings, pubs or teen parties. I actually turn away a LOT of enquiries every year because....well they're just not gigs I'm going to feel I've been able to do my best at. Even by turning a number of enquiries away, I can earn a very comfortable full time living out of what I do when I'm allowed to (certainly 2-3 times what the average supermarket delivery driver can earn in a year....and I'm only working 1-2 days a week!)

By targeting a specific type of person with the website and my marketing, those people come to me and those (without being snobby) that can't afford my rates...don't (very often).

Put it this way....I've spent an awful lot of my time during lockdown honing my website to appeal to the Avatars mentioned above. I even publish my prices (nothing to hide). By the time they contact me, they've already bought into what I can do for them and they're pretty much ready to book without too many questions - the website does it all for me :)

To go back to the light show thing (sorry, been out working tonight....again :( ), I do something similar, but not similar. I have several different configurations of kit (white, retro, rustic), and yes I show them on the site. It's not about the number of lights (because trust me, two ADJ Hex's and two Chauvet Intimidator 305s are my daily toolkit for most parties). It's more about how things are going to look on the day with weddings. Most of the couples I work with want powerful but understated - they don't want the workings of the local nightclub plonked into the corner of their expensively decorated tent so shows with massive numbers of lights really don't turn them on.

Right - it's been a very long, very hot shift (and NO - supermarket delivery van's AREN'T air conditioned). It's time for a couple of very large sherries!


In my case, anybody with £60, a venue and electricity. :D

Sorry Benny, I'll go off and take my tablets. :o:o

I think when Benny says " Client " he means your ideal customer. Stockbroker belt, as opposed to Jeremy Kyle's guests. You'll have to forgive Benny, he's only a child, and very fond of jargon that confuses us old folk. ;)

Oi - I'm old and I understand :Naughty:.

OK, not as ancient as you, but we discussed this over waaaaay too many beers on Broad Street several years ago!

Mod note: You may understand Avatars, but still not conversant with the ten minute edit. Posts merged. :p

[Centre Stage Discos]

Client/elle = customers. Same difference to me. If you are referring to the type of people I am targeting then there is no target. It's 'The public'! if you are able to choose your customers because you have so much work that you can afford to turn it down just because you don't like a certain branch of society then you are very lucky.

The more I look through the posts on this forum, the more I find contradictions to everything I've learnt over the years. The latest one was the light show being of secondary importance. As I see it it's of equal importance to everything else in a show. DJ presentation, the sound, my attire, I could go on, (A good sound would be my own personal 'essential'.) but my own experience has shown that a good light show has often been one the main requirements for any kind of booking. "Do you have a good light show?" Yes, and I couldn't go on the road without a substantial light show. Define 'substantial'. OK, better than 'just enough, 'impressive'. A kind of wow factor but not to detract from the main event - the wedding itself, etc. No disco is more important than the people at the event.

If I could have a £fiver for the number of people who have given advice over the years never to turn down work... Yes, there are some branches of this industry I wouldn't be so keen to take on anymore, children's parties for instance, but I've done scores over the years and without a problem. No, I wouldn't do them. I'm too old and less tolerant of the little ... darlings.

You have to take the rough with the smooth. I'm not about to turn down work just because it's for Joe Bloggs off a council estate. I've done them all. Plush weddings in stately homes right down to an eight year old's birthday party in a brothel. (I kid you not!) I've been extremely lucky to have provided services for more areas in society that I would have ever dared to dream.

I could even generalise here, but this is based on my own experience, but I've always found that the poorer in society have always been the best payers. "Let's have a whip round for the DJ!" Those lavish weddings and functions in people's homes with acres of gardens, you know the kind, you set up your gear after a half mile trek across beautifully landscaped gardens to the huge marquee just next to the pool and the tennis courts, and I've usually never even met the organisers because their personal wedding planners or the butler have been given the job of organising the entertainment.

Sorry, but 'everybody' is/are my potential clients and I'm not about to try and guess or to judge anybody based on their income bracket, social or any other status.

Back on-topic. Getting the price right is surely the thing to do here. How do you know to know what to charge? A bit of research is needed. There should be enough data out there to know what a sensible price is. I don't think it takes a genius to know that most people are a little short after the last year's problems. Money is going to be a little tighter. If I have to reduce my prices due to necessity then so be it, but it is not my intention to lower any prices right now.

[Benny Smyth]

Client/elle = customers. Same difference to me. If you are referring to the type of people I am targeting then there is no target. It's 'The public'! if you are able to choose your customers because you have so much work that you can afford to turn it down just because you don't like a certain branch of society then you are very lucky.

The more I look through the posts on this forum, the more I find contradictions to everything I've learnt over the years. The latest one was the light show being of secondary importance. As I see it it's of equal importance to everything else in a show. DJ presentation, the sound, my attire, I could go on, (A good sound would be my own personal 'essential'.) but my own experience has shown that a good light show has often been one the main requirements for any kind of booking. "Do you have a good light show?" Yes, and I couldn't go on the road without a substantial light show. Define 'substantial'. OK, better than 'just enough, 'impressive'. A kind of wow factor but not to detract from the main event - the wedding itself, etc. No disco is more important than the people at the event.

If I could have a £fiver for the number of people who have given advice over the years never to turn down work... Yes, there are some branches of this industry I wouldn't be so keen to take on anymore, children's parties for instance, but I've done scores over the years and without a problem. No, I wouldn't do them. I'm too old and less tolerant of the little ... darlings.

You have to take the rough with the smooth. I'm not about to turn down work just because it's for Joe Bloggs off a council estate. I've done them all. Plush weddings in stately homes right down to an eight year old's birthday party in a brothel. (I kid you not!) I've been extremely lucky to have provided services for more areas in society that I would have ever dared to dream.

I could even generalise here, but this is based on my own experience, but I've always found that the poorer in society have always been the best payers. "Let's have a whip round for the DJ!" Those lavish weddings and functions in people's homes with acres of gardens, you know the kind, you set up your gear after a half mile trek across beautifully landscaped gardens to the huge marquee just next to the pool and the tennis courts, and I've usually never even met the organisers because their personal wedding planners or the butler have been given the job of organising the entertainment.

Sorry, but 'everybody' is/are my potential clients and I'm not about to try and guess or to judge anybody based on their income bracket, social or any other status.

Back on-topic. Getting the price right is surely the thing to do here. How do you know to know what to charge? A bit of research is needed. There should be enough data out there to know what a sensible price is. I don't think it takes a genius to know that most people are a little short after the last year's problems. Money is going to be a little tighter. If I have to reduce my prices due to necessity then so be it, but it is not my intention to lower any prices right now.

I think there is a misunderstanding to the benefits of targeting your services to a certain clientele. It has nothing to do with any judgement of status, nor is it because we're batting away so much work. In fact, zeroing in on your target client over a catch-all approach is what brings in the most work (a singular nail will penetrate more than a bed of nails, if you will). Whether it's stately homes, or the local golf club, once you really work out the client you want to attract, it becomes a lot easier and more efficient to market towards them.

Let's take a Wayne vs. Benny.

Wayne and I have a lot of similarities in our approach to what we do. Despite that, I bet you our target clients are not even remotely similar, except in one way - those we cater to book us because we cater specifically to that audience. I dare say that there are some outliers among our clients, but if you stood all of my past clients in a line, despite those outliers, you would spot a consistency very quickly. £50 says the exact same would happen if we did the same for Wayne's clients. I would actually go as far to say that were we to do the same for you, there would be a consistency in there somewhere.

If the catch-all approach works for you and you're happy with it, then that's great and in no way am I going to try and convince you otherwise. The only thing I can contribute is my anecdotal experience, and I can say categorically that understanding who I am and who my clients are has improved my business exponentially. Despite the pandemic, I have implemented my planned price increase (albeit 12 months later than originally planned) and based on the number on enquiries I am still converting, I honestly do not see any reason why anyone should consider dropping their prices.

[Excalibur]

The more I look through the posts on this forum, the more I find contradictions to everything I've learnt over the years. The latest one was the light show being of secondary importance.

Welcome to The Road To Damascus. I've done gigs with one unit, and thought how good it looked. ( Mind you, it was the one that masquerades as a lighthouse, the Thomann Powerbar). :D As Wayne says, Two scanners/barrels, and two washes is very common. And more than adequate for many functions.

And in the interests of balance, I've also loaded up an overhead with nearly everything I had. Rare occasions nowadays.



I could even generalise here, but this is based on my own experience, but I've always found that the poorer in society have always been the best payers. "Let's have a whip round for the DJ!" Those lavish weddings and functions in people's homes with acres of gardens, you know the kind, you set up your gear after a half mile trek across beautifully landscaped gardens to the huge marquee just next to the pool and the tennis courts, and I've usually never even met the organisers because their personal wedding planners or the butler have been given the job of organising the entertainment.

Sorry, but 'everybody' is/are my potential clients and I'm not about to try and guess or to judge anybody based on their income bracket, social or any other status.
I have had similar experiences, but must add I've been treated well or badly by all social standings. The nicest talk a host ever gave acts was working with a Caribbean Steel Band, from an island near Leeds. :D:D He came up to us all and said: " Now I know you're all working here, but you're also guests. You want a drink, you get a drink. You want food, you get food. " Simples.



I don't think it takes a genius to know that most people are a little short after the last year's problems. Money is going to be a little tighter. If I have to reduce my prices due to necessity then so be it, but it is not my intention to lower any prices right now.
Now I must disagree here. Some folk have been saving money hand over fist currently, no fuel costs, no sandwiches/coffee at the office, and similar. No foreign holidays, and other expenses, so some folk definitely have wonga to spare. Granted, Sid will be snapping at our heels, for the ten hour back garden parties for fifty quid, and he can have them. Only problem is convincing clients he's not the best idea for their daughter's weddding. ;)


This will be a learning curve for you here, but it will undoubtedly be worth it. Hang in there.

[DJ Jules]

Back on-topic. Getting the price right is surely the thing to do here. How do you know to know what to charge? A bit of research is needed. There should be enough data out there to know what a sensible price is. I don't think it takes a genius to know that most people are a little short after the last year's problems. Money is going to be a little tighter. If I have to reduce my prices due to necessity then so be it, but it is not my intention to lower any prices right now.

Identify your target market and find a niche that works for you and you can forget about sensible prices and what your competition is doing and pretty much name your fee.

Money is tighter at the bottom of the market right now, the pandemic has increased financial disparity. The poor got poorer and the middle class and rich got richer.

If your ideal customer is sat at the bottom end of the market, you'll be taking a price cut, if you're targeting middle or high earners, you're in a position to maintain or increase your fees. This is why targeting and customer profiling is so important.

[Excalibur]

Identify your target market and find a niche that works for you and you can forget about sensible prices and what your competition is doing and pretty much name your fee.

Money is tighter at the bottom of the market right now, the pandemic has increased financial disparity. The poor got poorer and the middle class and rich got richer.

If your ideal customer is sat at the bottom end of the market, you'll be taking a price cut, if you're targeting middle or high earners, you're in a position to maintain or increase your fees. This is why targeting and customer profiling is so important.

Give that man any prize from the top shelf. :approve:

[Imagine]

Give that man any prize from the top shelf. :approve:

Julian said in a nutshell what Benny and me were trying to say.

Trust me John, when I came back into the wonderful world of being a mobile DJ back in 2012 (is it really that long ago?), I didn't get the target market thing. I certainly didn't get the less is more attitude having previously been a DJ with an absolutely MAHUSIVE light show. Wedding Togs don't LIKE big light shows, and they're more important than us! (because their images last long after the evening party)

I originally started back in 1987 (when my Retro Show was fashionable!), and took a hiatus from 1995 to 2012 to raise my kids and do a "proper" job. In 2012 I was where you are now....and it was one hell of a shock to the system in the way things had changed.

I followed several industry "gurus" and paid a lot of money for their advice (some good, some not so good). With the industry marketing gurus you tend to take what's needed from their advice and build on it. This thread is public so I won't name and shame any of those people here!

I have nothing against ANY type of client (believe me, I've done them all including travellers). If they can afford my price, I'll be there. BUT, I don't negotiate, I don't discount....my price is my price and it works because what I offer is worth it. It's also what I need to bring in to make a profit and live...simple as!

My PREFERRED customer though is as mentioned earlier in the thread. 99% of the time we "hit it off", make lifelong friends and have a damned good party because we're so similar. I've actually had a massive input into many of those weddings due to my experience, and my fee reflects that!

THOSE parties these days are the ones to live for and the client will ALWAYS recommend you to their friends.

My bread and butter is weddings...it's how I make my living, pay my mortgage and afford holidays. Jim will say the same as me as well (and he's a LOT more expensive than me for doing essentially the same job!).

Brides and grooms/grooms and grooms/brides and brides really don't want to see every single fixture ever made at their wedding these days. The presentation of the rig is important, but the number of lights really doesn't impress them nowadays I'm afraid :(. Add to that, they want the lighting "tamed" by DMX to create different atmospheres (i.e. romantic first dance, club type last dance)

And it's not just about the evening party either! I do a LOT of ALL DAY weddings where I'm there early doors to provide the music and mic's for the ceremony, the background for the wedding breakfast (and trust me....Sweet Caroline is a belter randomly played during the afternoon in the right place and Oh! the games!!!!), and only THEN the evening party.

The "industry" and customer expectations have changed a LOT over recent years. There IS a market for the "turn up and press play" DJ, but you'll be competing with £60 Sid in that market sadly.

The big money is in being able to host a wedding as a master of ceremonies and still pull off the evening party using a lightweight and understated rig. It's an 18 hour day, but for £1k plus...it's worth it to realise that less is more!

Hope that makes some sort of sense - I've done another very long and hot shift tonight and am running on fumes but thought I needed to add my experience and knowledge of how things work now ;)

I'm not a snob, I don't reject certain customer demographics...it's just that not EVERY customer is MY customer!

[Excalibur]

My Fenland Friend is pretty much right in what he says. Many of the most successful people don't even have " rig pics " on their site. They're selling themselves, and clients trust that they will have the skill to use whatever suits their event best.

The days of measuring the quality of a Roadshow* by the acre have gone, especially since Dicky went off to foreign climes.

* For our younger readers, a Disco was what we all had. The big boys had a Roadshow, fifty feet of light screens, enough colourspots to make Greta Thunberg cry, strobes and maybe even Go-Go dancers! :eek::eek:

Times have changed. In many ways, it's progress. In others, well the jury's out on that.

[Jim - Scotland's Party DJ]

My bread and butter is weddings...it's how I make my living, pay my mortgage and afford holidays. Jim will say the same as me as well (and he's a LOT more expensive than me for doing essentially the same job!).

Brides and grooms/grooms and grooms/brides and brides really don't want to see every single fixture ever made at their wedding these days. The presentation of the rig is important, but the number of lights really doesn't impress them nowadays I'm afraid :(. Add to that, they want the lighting "tamed" by DMX to create different atmospheres (i.e. romantic first dance, club type last dance)

And it's not just about the evening party either! I do a LOT of ALL DAY weddings where I'm there early doors to provide the music and mic's for the ceremony, the background for the wedding breakfast (and trust me....Sweet Caroline is a belter randomly played during the afternoon in the right place and Oh! the games!!!!), and only THEN the evening party.

The "industry" and customer expectations have changed a LOT over recent years. There IS a market for the "turn up and press play" DJ, but you'll be competing with £60 Sid in that market sadly.

The big money is in being able to host a wedding as a master of ceremonies and still pull off the evening party using a lightweight and understated rig. It's an 18 hour day, but for £1k plus...it's worth it to realise that less is more!



I can't remember disclosing my fees publicly on here but by the by I start at £795 for evening only weddings or £895 if you want moodlights.

I don't really like doing all dayers tbf but you're getting well into 4 figures for that malarkey and you know what, people are still booking.

I've taken 4 this week. Yesterday I sent a quote around 3 and the contract and booking fee was back to me by 5.

It's nothing to do with the lights - 2 0.5m hex bars and 2 mini dekkers as it happens at my end. It's about doing lots of little things really well and ultimately making the bride and groom 150% secure that you're great at your job and will take care of the things they won't even realise need to be worried about. Any dafty can play some music but being professional and making things run like clockwork is what people really value. There's diminishing returns with birtgdays etc... but the right client will still value it. Those who don't, I'm way past worrying about them.

My big big boss at my kiddy on job has encouraged me to apply for a promotion that's well beyond my experience and pay grade (I'm well paid as is and we're talking another £20k on top) I doubt I'll get it but I've applied anyway and when I told her it was a massive step up and she must know better people for it her response was something like: "it's not really though, you do your job really well and when I need something done by you, I know it's going to get done on time and well, I don't need to worry about it" same principle, that 20k is worth her knowing stuff is getting done properly.

[ppentertainments]

The BIG thing to consider whenever looking at pricing, target market etc is what YOU are hoping to gain.

If you are only looking for a few a year to top up your existing income then yeah, you can probably aim higher than if it is your full time job and you run a full time business. If you are full time you need to look at overall turnover and profit.

Don't be sucked in with the high flyers who are full time - it is amazing how many were first in the queue for jobs at Amazon and DPD when all this kicked off. Whereas others who actually ran a business rather than do as little work as possible, were able to ride things out, for a few months anyway.

Look at what you want out of it, then you can choose where to aim for.

[rth_discos]

The more I look through the posts on this forum, the more I find contradictions to everything I've learnt over the years. The latest one was the light show being of secondary importance. As I see it it's of equal importance to everything else in a show. DJ presentation, the sound, my attire, I could go on, (A good sound would be my own personal 'essential'.) but my own experience has shown that a good light show has often been one the main requirements for any kind of booking.

One thing I must highlight is that there isn't "one" way to do things. But there are proven methods to attract customers - and many of these methods are tried and tested across a variety of industries, and aren't unique to the DJ industry. Hence why you may see some common theories being presented in the thread (all of which are proven to work). Equally, you'll hear of others who have other methods, that also work.

The reason people mention "who is your ideal customer" is based around how many people search for a DJ.

Let's say I am a couple, in the mid 30s, getting married in a marquee in a field and want a relaxed day, who would they pick:

1: A generic DJ who performs at all types of functions playing all types of music
2: A DJ who presents themselves as a specialist marquee wedding DJ, aiming to create a fun but relaxed environment

And that's the point - many "generic" DJs can miss out on work because there's another DJ who is more 'targeted' at the customers. And often, when a customer is more concerned about getting the "right" DJ, they are less price sensitive.

Once you're in the realm of "generic DJ", often, the client can be more price sensitive (the theory behind this is often there's little to differentiate you against other "generic DJs" other than the price. At which point, why not just pay for the cheapest one, seeing as they all look the same...

As for the lights - sure - there might be a nice of clients who are particular about the lights. Or if could be that you're targeting events of 250+ people, of which many DJs don't have the right equipment to cater for.

But for typical events, I previously had an incredible light show based on just 2 x Chauvet Intimidator Barrel 305s and 2 x Chauvet Intimidator Trio moving heads.

4 lights in total, but very powerful and versatile lights, and controlled by DMX they looked amazing.

A couple of years ago I actually downsized the lights to similar, but smaller lights to make load in/load out easier. I still charge the same, and no-one ever mentioned anything about either light show. They both provide perfectly good 'disco lighting'. So maybe the first setup was more for me than the client? If anything, in my view, it's the DMX control that makes the lights look great.

Anyway, back to the topic of pricing, and this bit is important:



Don't be sucked in with the high flyers who are full time - it is amazing how many were first in the queue for jobs at Amazon and DPD when all this kicked off. Whereas others who actually ran a business rather than do as little work as possible, were able to ride things out, for a few months anyway.


There's a saying that "turnover is vanity, profit is sanity".

What that means in a practical sense, is don't worry too much about your 'price', but do worry about your profit you make from the gig.

As suggested above, there were many DJs who it appears weren't making as much profit per gig as the headline price might suggest. Yes, their fee might be impressive, but when you look at the costs involved for many of them, their profit over the year was often less than someone charging less per gig.

That's not to try and justify low pricing, but more to warn that if you feel you can only increase your prices through extra expense, watch out to ensure the profit increases to justify that expense.

[Imagine]

As suggested above, there were many DJs who it appears weren't making as much profit per gig as the headline price might suggest. Yes, their fee might be impressive, but when you look at the costs involved for many of them, their profit over the year was often less than someone charging less per gig

I know a lot of those.

Sadly some of us were making a healthy profit as part timers though, but only made the decision to go full time less than a year before everything kicked off :(

[Excalibur]

1: A generic DJ who performs at all types of functions playing all types of music
2: A DJ who presents themselves as a specialist marquee wedding DJ, aiming to create a fun but relaxed environment



Gavin, I applaud you. You've explained something to me very clearly that I never realised before. Well done. Don't let the praise go to your head, though. When you're describing me, it's not Generic, it's Geriatric! :Laugh:

[rth_discos]

I know a lot of those.

Sadly some of us were making a healthy profit as part timers though, but only made the decision to go full time less than a year before everything kicked off :(

I am still absolutely gutted by your journey over the past 15 months.

You were the textbook example of positioning yourself correctly, getting all the foundations in place, making the transition from part-time to full-time and then, just at the wrong moment, everything changes, in a way that no business plan would have ever predicted.

With the profit thing, there were many DJs who were going to America each year, some were sending out fairly expensive gifts to each of their clients, and other miscellaneous costs, many of which weren't direct costs of a gig. I had always wondered if the additional £200 per gig of costs was actually translating to additional profit, or if they would have been better off spending less, and charging less. Again, it's not that I'm saying that way was "wrong", but wondering if it was good business sense.

[Excalibur]

Gavin, at last I think I understand exactly what you're trying to say about Avatars. It makes absolute sense.

The problem is, for ( older? ) people like John and I, who tend to cast our nets far and wide in the search for customers, it's a seismic change to contemplate targeting one particular sector of society as our clients.

I was persuaded not to go ahead with my cunning plan to launch an additional website along the lines of www.bestbloodyYorkshireweddingdjforpeoplewithlotso fmoney.com to see if I could persuade these good folk that I was the only sensible choice for their function.

It seems to me that " DJs of negotiable virtue " like myself are doomed to fall between two stools. Not a dedicated wedding specialist ( even if we are capable of giving a service to match many of these specialists ) and not eligible to charge large fees, and always with Sid snapping at our heels. " He's got a website, lights, speakers and two gazillion tracks ( as long as the WiFi holds up, tee hee :D ) , and he only charges £50 and a crate of Stella. You're just too expensive".


:confused:

[rth_discos]

It seems to me that " DJs of negotiable virtue " like myself are doomed to fall between two stools. Not a dedicated wedding specialist ( even if we are capable of giving a service to match many of these specialists ) and not eligible to charge large fees, and always with Sid snapping at our heels. " He's got a website, lights, speakers and two gazillion tracks ( as long as the WiFi holds up, tee hee :D ) , and he only charges £50 and a crate of Stella. You're just too expensive".


See my earlier message. When both you and SID offer the same thing (DJ, will turn up with speakers, lights and music), then the only differentiator is the price. So of course you're more expensive. Why pay more for the same thing (which is in essence, what the comparison is).

So it's all about how you differentiate yourself.

Just saying you've got bags of experience doesn't count anymore. SID says the same stuff on his website too. Some SIDs now even present with a pretty decent looking website. So those previous ways of differentiating against SID are losing traction, quickly - you may have noticed this change over recent years.

So what about you is different?

Now, you don't need to niche down as much as I suggested. In reality, the more you niche down, the smaller the pool of potential customers, and then you need to make sure you get in front of them. For a while, I successfully operated 2 different websites covering 2 different areas, knowing that one area wouldn't book a DJ from the other area and vice-versa. There could be something in having a number of very specialist websites. But that comes with the additional cost and time in marketing all of them.

On a more 'top line' level, my understanding is that you have a pretty good knowledge of rock music... and you seem to enjoy those gigs when requested for that music. So why not mention that? What are you like on the mic? Do you like to use it, not use it, or just it a *lot*?

Essentially, think about your ideal gig, and what makes them great. Then think about what is common about the people who booked you for those gigs, and appeal to them.

At the same time, think about the gigs you don't like. Tell people on the website what you don't want to do - actively turn them away.

Essentially, find some elements in what you enjoy to highlight that differentiates you from SID.

[Imagine]

^^^^ He's right you know ;)

It was actually Gavin (many years ago now in a hotel somewhere near Reading I think it was....it was an early start and a long drive) that persuaded myself and a couple of others in this neck of the woods to focus a little differently. It took guts and it took a lot of time....but it worked! I seem to remember the lunch was fairly good too ;)

My website used to aim at everyone and anything - a booking was a booking in those days (and by heck did I do some rough ones then for VERY little reward!). Yes I'll admit it...I WAS Sid for a while!.

It's now aimed mainly at weddings (even the retro page mentions retro weddings). Yes, I still do other gigs like older birthdays and of course the diary filling kids parties. The weddings of course are aimed at my ideal client and I always focus on my favourite ones because I want more of those. Those that tend to book me for the birthdays and anniversaries do so because they trust me to do the same job as I do at weddings.

Most of the images of weddings on my website are shot in marquees, barns or stately homes...that's the first clue prospective clients get as to what I do (and that alone tends to send away those looking for cheap and cheerful - I've monitored it with different images in different places!)

You'll notice if you look back through the Good Gig Bad Gig thread that the majority of mine are in marquees or barns, or in my favourite permanent marquee venue just down the road (this is the odd one out because although I like working there, it's very much a "wedding factory"). Most of them are very much DIY affairs without the interference of planners and the like (I prefer to deal direct with the couples and even offer them advice), and there's a lot of input from family members too (and yes I work with mothers and fathers of the couple as well!)

These are the weddings I target and these are the majority of the weddings I now do.

I don't have any residencies, I don't pay to advertise, I rely solely on my website to sell what I do.

My website focuses on a couple of things:
* I do a lot of marquee weddings
* I do a lot of barn/rustic weddings
* I do a lot of weddings.
* I do weddings which are more than just the evening party (not everyone's cup of tea because they're blimmin' long days....but there aren't that many that will take on an all day wedding from ceremony to carriages in this neck of the woods!)

What I also publicly publish is a "gig log" of every wedding on my blog....warts and all. I like to be honest with my customers to show them what's worked and what hasn't...and what I do. That includes the playlist for the night. From that alone, they can see that I'm mainly about music from the 70s to the 90s (did they make music after the 90s?). I've had a LOT of my customers mention whilst booking me that they've seen these playlists and that THAT'S what they want at THEIR wedding.

The content of the pages is written in the voice of my favourite customers (remember from a previous post that I have TWO distinct wedding couples in mind), and I literally have their voices and the way they speak in my head every time I put new content on there. I'm trying to get into my ideal clients' heads and talk to them in their language. Yes there's also a lot of technical SEO stuff going on in the background but content is the biggest thing for the search engines and prospective clients finding you in the first place!

So what do YOU do that's different?

As Gavin alludes to, you could sell the fact that you love Rock music (or indeed ANY genre in the massive knowledge of music you have). You could sell the fact that you like to have FUN (I've seen he pictures of you in various wigs :daft:). You could sell the fact that you're not a fan of "action dances" as I believe Justin does. Think what it is that YOU'RE good at and why previous customers have hired you for THAT GIG, and sell it!

There's a chap you may or may not of heard of (not "technically" a DJ but appears at a LOT of weddings) called Norry Ashcroft (aka...Lionel Vinyl....ohhh yeah!). He markets himself as a cheesy seventies afro disco singer and it works....and works very well for him! In real life, he's nothing like a cheesy afro disco singer by the way and lives up North in Blackpool ;)

Heck - think of Jive Bunny (who STILL does a lot of weddings) or even Disco Boy (haven't seen him around since the toilet roll selling debacle last year). Even DJ Best Price had a selling point which was unique to him.

Another thing people are looking for now is PROOF (and I don't just mean photo's of lights and people dancing). They want to see other people's opinions. Invite previous customers to review on Google and TrustPilot (TP is a big SEO feed in as well by the way!). Even if you get the odd negative one it's not a bad thing (100% positive feedback is a little suspicious to most!). I've even got reviews at the moment which mention that I've been helpful in rearranging things due to the Covid situation.

And love them or hate them......I'm going to mention the elephant in the room anyway.....AWARDS! Despite what the haters on Facebook groups say, they can help to separate you from your competition by miles. Winning one is pure marketing gold! I used to be one of the haters until I won one, and then several more. Trust me, they really DO set you apart from the rest of the crowd at times.

Right - I'm going to bed. Busy and hot night last night at the end of a 9 day run of shifts without a day off, and still trying to digest the latest updates and what that means for the poor couples that will doubtless be in contact tomorrow after talking to their venues.......

[Marc J]

See my earlier message. When both you and SID offer the same thing (DJ, will turn up with speakers, lights and music), then the only differentiator is the price. So of course you're more expensive. Why pay more for the same thing (which is in essence, what the comparison is).

So it's all about how you differentiate yourself.

Just saying you've got bags of experience doesn't count anymore. SID says the same stuff on his website too. Some SIDs now even present with a pretty decent looking website. So those previous ways of differentiating against SID are losing traction, quickly - you may have noticed this change over recent years.

So what about you is different?


Another thing people are looking for now is PROOF (and I don't just mean photo's of lights and people dancing). They want to see other people's opinions. Invite previous customers to review on Google and TrustPilot (TP is a big SEO feed in as well by the way!). Even if you get the odd negative one it's not a bad thing (100% positive feedback is a little suspicious to most!). I've even got reviews at the moment which mention that I've been helpful in rearranging things due to the Covid situation.

This. It's easy to put up a slick website with a bunch of stolen photos and lies, but Sid will they'll eventually get bad reviews. So, they change name, and start again, always starting with a few (fake) "good" reviews but once their average star rating drops, they reinvent themselves - rinse & repeat. You, on the other hand, will build up many genuine good reviews over a long time, and the public will see this.

Different market I know but, one of my clients, a joinery / builder / double glazing supplier, always asks customers for Google reviews and has a far better average score than anyone else locally, with 5 star reviews going back 7 years (https://www.google.com/search?hl=en-GB&gl=uk&q=Finesse,+10+Randolph+Court,+Randolph+Industrial+ Estate,+Kirkcaldy+KY1+2YY#lrd=0x4887b4e568de8f6d:0 xe0c73ca8daee6ace,1). This is priceless and, at the initial web search stage, is what will get you an enquiry when all else seems to be equal.

On that point - Wayne, your MDD listing has an issue with your Google PlaceID. It's no longer pulling reviews or updating your star rating, the error Google gives is "NOT_FOUND - The provided Place ID is no longer valid. Please refresh cached Place ID". Google's help page on this says: -


The NOT_FOUND status code indicates that the specified place ID is obsolete. A place ID may become obsolete if a business closes or moves to a new location. Place IDs may change due to large-scale updates on the Google Maps database. In such cases, a place may receive a new place ID, and the old ID returns a NOT_FOUND response.

In particular, some types of place IDs may sometimes cause a NOT_FOUND response, or the API may return a different place ID in the response. These place ID types include:

Street addresses that do not exist in Google Maps as precise addresses, but are inferred from a range of addresses.

[Benny Smyth]

SID says the same stuff on his website too. Some SIDs now even present with a pretty decent looking website.


This. It's easy to put up a slick website with a bunch of stolen photos and lies, but Sid will they'll eventually get bad reviews.

Whilst I appreciate the kind comments about my website guys, I'm starting to feel like these are back-handed compliments.

[Jim - Scotland's Party DJ]

I've just taken on a mood lighting booking (12 units) for £400... Battery controlled so they literally take say 5 minutes to programme, 2 minutes to drop down, an hours worth of driving and then a night sat in the hotel bar with a coffee and a book :D :D :D

If I end up with a DJ enquiry for the date it's easy enough to sub out - £100 for a shift like that where you don't need to lift a speaker?...

[ppentertainments]

I see DJs are reverting back to the monotonous price per gig obsession.

Fair enough if you do this as a hobby, but for me the income per week/month/year is all I focus on.

in 2 weeks time I have a booking where I am getting over £2k, yet this is nowhere near what 'I charge', yet I know many take their best every paying gig and use that as a make belief base figure. Always amazes me too how these 'high flyers' aren't VAT registered, which lets face it isn't exactly a high figure.

Really thought this might change.

[Jim - Scotland's Party DJ]

I see DJs are reverting back to the monotonous price per gig obsession.

Fair enough if you do this as a hobby, but for me the income per week/month/year is all I focus on.

in 2 weeks time I have a booking where I am getting over £2k, yet this is nowhere near what 'I charge', yet I know many take their best every paying gig and use that as a make belief base figure. Always amazes me too how these 'high flyers' aren't VAT registered, which lets face it isn't exactly a high figure.

Really thought this might change.

You can do this part time and still run it as a business, not a hobby.

Plus, higher price per gig = better whatever way you slice it as long as you get the amount of work you want.

[Excalibur]

I see DJs are reverting back to the monotonous price per gig obsession.

Fair enough if you do this as a hobby, but for me the income per week/month/year is all I focus on.

.

Absolutely. To achieve my desired figure, allowing for holidays, I only need to work three hundred and thirty three days this year. ;)

[Imagine]

Absolutely. To achieve my desired figure, allowing for holidays, I only need to work three hundred and thirty three days this year. ;)

With the way I'm going at the moment - I might just achieve that particular goal!
2 out of three done this week and I'm shattered already

[ppentertainments]

Absolutely. To achieve my desired figure, allowing for holidays, I only need to work three hundred and thirty three days this year. ;)

We need to get our heads together to find out how we can do 2 weddings on the same night :D:D:D

[Excalibur]

We need to get our heads together to find out how we can do 2 weddings on the same night :D:D:D

Seems we'd have more success nailing jelly to the ceiling! :(:(

( For those not privy to the joke, Chris has been offering me work for many a year, and as yet I have not succeeded in fulfilling a booking for him. If my customer who stopped me doing so on the last occasion doesn't get back in touch soon, I'll be back on the market). :mad: