USB mixers

[bluishbob]

Hi all,

As suggested i downloaded Audacity....Brillian....really pleased with it. Now started thinking about a live PA mixer. Have been looking at some of the peavey 12/14/16 with digital effects and USB connection.

I am looking to use it for small bands, with a little reverb and distortion on mics and guitars, also a little recording. Is peavey a good way to go, or are there better mixers out there.

Also how is the best way to get the signal into audacity. I have been using a little mixer with a stereo output into my 'mic in' on my laptop. Could i use this USB connection on the mixer or would it need a different program.

Generally advice please.

[DMX Will]

Hi Jamie,


I am looking to use it for small bands, with a little reverb and distortion on mics and guitars, also a little recording. Is peavey a good way to go, or are there better mixers out there.

I've done a fair bit of PA work for bands over the past 6-7 years, now, you need to ask yourself why you want to record? Is this just a side line for when your doing PA for bands?

Recording live can be the hardest thing, and the main problem is what you can hear in the room, isn't what the mixer can hear, as obviously you've got guitars and drums at different levels, as they make their own noise as well as coming out of the FOH PA. I whole heartly suggest you try recording through the REC out of your mixer at your first gig, as it's a learning curve and you'll soon understand what I mean.

Your other option of course is to place one or two microphones half way, or at the back of the hall, then simply record what these microphones pick up, which is a true representation of what you can hear (mix wise) in the room. However, you will also pick up the crowd (which may be a good thing), and you might get the odd chap shouting down it, to show off to his mates. The quality of such recordings tends to be rather naff too.

As reverb goes, I wouldn't worry too much at first, don't worry about signal processors just yet, sort yourself out with a nice loud PA and a good mixer. Then you can start thinking about EQs and FX processors, as well as snakes (long multicore, so you can sit at the back of the room). You also mention distortion, which is the last thing you want to do to any mic channel. If the guitars require distortion, the players will add this in as an when. It's simple, you would actually be a bad sound tech if you started doing this! So don't!

I would recommend to you a mixer such as this:

http://www.thomann.de/gb/behringer_xenyx_2222_fx.htm

These are great little mixers for the money, and are great to start off with. Depending on how much mic-in' up you want to do, you might want to go for the 24 or 32 channel version. The above mixer is a 24 channel mixer, which gives you 8 mic inputs. So typical band setup:

1. Main Vox
2. Backing Vox 1 (unusual in younger bands)
3. Back Vox 2 (even more unsual in younger bands)
4. Guitar 1
5. Guitar 2
6. Bass D.I (direct injection - this basically means a direct connection to the mixer...no mic involved)
7. Snare Drum
8. Kick Drum

You might also want to add an overhead mic (condenser) but if you buy a battery operated one (rather than a phantom power'd mic) you could easily plug this mic into one of the line-ins on your mixer if required.

The way you are running your sound into audacity at the moment is OK, although Mic inputs are not designed to take in Line levels, so you might find you get some distortion. To resove this, lower the level, OR buy a USB sound card that will allow you to plug into a Line In connection.

With regards to USB mixers, I have the Numark CM200 USB mixer, I don't use it for the USB, I thought it would be a good idea, but it's not overly useful if I'm honest. I would forget the USB idea, and stick with the traditional way of hooking it all up, it will work just as well if you set everything up properly, and test it before hand.

You will also find that bands will require their own mix of the sound, they might want just vocals, or guitar 2 and the kick drum etc, it depends upon the band. The way we give them their own mini mix is through the Auxillary channels (Aux). On the suggested mixer you have two of these channels. I think you have one PRE and one POST Aux.

PRE means before the fader. I.E: If the main fader for that channel is at 0, the sound will still be sent to that Aux channel at the stated level.

POST means after the fader, so if the main fader was at 0, that Aux channel wouldn't be outputting that channel, it sort of works as a percentage. If the main fader is at half the sound will be quieter coming out of the aux compared with if the main fader is at full.

Every channel has these two rotary knobs, so you can set different levels for each channel for each Aux. Hope that all makes sense.

You then get two Jack outputs Aux 1 and Aux 2, you can then plug these into things like your external FX processor (I personally, would use the PRE Aux here, but thats a personal choice). One thing though, if you are plugging into an amp which runs the monitor speakers on stage, MAKE SURE YOU ONLY USE POST. Otherwise, you'll have turned the volume down on the mixer, and the sound you don't want will becoming out of the monitor. The general rule is that if you don't want it out of the main mix (FOH) you don't want it coming out of the on stage monitors.

Now thats a lot to take in, hopefully it all makes sense, if it doesn't re-read it, and if its still a load of old crap, ask me some questions and I'll do my best.

One thing to note is that the mixer I suggested also has the onboard FX by Behringer which will more than do you for your situation.

If you've got a pants PA, you don't want to run anything more than vocals. The Class-Ds speakers you were asking about the other day will not cut it for running an entire band through.

You need at least 1000w Top/Mids and another 1000w Bass/Subs to do all of the above. Our PA which is well over that only just cuts it to my standards, so be warned, you will get a much better sound if you play around with the bands Amps etc, and just run the Vocals through your PA, than if you try and run everything through PA system.

Good luck!

Glossary
FOH - "Front of House" - In terms of PA it means the PA the audience hear, not the foldback/monitor mixes.
D.I. - "Direct injection" - Basically means plugging your device (in my example a bass amp) straight into the mixer. Most of the time you would require a D.I Box which would convert your sound from Jack to XLR. however, most Bass Amps have a XLR out (which is already D.I boxed - if you like)
Phantom Power - This is 48v that is sent down the line to power condenser microphones (as they need electricity). The bad news is, if you turn on phantom power on your mixer, all the XLRs will become live, and you run the risk of FRYING all your microphones, so it's advisable to use a battery operated condenser in these situations. Bigger desks let you switch it on channel dependent.

[bluishbob]

hi again, thanks for all that....useful but to be honest i have done quite a few gigs with bands and am familiar with everything you said.

As you say for me recording is just a side line for a bit of fun. I probabily should have said i ment recording in a studio situation.

My real problem is how to get signal into audacity. I made a typo before...i do use a line in in the sound card. My problem is that if i do this i can only record one thing at a time....if i record more than one it will be only one track so i cant master it. ......so i will end up doint a take for guitar, bass, drum, vocals, backing, harmony etc etc..so i can master it later...it would take ages....... what i really need to know is how to get multiple inputs into a pc through a mixer.....(i wouldn't want to fork out for a 16track recorder) Thats why i suggested a usb mixer....i wondered if this would give me a seperate line on audacity for each channel on the mixer. ......do u understand me????

But thanks for the last post .....good to check that i am on the right lines with everything i am doing so far

[DMX Will]

No, You would require a multi-input sound card.

If your a in a studio enviroment, why did you say "live PA mixer", I'm slightly hacked off to say the least, considering I spent over half an hour answering your question, when you knew the answer!

[bluishbob]

NO No please dont. That was really useful because i was concerned about that too, what i ment was that i didn't want to shell out for a 16 track recorder....i was talking about recording from a pa mixer but not live....being able to have several takes.

I'm sorry if you feel like that but did find your post useful and i am sure many other people will also find it useful.

[DMX Will]

NO No please dont. That was really useful because i was concerned about that too, what i ment was that i didn't want to shell out for a 16 track recorder....i was talking about recording from a pa mixer but not live....being able to have several takes.

I'm sorry if you feel like that but did find your post useful and i am sure many other people will also find it useful.

At least your greatful, wasn't your fault. Enjoy.

[bluishbob]

Thanks ...its a few months away but ill let you know how i get on.

[Corabar Steve]

. ......do u understand me????


Shouldn't there be a Y & an O before that U?

As far as I'm aware the letter U is actually incapable of understanding anything, because it is actually a letter of the alphabet & as such has no brain & therefore is incapable of sentient thought.

[sleah]

Shouldn't there be a Y & an O before that U?

As far as I'm aware the letter U is actually incapable of understanding anything, because it is actually a letter of the alphabet & as such has no brain & therefore is incapable of sentient thought.
:lol: Steve, your handling of text speak gets better by the day :thumbs_up: