With great regret

[Excalibur]

After replying to a post in a civil, polite and reasoned manner, I was called a "cowboy" and " backstreet operator" simply because I don't have a piece of paper , which I ( and others) feel is a flawed system, rather than an " accepted standard". Having pointed out how I felt, again in a polite manner, I was told that I was not adhering to professional standards.

I thought that I had made some friends on here, and that it was a place to share views,opinions and information in a polite and reasonable manner. Since it appears I was wrong, I will have to follow the advice given to me, get on my horse and ride off into the sunset. Adios, Amigos.

[Tom]

no. dont go. :eek:

[BeerFunk]

I'm not sure who it was that called you a 'cowboy', I don't remember seeing (was the post deleted?). Either way, just ignore them, they obviously have their mind in single channel mode, and are clearly not viewing the situation from a rational perspective. No need to disappear!! :)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Sorry to hear that, but let's be honest this is a forum full of opinions that sometimes get a little heated and taken the wrong way.

Why people feel the need to leave because of the slightest thing is beyond me, and this does happen on a weekly basis.

This is a place to share views, opinions and information and if you want to lose that by leaving (which I hope you don't), then there's not a lot anyone can do about it.

[Excalibur]

I'm not sure who it was that called you a 'cowboy', I don't remember seeing (was the post deleted?). Either way, just ignore them, they obviously have their mind in single channel mode, and are clearly not viewing the situation from a rational perspective. No need to disappear!! :)

Post 27 , the now closed PAT thread.

[Penfold42]

I for one would think it a shame you leave Peter......i've only just got to know you........and you seem like you know a bit.
As Darren said it's only opinions......froget it.....go get a beer and sleep on it....:)

[Excalibur]

Sorry to hear that, but let's be honest this is a forum full of opinions that sometimes get a little heated and taken the wrong way.

Why people feel the need to leave because of the slightest thing is beyond me, and this does happen on a weekly basis.

This is a place to share views, opinions and information and if you want to lose that by leaving (which I hope you don't), then there's not a lot anyone can do about it.

I'm sorry , but being called a cowboy, backstreet operator, and unprofessional, simply because of a view, which I had tried to put up a valid, coherent, and reasoned argument for is not in my opinion, "the slightest thing". I cannot see how I might have taken any of the comments the wrong way, unless "Sorry pal" ( post52) has a full stop after it. Since it does not appear to have, then I take it to mean that since I do not follow the "accepted standard", then I am sub-standard.

[leighinstoke]

What piece of paper?

[Tom]

Sorry to hear that, but let's be honest this is a forum full of opinions that sometimes get a little heated and taken the wrong way.

Why people feel the need to leave because of the slightest thing is beyond me, and this does happen on a weekly basis.

This is a place to share views, opinions and information and if you want to lose that by leaving (which I hope you don't), then there's not a lot anyone can do about it.

example, felt like anything i said, darren had somthing else to say back at me but i took it with a pinch of salt and tryed to corrent myself (learn by my mistakes). im still here.

you dont need to go. you have helped loads of people on here and given tips and advice and everything. why leave anyway, all because of one person???

[DJWayne]

its a simple analogy

opinions are like :Censored: holes - everyobe has one but nobody wants to hear yours!!

I don't agree with some of the comments made in that thread as i havent agreed with comments in other threads on this and many other forums i am a member of or have moderated over the years. People will over react to forums as text can easily be misinterpreted , obviously not in this case as i have re-read the thread and think the comments made were a little harsh but thats what happens when people debate. Forums are a difficult balance trying to make your point without offending at least one person is almost impossible though some people manage to offend everyone.

Take it on the chin mate , I agreed with the point you made and don't agree with the comments made regarding professionalism but in a similar context chucking the towel in when it gets a little rough could also be seen as uncalled for :)

[Dragonfly]

I can genuinely understand why you were upset with the last line of post 27 having just re read it , this is a forum though and sometimes things do get heated please don't leave we need good pros with differing opinions on here to make it interesting and to make it function effectively.... we have all been on the recieving end at some point ,

some here are a little more diplomatic and sensitive than others , I hope we see you back here in the future . just need to move on and up .... there is soooooo many threads on here that i havent commented on not because i dont have an opinion .... but because its not a positive one thats just me mr positive lol , but fair play for standing your ground in an argument and saying what you think. i respect that.

[BeerFunk]

I'm not sure who it was that called you a 'cowboy', I don't remember seeing (was the post deleted?)

Post 27 , the now closed PAT thread.
Ah, just saw it, and let's just say it comes as no surprise as to who made the comment. Every now and again this member will over react and bite someone's head off for little or no apparent reason.

Forget about it, it's just one opinion, which doesn't concur with mine, and probably most others here :)

[soundtracker]

I stand by my previous statement - this forum was initiated to promote professional standards in the DJing industry. It is generally accepted that this involves having a level of PLI and to have your kit Portable appliance tested on a regular basis. It doesn't matter whether individuals agree or disagree with PA testing, at present its all that we have got. More and more venues and clients insist on it. Having PLI & having your kit tested doesn't stop you being a cowboy operator - not having them is frankly irresponsible. Why would anyone want to place an unnecessary obstacle in front of their ability to work?:bang:

[Dragonfly]

just before i have a thought is P.A.T and P.L.I a LEGAL requirement?

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

just before i have a thought is P.A.T and P.L.I a LEGAL requirement?

No, but that is not the issue really is it?

[DJWayne]

I stand by my previous statement - this forum was initiated to promote professional standards in the DJing industry. It is generally accepted that this involves having a level of PLI and to have your kit Portable appliance tested on a regular basis. It doesn't matter whether individuals agree or disagree with PA testing, at present its all that we have got. More and more venues and clients insist on it. Having PLI & having your kit tested doesn't stop you being a cowboy operator - not having them is frankly irresponsible. Why would anyone want to place an unnecessary obstacle in front of their ability to work?:bang:


Sorry at what point did you stop to ask if any of us who don't share your point of view actually have PAT certs??

The discussion point was whether we agreed with the testing procedure and the emphasis and credibilty some members here attach to it not about compliance

[Dragonfly]

The issue is someone has been called a cowboy and if they are not operating outside the confines of the legal system then tecnically I dont see how they are a cowboy , now the moral and ethical issues maybe different but I just feel that cowboy is too strong a word for someone who does not have somethingg that they are not legally bound to have.

just my opinion.

[Excalibur]

Why would anyone want to place an unnecessary obstacle in front of their ability to work?:bang:

One booking in thirty five years. I can live with that.

[Dragonfly]

I can understand why it is a good idea to have it and knowing my own luck i wouldnt be without it , just because you dont have it doesnt mean you will never need it ..... i know someone who has driven for 30 years never had insurance "so she says" and there is whispers that she doesnt even have a licence , now shes never needed it .... but .... its unbelievably irresponsible not to have such things. id hate to have a lead shake a wire loose in transit and burn down a five star hotel without something to say to the judge.

but at the moment it is choice and i just feel that whatever you wish to call someone for not having certain documentation cowboy is the wrong terminology.

[Thames Valley Discos]

only ever been asked for it once and i do a lot of Hotels too.

[Tom]

only ever been asked for it once and i do a lot of Hotels too.

thats not bad but does it depend on what type of hotel you doing it for???


years ago my dad did a disco at the ritz ( spelt right???) in london and didnt get asked even though its a very posh place

[Penfold42]

only ever been asked for it once and i do a lot of Hotels too.

What your Stetson or your PAT cert.......:sofa:

Only joking.....:zip:

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

but at the moment it is choice

I'm not so sure it is choice. The H&SE state that equipment must be regularly tested. What other way is there of showing that?

[Dragonfly]

as saidjust because you have never been asked for it doesnt mean you will never need it ..... but the fact is at the moment ..... its choice.

[DMX Will]

You need it legally if you're an employer of X amount of people....not sure if it counts off-business premises though. Also a legal thing to work in schools.

[Thames Valley Discos]

thats not bad but does it depend on what type of hotel you doing it for???


years ago my dad did a disco at the ritz ( spelt right???) in london and didnt get asked even though its a very posh place
Well put it this way, i'm not talking £50 a night hotels. Obviously i'm not going to name names.
I volunteer the information but hand on heart, even then to date only ever been asked to see it once.
But PAT and PLI £100 a year not a lot for my own piece of mind.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

as saidjust because you have never been asked for it doesnt mean you will never need it ..... but the fact is at the moment ..... its choice.

It is not choice to whether you get your gear regularly tested. As posted above, you must do that and PAT is one way of showing that you do.

[Dragonfly]

I'm not so sure it is choice. The H&SE state that equipment must be regularly tested. What other way is there of showing that?

thats why i asked if its a requirement? if it is then yes we should all have it and thats that , but as i understood it it is to the discretion of the individual if they get it or not ..... would it be said that you are illegally running a mobile disco if your gear is not tested ? thats all im trying to get to the bottom of ?

if you are then yes ok ill get my coat ......... if you arent and its just a recomendation or guideline then i feel the word "cowboy " is not the correct one to use.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Right, this isn't going to turn into a debate about PAT again. If anyone else has anything to say about the thread, then fine. If you don't, then please don't post about PAT, as they will be deleted.

Back on topic please.

[Thames Valley Discos]

Yes i do. After reading the " closed " thread. I would say that the comments made in 27# were out of order.
Come back sword of King Arthur

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Yes i do. After reading the " closed " thread. I would say that the comments made in 27# were out of order.

For the last time...

PAT is not a legal requirement.

Testing your gear regularly is a legal requirement according to the health and safety executive.

The only real recognised way to test your gear is PAT.

I'm not sure what you're on about Paul talking about comments made in post 27?

[Thames Valley Discos]

For the last time...

PAT is not a legal requirement.

Testing your gear regularly is a legal requirement according to the health and safety executive.

The only real recognised way to test your gear is PAT.

I'm not sure what you're on about Paul talking about comments made in post 27?

NOT from this thread, the " closed one":bang:

[Penfold42]

As i see it - it is a personal choice that the individuals makes.

But surly you as a responsible person would look after not only yourself but the public.....

As for cowboy...i'm not really sure where that fits here.........

I would call a cowboy a DJ who let people down.....who didn't take the clients interest to hart......:)

[Excalibur]

Right, this isn't going to turn into a debate about PAT again. If anyone else has anything to say about the thread, then fine. If you don't, then please don't post about PAT, as they will be deleted.

Back on topic please.
Firstly, thanks for your support, I will wear it always.

Darren:
I can see where you are coming from, and I accept that. There is obviously a wide range of opinions , and very little actually set in stone. Other than the fact that without " the ticket that dare not speak it's name" I am not a reputable operator. Come on Dobbin, this isn't the place for us.

[Thames Valley Discos]

Firstly, thanks for your support, I will wear it always.

Darren:
I can see where you are coming from, and I accept that. There is obviously a wide range of opinions , and very little actually set in stone. Other than the fact that without " the ticket that dare not speak it's name" I am not a reputable operator. Come on Dobbin, this isn't the place for us.
Stay, you have good humour!!!!!:beer1:

[rob1963]

Ah, just saw it, and let's just say it comes as no surprise as to who made the comment. Every now and again this member will over react and bite someone's head off for little or no apparent reason.

Forget about it, it's just one opinion, which doesn't concur with mine, and probably most others here :)

I completely agree.

I've also had rude and completely out of order comments made to ME by the same culprit, who ironically is also a moderator, (pity he can't moderate HIMSELF!) but I just ignore him now, as he isn't worth the time of day.

Excalibur...I hope you can do the same.

:)

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

OK, let's not turn this into a witch hunt please.

Moderators help us run this site for free and do the very best they can.

If you have a problem, then PM me please.

[PropellerHeadCase]

Brace yourself for a few PMs there, Darren :D

[BeerFunk]

I'm not going to PM as everything of concern has been posted publicly. If Darren (I assume only he and Angela are higher than all of the moderators) felt there was an issue, I'm sure he would take action, but for now I'd say we should let things lie and hope Peter stays.

[rob1963]

I'm not going to PM as everything of concern has been posted publicly. If Darren (I assume only he and Angela are higher than all of the moderators) felt there was an issue, I'm sure he would take action, but for now I'd say we should let things lie and hope Peter stays.

My thoughts exactly.

I've already given my opinion.

I have nothing further to say on the matter.

[Corabar Steve]

I'm not going to PM as everything of concern has been posted publicly. If Darren (I assume only he and Angela are higher than all of the moderators) felt there was an issue, I'm sure he would take action, but for now I'd say we should let things lie and hope Peter stays.


If you have been sanctioned:

a. Do not start arguments regarding the sanction. Actions of this nature may result in a more severe sanction being imposed.

b. If you are unclear about the reasons for a warning against you or the reasons for any ban, ask a moderator for further details.

c. If you feel you have been banned unfairly, you may appeal the decision by sending a message to the Site Admin.The above would also apply to any grievance you have with any member, even if they are a mod, admin or owner. If you have a problem with somebody, speak to a member of staff about it, it is not what the open forum is for.

[spin mobile disco]

Any one know what happened to my post on this? Was offering words of support and someone deleted it.

[Shaun]

Any one know what happened to my post on this? Was offering words of support and someone deleted it.

I've just had a look back at the deleted post. The post contained more talk of PAT, which was why it was removed.

The quote below should offer full explanation to it's removal.


Right, this isn't going to turn into a debate about PAT again. If anyone else has anything to say about the thread, then fine. If you don't, then please don't post about PAT, as they will be deleted.

Back on topic please.

[PropellerHeadCase]

I have nothing further to say on the matter.

But you'll post nevertheless ;) :P 3000+?

[spin mobile disco]

It wasnt a post just on PAT and my comments on pat were very small just think it was being a bit over zealous removing it for that.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

It wasnt a post just on PAT and my comments on pat were very small just think it was being a bit over zealous removing it for that.

Most of it was about PAT and I'd already said I'd delete any more posts about it.

[wensleydale]

ok, hypothetical thought- it seems that people grumble at eachother quite a lot here, and then many a situation gets blown out of all proportion, often when threads are locked or deleted.

i belong to a few other forums where this never happens- arguements are just left to run there course and people air their views.

would this not be a better way to sort things out as ultimately you are relying on 3 or 4 people to decide what is right or wrong?

i often think the people who end up being made out to be the guilty party have valid points, but just go about expressing their views the wrong way- as in this case with PAT.

Just a thought.......

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

ok, hypothetical thought- it seems that people grumble at eachother quite a lot here, and then many a situation gets blown out of all proportion, often when threads are locked or deleted.



Threads are locked for a reason - so that arguements don't get out of hand.

We don't lock many threads and don't moderate as heavily as other forums.

We like to keep things friendly and will continue to run this forum in the way that we see fit. If that means locking the odd thread, then fine, we will.

[wensleydale]

Threads are locked for a reason - so that arguements don't get out of hand.

We don't lock many threads and don't moderate as heavily as other forums.

We like to keep things friendly and will continue to run this forum in the way that we see fit. If that means locking the odd thread, then fine, we will.

thats my point though- other forums i belong to dont lock any threads- things just filter out.
people who talk rubbish just dissapear.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

thats my point though- other forums i belong to dont lock any threads- things just filter out.
people who talk rubbish just dissapear.

I dunno, there's still a fair few on here....;) :D

[Dragonfly]

personally think the forum is very well and fairly run as it is ..... one of the main reasons i joined.

i was on another forum not as tightly moderated (not saying this is too tightly run at all) and it decended into complete chaos ..... most members left and it led to 2 days when disgruntled members spent basically 2 solid days posting obscenities.

if things were left people like steve daz and danno are all busy guys and if they are out say thurs night fri night sat night ... this is more than enough time for a forum to disintergrate.... and why when none get a wage that i know of should they have to sift through 2000 posts to see if anyone has posted something they shouldnt on their sunday time.

personally think better to nip it in the bud before it gets personal and silly just my thoughts.

[Penfold42]

Threads are locked for a reason - so that arguements don't get out of hand.

We don't lock many threads and don't moderate as heavily as other forums.

We like to keep things friendly and will continue to run this forum in the way that we see fit. If that means locking the odd thread, then fine, we will.
:agree:


personally think the forum is very well and fairly run as it is ..... one of the main reasons i joined.

i was on another forum not as tightly moderated (not saying this is too tightly run at all) and it decended into complete chaos ..... most members left and it led to 2 days when disgruntled members spent basically 2 solid days posting obscenities.

if things were left people like steve daz and danno are all busy guys and if they are out say thurs night fri night sat night ... this is more than enough time for a forum to disintergrate.... and why when none get a wage that i know of should they have to sift through 2000 posts to see if anyone has posted something they shouldnt on their sunday time.

personally think better to nip it in the bud before it gets personal and silly just my thoughts.
:agree:
:clap: :clap:

thats my point though- other forums i belong to dont lock any threads- things just filter out.
people who talk rubbish just dissapear.
No they don't...............:D :D :D :D :D :D

I dunno, there's still a fair few on here....;) :D
:eek: :eek: :zip: