Indoor architectural lighting

[BrightLights]

I've got an opportunity to do some architectural lighting for a big Christmas party where I'm already booked to do the disco. Could anyone give me a rough idea how much would be reasonable to charge for lighting a function room, based on... ooh... say 20 PAR cans and a few effects (she specifically mentioned large flame lights, which I'm not keen on but you get the idea).

Cheers,
Steve

[Sam]

I've got an opportunity to do some architectural lighting for a big Christmas party where I'm already booked to do the disco. Could anyone give me a rough idea how much would be reasonable to charge for lighting a function room, based on... ooh... say 20 PAR cans and a few effects (she specifically mentioned large flame lights, which I'm not keen on but you get the idea).

Cheers,
Steve

i'm guessing you mean LED par cans?

I couldn't really suggest a price if I don't know things.. like whether you have the kit already... or if you don't whether your hiring or buying.. as i'm guessing for example if your buying a lot in.. you would want a fairly high price.. to help pay it off

Although LED uplighting services are normally around the 200 - 250 mark I believe

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Although LED uplighting services are normally around the 200 - 250 mark I believe

Wonder who told you that...:whistle:

And it does depend on the size of room and how many cans etc

[BrightLights]

i'm guessing you mean LED par cans?

I couldn't really suggest a price if I don't know things.. like whether you have the kit already... or if you don't whether your hiring or buying.. as i'm guessing for example if your buying a lot in.. you would want a fairly high price.. to help pay it off

Although LED uplighting services are normally around the 200 - 250 mark I believe

I probably do mean LED PAR cans, although I'm just looking around for ideas at this stage really, so anything goes. Certainly if I was to buy them, which is preferable if funds allow, then I'd want LED ones rather than filament.

I don't expect the cost to the customer to cover my cost of buying them, but it would be nice if it made it a bit less painful!

[BrightLights]

And it does depend on the size of room and how many cans etc

For the sake of argument say about 20 cans in this case. I'd need to give it some more thought before I commit, but this is just to get an idea if it's viable...

[Sam]

Wonder who told you that...:whistle:

And it does depend on the size of room and how many cans etc

I was passing on your great knowledge! :)


I would go with LED pars myself (well I am..)
There are two ends of the scale.. cheaper ones.. like PAR 56s from thomann which are about £40 each... (just got to of them from Darren! and love them.. will be getting a load more).. or things like the Eurolite cans which are about £70 each.. but have a higher output of about 30% I believe.

[BrightLights]

Yeah I've already got a couple of the Stairville ones and I'm very happy with them, so that's what I'm basing my sums on.

[Ricesnaps]

To be honest, I struggled over what to buy to do my service for ages. The PAR 56 versions seem a great buy, but I was adviced against them for this type of work over and over. I believe, while they do the job, the Eurolites use the 10mm LED's and have a much better light output for this type of work.

Almost twice the price, but I guessed it was an investment for me, so went with the better units.

Up to you, but having used the Eurolite's in a few venues, I would be very worried not having them

[BrightLights]

Thanks Rice, interesting...

Have you compared the two units side by side at all? It seems like an awful lot more money, but I wouldn't want to invest in the wrong kit and end up regretting it (if I go for it at all...)

Do you mind if I ask what you charge for this sort of service?

[Skins]

Re: the flame lights buddy,

I`m just down the road from you, and as I`m planning on an easy xmas, (only plan to do a handful of gigs),your more than welcome to borrow my machines if they are not being used...

I can have em sent by my local courier (they are well cheap to use, cheaper than petrol money up to you)

or you can meet me halfway or collect from Reading

seems silly to buy or hire if I aint using mine,,,

drop me a line, always happy to help..

Shaun

[Sam]

To be honest, I struggled over what to buy to do my service for ages. The PAR 56 versions seem a great buy, but I was adviced against them for this type of work over and over. I believe, while they do the job, the Eurolites use the 10mm LED's and have a much better light output for this type of work.

Almost twice the price, but I guessed it was an investment for me, so went with the better units.

Up to you, but having used the Eurolite's in a few venues, I would be very worried not having them


hmm although the 56s will do the job ok.. more scope with the eurolites though.. you could always start with 56s.. and then upgrade to the eurolites in the future when you have lots of bookings for this service

[BrightLights]

Re: the flame lights buddy,

I`m just down the road from you, and as I`m planning on an easy xmas, (only plan to do a handful of gigs),your more than welcome to borrow my machines if they are not being used...

I can have em sent by my local courier (they are well cheap to use, cheaper than petrol money up to you)

or you can meet me halfway or collect from Reading

seems silly to buy or hire if I aint using mine,,,

drop me a line, always happy to help..

Shaun

Hi Shaun,

That's very kind of you - I'll bear it in mind!

Thanks,
Steve

[Ricesnaps]

Thanks Rice, interesting...

Have you compared the two units side by side at all? It seems like an awful lot more money, but I wouldn't want to invest in the wrong kit and end up regretting it (if I go for it at all...)

Do you mind if I ask what you charge for this sort of service?

I discussed at length with a guy I know who already offers this service and did consider for a while buying the cheaper unit. I haven't seen the side by side and some may tell you that the cheaper versions will be fine. I just went with the advice given by someone using them!

I am very very very pleased with my Eurolites

As for price, this is one of those times where the client is absolutely paying for the kit. I generally base my prices on the number of units needed, this usually means a charge of £200 - £350 depending on the size of the room. However I also offer one wall wash for those on a tighter budget. If you're using the Eurolites, you'll need to space them out at about 3m gaps - that should help you work out your pricing

[rob1963]

As for price, this is one of those times where the client is absolutely paying for the kit.

:jawdrop:

[Sam]

I discussed at length with a guy I know who already offers this service and did consider for a while buying the cheaper unit. I haven't seen the side by side and some may tell you that the cheaper versions will be fine. I just went with the advice given by someone using them!

I am very very very pleased with my Eurolites

As for price, this is one of those times where the client is absolutely paying for the kit. I generally base my prices on the number of units needed, this usually means a charge of £200 - £350 depending on the size of the room. However I also offer one wall wash for those on a tighter budget. If you're using the Eurolites, you'll need to space them out at about 3m gaps - that should help you work out your pricing

they could just buy a few themselves :p
Are anyone actually paying those prices though? I thought you said you only had four of the units at the moment..

[Corabar Steve]

they could just a few themselves :p

Did you miss something out here Sam?

[Sam]

Did you miss something out here Sam?

i did indeed,
thanks for pointing it out

[Corabar Steve]

they could just buy a few themselves :p.

But we'd rather they didn't. What's next iPods instead of DJs????

Oh, hang on......

[Sam]

well yes obviously!
I'm just not convinced someone would pay £350 for a uplighting service...
but it was also his wording that I was picking on.. as rob did..
As for price, this is one of those times where the client is absolutely paying for the kit.

[Paul James Promotions]

I'm just not convinced someone would pay £350 for a uplighting service...



They will, for upmarket events.

Definitely worth going for the brighter units.

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

They will, for upmarket events.

Definitely worth going for the brighter units.

That's why I've bought the 64s this time rather than the 56s. I saw them side by side and for uplighting the 64s are definately better.

[Ricesnaps]

well yes obviously!
I'm just not convinced someone would pay £350 for a uplighting service...
but it was also his wording that I was picking on.. as rob did..

Well... without giving away all my marketing tips, maybe you've hit the nail on the head, maybe a customer won't pay that much, but maybe a customer WILL pay a little more for a venue that has this effect in it!

I actually have two bookings for December and one for next year in the bag, so there are people who'll pay! And yes, I do currently only have 4 units, so there may be a fair bit of spending happening over the next two months!

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Well... without giving away all my marketing tips,

So it's OK to get loads of help and info from here then and not share is it? :rolleyes:

[Ricesnaps]

So it's OK to get loads of help and info from here then and not share is it? :rolleyes:

Grow up!

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Grow up!

Nothing to do with that. What I said is true. You are always getting info from others, and then you post something like that.

[Ricesnaps]

Mmmm and I give a huge amount BACK to the forum as well, don't forget that!

On this occasion, I would rather not allow my local competition know everything!

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

Mmmm and I give a huge amount BACK to the forum as well, don't forget that!



I see you asking a lot of questions and asking for advice a lot, yes.

Perhaps I've missed what you give back then.

[Ricesnaps]

I've got an opportunity to do some architectural lighting for a big Christmas party where I'm already booked to do the disco. Could anyone give me a rough idea how much would be reasonable to charge for lighting a function room, based on... ooh... say 20 PAR cans and a few effects (she specifically mentioned large flame lights, which I'm not keen on but you get the idea).

Cheers,
Steve


Steve,

Feel free to PM me or send me an email direct if you'd like any more help

[Sam]

Well... without giving away all my marketing tips, maybe you've hit the nail on the head, maybe a customer won't pay that much, but maybe a customer WILL pay a little more for a venue that has this effect in it!

I actually have two bookings for December and one for next year in the bag, so there are people who'll pay! And yes, I do currently only have 4 units, so there may be a fair bit of spending happening over the next two months!

My personal opinion (and not a critiscm) I feel that £350 is would be a bit too high..
You can hire LED parcans in from £8 - £10 pounds depending on where you look.. so without considering cabling and that jazz.. they could get 35 for £10 each or 43 at £8 each..
I know it is a service where you set it up etc.. but I still think that may be pushing the limit??

Would be ineterested to see how much your future clients do end up paying though!

[Corabar Steve]

Steve,

Feel free to PM me or send me an email direct if you'd like any more help

Something wrong with doing it on the forum then?

That's what it's here for after all.

[Sam]

Something wrong with doing it on the forum then?

That's what it's here for after all.

it is a bit frustrating when people do that..

[Ricesnaps]

Right them,

I have five minutes to help make sense of this, rather than a few scrappy missunderstood post.

Steve, this so NOT aimed at you and the previous post were absolutely not thrown in your direction. I am not feeling great, haven't been all week, I have SO much to do at home ready for our new arrival and I have achieved so little - very frustrated already.

There is a line that sometimes you don't want to or are not ready to cross. It is one thing to openly discuss which light does what best - in fact I think you'll see me make a clear argument for the Eurolite version of these in this very thread. However, there are also times when the general advice may need to be a little more specific for the person asking the question, yet the answer is maybe not something you would want to post publically. Let me give an example - might be one thing to ask what lights to use for weddings, but complete another to ask which hotels you should aproach and how much you should pitch. Daz, if I was to ask you to give me details of your top 5 hotels in your area and how much you charged them and for what, would you pop that up in a thread? Probably not. Equally, with the venue lighting we're talking about here, I maybe don't want everyone to know exactly how I am planning to achieve that around here. How great would that be. Matt out of the kindness off his own heart decides to post full details of the best way to aproach the whole concept, how best to get work and so on, only to discuver next week that my main competition have aproached all my local potential clients and got in first.

That's possibly why off forum is a better way. This information may well be very useful to someone 200 miles away from me and would actually do no harm to my own business, but posting the same information publically possibly could. I hate my day job and as most of you know I want out. To get out I need to develope the business, not hand it to others on a plate.

I am of course more than happy to offer as much help and support as I can to anyone who wants it, but please respect my right to do that privately from time to time.

The venue lighting I am currently in the process of setting up is something that another DJ showed me, something I was given some personal one to one advice and support to do (not someone in my area). It would I believe also be wrong of me to make all of that information (which indeed most of my service has been taken from) public when it was something offered personally to me at the time.

So any advice will be freely given, but at time may be done privately

[BrightLights]

I discussed at length with a guy I know who already offers this service and did consider for a while buying the cheaper unit. I haven't seen the side by side and some may tell you that the cheaper versions will be fine. I just went with the advice given by someone using them!

I am very very very pleased with my Eurolites

As for price, this is one of those times where the client is absolutely paying for the kit. I generally base my prices on the number of units needed, this usually means a charge of £200 - £350 depending on the size of the room. However I also offer one wall wash for those on a tighter budget. If you're using the Eurolites, you'll need to space them out at about 3m gaps - that should help you work out your pricing

Thanks for that Rice, excellent info. How far apart to space them was going to be my next question - you're obviously a mind reader!

Thanks,
Steve

[Corabar Steve]

Sorry Matt, but that still seems very one sided to me.

[Ricesnaps]

Sorry Matt, but that still seems very one sided to me.

You are welcome to your opinion.

[Corabar Steve]

Thank you.

[rob1963]

Come on guys...let's see you kiss & make up! :D

[BrightLights]

It seems to me that Matt's already been more than helpful on the forum, and he's only talking about using private messaging to discuss the more sensitive details that could potentially do his business harm if discussed in public. Seems perfectly reasonable to me. After all, he doesn't have to help me out at all - just because I asked the question doesn't mean he has to share, and certainly doesn't mean he should feel under pressure to do so in public.

I don't really see what all the fuss is about!

Thanks for your help Matt.

Steve

[Solitaire Events Ltd]

No, it doesn't mean that Matt has to share, but then nor does anyone else.

And when that happens, the forum will close and everyone will be happy.

[BrightLights]

Moving on...

I think I'll go back to the venue, get some proper measurements so I can work out accurately how many I'd need, and take it from there. Of course they might not even go for it once I give them a quote.

Since this is a fairly large venue I think I might not be able to justify the expense of the Eurolights (much as I'd prefer the better units). I'll probably end up with quite a lot so in smaller venues I might be able to double up i.e. put two cans at each point. Would that work? I'm not looking for these to be the main source of illumination in the room - just a nice effect on the walls.

[Paul James Promotions]

The issue you will have is the amount of ambient light in the room. If very dark, you would get away with the cheaper units. However, as the main idea of the service is to give the 'wow' factor when people arrive, it needs to look spot on from the start. Room lighting level will usually be pretty high at the start of the evening.

Something to consider anyway.

Jamie

[BrightLights]

Fair point. Maybe I'll take the two Thomann units I've already got with me when I go back to the venue and see how they look. I remember it being relatively dark when I was last there, but that could have been the weather...

[Alex - Cream Ents]

I would suggest if you're quoting as a hire something along these lines:

LED Pars - £10 ea
Effects - circa 15 - 25 ea (depending on what they are - more for moving heads)
Controller - £30

Normally with a hire all cables will be included in the above costs...obviously if you're designing, setting up and running the show your time will be chargeable.

[Sam]

I would suggest if you're quoting as a hire something along these lines:

LED Pars - £10 ea
Effects - circa 15 - 25 ea (depending on what they are - more for moving heads)
Controller - £30

Normally with a hire all cables will be included in the above costs...obviously if you're designing, setting up and running the show your time will be chargeable.


we're talking about a wall uplighting service.. not dry hiring kit out..

[Corabar Entertainment]

we're talking about a wall uplighting service.. not dry hiring kit out..Erm...
I would suggest if you're quoting as a hire something along these lines:

LED Pars - £10 ea
Effects - circa 15 - 25 ea (depending on what they are - more for moving heads)
Controller - £30

Normally with a hire all cables will be included in the above costs...obviously if you're designing, setting up and running the show your time will be chargeable.

[Sam]

Erm...

sounds more like hes lighting a dance show than a couple of walls at a disco..

[Corabar Entertainment]

sounds more like hes lighting a dance show than a couple of walls at a disco..Feeling very caustic this evening, aren't we Mr Lashbrooke! :eek: ;)

[Sam]

urm.. yes? lol