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Thread: Prime 2 or 4.....do I or don't I?

  1. #11

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    I've had my VMS5 since the day it came out and have used it one over 400 gigs, not one part of it has worn out, aside from a slightly looser crossfader.
    www.retrodisco.co.uk Mobile Disco and 80s Night Specialists, Devon

  2. #12
    Dinosaur Excalibur's Avatar
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    Right folks, I shall have to admonish myself very severely for leading this topic astray, and remind folk that the idea of it is not the relative longevity of Denon vs ADJ, but whether young Wayne should purchase a Denon prime machine. Looks like this one could run and run, as there are convincing arguments for very many possible ways forward.


    Forward. Interesting word. I'm reminded that my fastest setup times were when I had Cortex playout units in cases. Give 'em power, plug the signal leads from the mixer into the PA, and you were ready to rock and roll. Progress, eh? I can undoubtedly see where Wayne is trying to go with this.
    Excalibur. Older than the average DJ.

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  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Retrodisco View Post
    I've had my VMS5 since the day it came out and have used it one over 400 gigs, not one part of it has worn out, aside from a slightly looser crossfader.
    Maybe I was unlucky then. I did forget to mention the awful, noisy mic preamps though

    Anyway, back in topic. Don't your money up the wall on a new controller

    Julian
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  4. #14
    Imagine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Excalibur View Post
    ...when I had Cortex playout units in cases. Give 'em power, plug the signal leads from the mixer into the PA, and you were ready to rock and roll. Progress, eh? I can undoubtedly see where Wayne is trying to go with this.
    Finally old chap - somebody that "gets" what I'm trying to do
    This investment (if I decide to give my local dealer a call on Monday morning) isn't about making money back....oh no! It's more about convenience and ease for myself.

    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Jules View Post
    Maybe I was unlucky then. I did forget to mention the awful, noisy mic preamps though

    Anyway, back in topic. Don't your money up the wall on a new controller

    Julian
    I remember my VMS well...built like a blimmin' brick outhouse and all was good until the USB port in the back fell out....major surgery time!

    The jury's still well and truly out on this one at the moment gents.

    It's really NOT going to make me any money and that's OK. It's more about saving time and effort on my behalf, plus a way of potentially getting around swapping out the current 12 year old MacBooks for newer and less flexible options (Windows isn't one of those options by the way!).

    It's certainly something to mull over for the next few days whilst I enjoy some time off from the current day-job . Currently playing with the Engine Prime software on the office Mac to see how I get on with things

    On another note, I got the MC7000 out for the first time in a year tonight just to have a play around (my heart really hasn't been in it for the duration of Covid I'm sad to say). I haven't lost any of the skills I had with mixing. It all came back like a duck to water!

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Imagine View Post
    Finally old chap - somebody that "gets" what I'm trying to do
    This investment (if I decide to give my local dealer a call on Monday morning) isn't about making money back....oh no! It's more about convenience and ease for myself.
    The point I was trying to make some number of posts ago was that you can get that convenience with any controller, the right case and a bit of imagination.

    I'd actually argue that you lose some of that convenience with the Prime 4 because it's such a big unit.

    On a different, but related note... Prime Go. I looked at one of these for the kids parties when they were first released, but came to the conclusion that I would still need power for the radio Mics anyway (and I'd still need a laptop to run DMX control for any gig that needed lighting) so the battery power was pointless. I also realised that I currently wouldn't trust a laptop or tablet to run on battery for a kids party and I certainly wouldn't for something as critical as ceremony music (and both my laptop and tablet have 7hr+ battery life). So why would I trust the Go?

    The answer? I probably wouldn't. So what's the point? I'd just be losing EQ on the Mics and compromising on the control interface?

    Going back to the rosy days of my Cortex... While it was convenient, it also randomly crashed every few gigs and it couldn't keep a beat if pitch lock was engaged.

    I'm sure the Denon is much, much better though

    Julian
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  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Jules View Post
    The point I was trying to make some number of posts ago was that you can get that convenience with any controller, the right case and a bit of imagination.

    I'd actually argue that you lose some of that convenience with the Prime 4 because it's such a big unit.
    I agree.

    I have the MC6000mk2. Flightcased up. Not too big a unit to carry around. The setting up of that and the laptop takes seconds because it's all prewired.

    Open up the case, unfold the laptop stand, put the laptop on it and plug in the Power, USB to the controller, and USB for the DMX and switch on. Literally takes seconds. I have another cable that has a 3.5mm jack on it and power for a second laptop that I place on the other side of the booth.

    The bit I can't get my head around with the Prime is the following:

    1: If you're using it laptopless, you need to get it out at home and transfer music across to it. I like just sitting on the sofa with my laptop updating music and creating any crates I need for each wedding. I'd hate to do that on the Prime.

    2: People claim that you're DJ'ing without a laptop - but instead of a 15" screen I can glance at, suddenly I need to start looking at a much smaller 10" screen that is no longer in my eye line as I interact with the dancefloor. Plus, loading a song is way more fiddly than just dragging a song into a player from a list using a mouse on Virtual DJ

    3: If a bride comes up with 20" left on a song and asks for the Marcarena next, I know within 5" I can type in 'Maca' and drag it to the player on Virtual DJ. I'm not so sure I could achieve that on Prime. To me, that decreases the quality of service I can provide my client.

    On a note about Windows/Mac... for DJ'ing (and life in general), I have only ever used Windows and never had an issue. I've always used an exclusively DJ only laptop. I bought a decent Windows laptop in 2015 that had a decent processor, RAM and Hard Drive, and it's still fulfilling my needs perfectly. Because I've not added any other programs to it, nor used it for internet browsing, it still runs exactly the same as it did when I purchased it. Plus that laptop operates on my least favourite operating system - Windows 8.1. But as I only use the operating system to literally open Virtual DJ and Freestyler DMX, it really doesn't matter what the operating system is because I barely have to interact with it. But I'd feel very comfortable with a Windows 10 laptop. There's some excellent refurbished ex-business laptops around at the 600 mark. For me, the main requirement these days is a decent build quality of the laptop itself, rather than what's inside it. A solid shell is essentially for something that gets carted around gigs.

    Personally, I'm not seeing the genuine return in terms of time saving when setting up. And with uncertainty ahead around the next 2 years as to just how much we'll be opening up, I'm avoiding any big investments a this stage.

  7. #17
    Disco Dude! DeckstarDeluxe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Jules View Post

    I'd actually argue that you lose some of that convenience with the Prime 4 because it's such a big unit.


    Julian
    Having watched someone DJ with one I have to admit while it looked the part, it isn't worth it's price tag for me. The size is also another consideration, particularly if you're used to using something like and MC6000 like myself.
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  8. #18
    Dinosaur Excalibur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    I agree.

    I have the MC6000mk2. Flightcased up. Not too big a unit to carry around. The setting up of that and the laptop takes seconds because it's all prewired.
    Been there......................................... I've built more cases than I care to remember. Some worked better than others.
    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    3: If a bride comes up with 20" left on a song and asks for the Marcarena next, I know within 5" I can type in 'Maca' and drag it to the player on Virtual DJ. I'm not so sure I could achieve that on Prime. To me, that decreases the quality of service I can provide my client.
    While I can see that being true, ( and thus impossible to argue against) I will once more reiterate that with a keyboard attached to a Cortex, I was doing that however many years ago, with a machine that only required mains power and a PA. My, but we were ahead of the game in those days.

    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    On a note about Windows/Mac... for DJ'ing (and life in general), I have only ever used Windows and never had an issue. I've always used an exclusively DJ only laptop. I bought a decent Windows laptop in 2015 that had a decent processor, RAM and Hard Drive, and it's still fulfilling my needs perfectly. Because I've not added any other programs to it, nor used it for internet browsing, it still runs exactly the same as it did when I purchased it.
    That policy aligns very closely with my own. I suspect that my backup laptop ( which was last used in anger in 2019) would still function impeccably if asked to do so. It's at least seven years old, not overly specced, but still viable. I may even treat both machines to replacement batteries before we go back to work.
    Quote Originally Posted by rth_discos View Post
    Personally, I'm not seeing the genuine return in terms of time saving when setting up. And with uncertainty ahead around the next 2 years as to just how much we'll be opening up, I'm avoiding any big investments at this stage.
    I think I'm going to declare you an honorary Yorkshireman. I however have splurged on a few alterations to my way of working which should offer something of a " modular" approach to my setup, aesthetic improvements, and a greater amount of service options.
    Excalibur. Older than the average DJ.

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  9. #19
    Jim - Scotland's Party DJ's Avatar
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    My policy is if it doesn't make me faster, lighter or richer I don't buy it - as cool a piece of gear as the Prime is, it's not going to do any of those.

  10. #20

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    I'm very much a fan of controllers. I've played with a prime 4 for an hour or so & honestly can't see any good argument for using one as a gigging mobile DJ. Sure there's the 'wizard of oz' factor you'll get when working with one (the less 'common or garden' equipment we use, the better IMHO) but still... Meh. Spend your money on something else if it's really burning a hole in your pocket.

    My mc6000 isn't broke, and has only dropped the ball once - and even that time it was the fault of an overused 4-way extension lead (just a shame it had to happen half way through a first dance).

    I've pondered upgrading to a physically bigger controller with more buttons a few times but it wouldn't bring any new features OF USE for the majority of my gigs. VDJs newest feature - stems - was worth updating to Windows 10 for though. I've been hammering that to bits in my practice sessions at home during this lockdown (as well as making shedloads of my own edits).

    Ask yourself if what the prime gives you is really worth the money. You'll still need a laptop or SOMETHING as backup though, for when the prime eventually locks up or crashes at the most inopportune time. That, and you really need a computer of some sort to help organise the music database on the machine anyway.

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